Well, that's it for Australians buying goods from overseas

MattKing · May 31, 2018

skysh4rk said:
The USA and Eritrea are the only two countries in the world that collect tax based on citizenship rather than residency, so some governments are greedier than others.

In addition, the US will seek to enforce penalties and interest claims against people who have no connection whatsoever with the US other than the fact that due to their parent's having been US citizens at one time, they have the right to claim US citizenship.
How would you like to be a Canadian citizen born and always living in Canada and having filed income tax on income earned in Canada for all your decades of tax paying life, only to be presented with tax enforcement penalties for failing to file tax returns (almost always with no tax actually payable) each year with the US as well, all because your father held US citizenship for a while, thus entitling you to seek US citizenship?
It is retrospective application of illogical and unfair standards, based on the utmost of arrogance - that because one might decide to become a US citizen, one is "priviledged" and should be required to fulfill all the obligations of those who accept the advantages of such citizenship.

BrianShaw · May 31, 2018

Loopholes... we love them when they work for us and hate it when their plugged. Unfortunately those who plug our loopholes sometimes are in the position to save or create the ones that work for them. Dang...

Ozxplorer · May 31, 2018

Well, this is how it is supposed to work... https://www.ato.gov.au/business/international-tax-for-business/gst-on-low-value-imported-goods/ from the Australian point of view - the result? A giraffe being the horse designed by a government agency committee! From my perspective, it will be a lot more straight forward to order >A$1,000 landed cost excluding transport & pay the GST tax upon arrival of the goods in Australia. The real issue is trying to ensure the order is shipped complete - no back orders which then bring the value being shipped below the A$1,000 threshold. Already, some of the chemical handling shipping restrictions imposed by supply countries make the order compilation somewhat more difficult so I choose not to compIicate matters any further!

hoffy · May 31, 2018

Two23 said:
There are services in the U.S. where you get a U.S. address, order what you want, send it there, and they then ship it to you.

Kent in SD

Here's the clincher.

The new laws require the drop mailer to collect and pay the GST.....

Carriage · May 31, 2018

The other annoying thing is that this is all from local stores complaining about the 10% making them uncompetitive. The price difference is usually much greater than 10% and so for any overseas retailer willing to do the work, it won't actually change shopping habits as much as expected.

sabredog · May 31, 2018

Carriage said:
The other annoying thing is that this is all from local stores complaining about the 10% making them uncompetitive. The price difference is usually much greater than 10% and so for any overseas retailer willing to do the work, it won't actually change shopping habits as much as expected.

I can name one prominent very wealthy brick and mortar chain store owner with zero understanding or appreciation of online shopping who pushed for this tightening of GST to the point of hysteria.

hoffy · May 31, 2018

Don't worry, Gerry Harvey has already been mentioned.

The ironic thing is he made it big by buying in cheaply produced products from overseas, which ultimately put an end to manufacturing of white goods in Australia.

sabredog · May 31, 2018

hoffy said:
Don't worry, Gerry Harvey has already been mentioned.

The ironic thing is he made it big by buying in cheaply produced products from overseas, which ultimately put an end to manufacturing of white goods in Australia.

That and the increasing cost of labour, which all First world countries suffer from. I find his products way overpriced.

But yes he sold heaps of imported stuff, yet roundly condemns purely estore owners like Ruslan Kogan

Alan Edward Klein · May 31, 2018

BrianShaw said:
For us it was a single line on our tax return: “how much stuff did you buy and didn’t pay CA sales tax but now want to pay voluntarily”. Very practical and a low-cost appproach but I don’t know anyone who answered that question honestly... or like me I just didn’t have the supporting records didn’t feel that guessing was in the spirit of the tax code.

New York State allows you to calculate that amount based on total income if you don't know what you actually bought or have receipts. Of course I don't know anyone who actual computes it.
=====================
Sales and use tax chart on annual income taxes due to NY State.
You may use this chart for purchases of items or services costing less than $1,000 each (excluding shipping and handling). You may not use this chart for purchases related to a business, rental real estate, or royalty activities, regardless of the amount. If you maintained a permanent place of abode in New York State for sales and use tax purposes for only part of the year, multiply the tax amount from the chart by the number of months you maintained the permanent place of abode in New York State and divide the result by 12. (Count any period you maintained the abode for more than one-half month as one month.)
If your federal adjusted gross income (line 19) is: Enter on line 59: up to $15,000* ............................................ $ 11
$ 15,001 - $ 30,000 ................................. 22
30,001 - 50,000 ................................. 37
50,001 - 75,000 ................................. 56
75,001 - 100,000 ................................. 74
100,001 - 150,000 ................................. 97
150,001 - 200,000 ................................. 114
200,001 and greater ................................. .058% (.00058) of income, or $250, whichever amount is smaller * This may be any amount up to $15,000, including 0 or a negative amount.

Alan Edward Klein · May 31, 2018

hoffy said:
Well, good news for now. Someone on a Facebook group asked B&H if they were going to stop shipping - they have come back and said, not in the foreseeable future. Never say never, but that does seem good.

Did B&H say they would collect and pay the tax back to Australia?

hoffy · May 31, 2018

Alan Edward Klein said:
Did B&H say they would collect and pay the tax back to Australia?

Not in the communications that I saw. All they said is they will continue to ship to Australia for now.

As I said before, B&H have been really good with selling to Australians. We complained about shipping, they sought out and found better deals. They even print catalogues locally and distribute them (not that I want a B&H printed catalogue!)

Alan Edward Klein · May 31, 2018

BrianShaw said:
I don’t understand what 45 or national retaliation has to do with the discussion. Australia wants their citizens to pay tax on stuff bought abroad. They think foreign retailers will act as their agents. California did that for out-of-state purchases because we weren’t voluntary reporting those purchases and paying the tax we owe. I don’t know what prior tax laws are on the books for our friends down under. US retailers either will act as a tax agent for the Australia government or they won’t. I doubt that any retaliatory measures are even being contemplated, by anyone but you. I feel for the Australians but...

Maybe I don't understand the Australia tax. Is the 10% being added to all stuff sold in Australia like a sales tax. Or is it just an additional 10% added to imports for similar products sold and made in Australia?

Alan Edward Klein · May 31, 2018

hoffy said:
Not in the communications that I saw. All they said is they will continue to ship to Australia for now.

As I said before, B&H have been really good with selling to Australians. We complained about shipping, they sought out and found better deals. They even print catalogues locally and distribute them (not that I want a B&H printed catalogue!)

It seems B&H will collect and pay Australia. But you could contact them directly.
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/HelpCenter/International.jsp#dutiesTaxes

Sirius Glass · Jun 1, 2018

If you worked in New York, even as a non resident, and there is a retirement, New York will come after you for state income tax on that retirement. It is their way of getting at people who retired and moved to Florida. California like New York asks one to declare items purchased out of state, including out of the country, so that they can collect sales tax on it. Obviously almost no one volunteers that information.

Alan Edward Klein · Jun 1, 2018

Sirius Glass said:
If you worked in New York, even as a non resident, and there is a retirement, New York will come after you for state income tax on that retirement. It is their way of getting at people who retired and moved to Florida. California like New York asks one to declare items purchased out of state, including out of the country, so that they can collect sales tax on it. Obviously almost no one volunteers that information.

Not true. I worked all my life in NYS and retired to New Jersey. I only pay New Jersey state tax as I'm no longer a resident of New York. Now if you're a person who lives part time in both NY and another state like many people who stay in FLoirida over the winter, NY will come after you but that's because you're a part time NY resident. You may even be considered a full time resident even though you spend months in FLorida and even can own a home there. They might consider it a vacation home. In New Jersey they check things like what state you vote in, what state your cars are registered; etc. to make a determination if you're still a NJ resident. They're not stupid.

If you leave permanently, however, there is no NY state income tax. However, there is always a sales tax on items you purchase in NYS whether you live there or visit or you're an American or foreigner visiting unless the item is shipped out-of-state. Then no NY sales tax is applied but you could get charged sales tax of the state your item is being shipped especially if the company has a physical presence in that state like a store.

sabredog · Jun 1, 2018

Alan Edward Klein said:
Maybe I don't understand the Australia tax. Is the 10% being added to all stuff sold in Australia like a sales tax. Or is it just an additional 10% added to imports for similar products sold and made in Australia?

Australia has a Goods and Services tax (GST) which is payable on everything except fresh foodstuffs and similar in application to the the UK VAT tax and when created in the in nineties it replaced a whole swathe of differing wholesale taxes. Up until recently import taxes were only applied to goods with a purchase vale of over $1000, while purchased items under that $1000 attracted no additional taxation.

After a multi year campaign spearheaded by very wealthy brick and mortar store business owners determined to hold monopolies and failing utterly to understand that even if the 10% GST increase per item was applied, the item would still be far cheaper than buying locally. So the GST was broadened to close that taxation loophole off despite the inherent (impossible really) task of collecting that tax. Amazon's announcement that rather bother with this complication it was far easier to simply geoblock Australia. I agree with others that it may be the thin edge of the wedge. I do note however that eBay has confirmed it is business as usual.

Poisson Du Jour · Jun 1, 2018

Alan Edward Klein said:
Maybe I don't understand the Australia tax. Is the 10% being added to all stuff sold in Australia like a sales tax. Or is it just an additional 10% added to imports for similar products sold and made in Australia?

"the 10% being added to all stuff sold in Australia like a sales tax."
Yes, at both online and street retail stores.

"Or is it just an additional 10% added to imports for similar products sold and made in Australia?"
Goods bought overseas valued at less than AUD$1,000 will be subject to +10% GST. At the moment e.g. 1st June, goods below the AUD$1,000 threshold are GST-free.

Alan Edward Klein · Jun 1, 2018

OK I was wrong. It's a sales tax not a tariff. Trump shouldn't get involved. Plus, he hates Jeff Bezos the CEO of Amazon and owner of the Washington Post who castigates Trump all the time. So Trump wouldn't lift a finger to help him in any case.

Curious. How did Amazon handle the taxes before on items over AUD$1000?

Also, my guess is Amazon wants to build up their Australian internet service so this was a good time to pull the plug on their international website in Australia. It would eliminate their competing with themselves.

Poisson Du Jour · Jun 1, 2018

Alan Edward Klein said:
Curious. How did Amazon handle the taxes before on items over AUD$1000?

Trump!? Involved in Australian affairs!? Pour 'nother covfefe...
I have no idea on that one; I'm very risk-averse to offloading $1,000 on overseas purchases, preferring local retailers!
The most I have spent at amazon.com is $466, just for one 82mm B+W KSM circular polariser a few years back.
I assume that something valued over $1,000 would have GST applied by amazon.com prior to despatch (?). Or the same goods are entrapped by Customs in Melbourne for processing, thence you/me are then summoned yonder to sign-off the paperwork and pay the GST. I don't really know.

Like so many others, I don't give much attention to the Australian amazon.com store — there isn't much in there of interest to me. But of PRIME ... that might be another thing altogether.

Carriage · Jun 1, 2018

If it's over $1000, it's held up at customs but the delivery company can handle it. I once ordered a couple of lenses from KEH that were on sale so the total even with postage was sub $1000 but they marked the box with the full value which was just over. I got a call from FedEx asking for the import duty+GST to release the goods. Once I sent them the invoice of what I actually paid, they were released without further cost.

Also, as a bit of an explanation of how much cheaper things can be online, I ordered 20 rolls of 35mm HP5+ and 2 rolls of ultramax for 168.59AUD shipped to my door from B&H. If I bought that at one of the local camera stores, I'd be looking at 280AUD for the HP5+ alone, I'd have to go get it and it's been stripped from a foil sealed 50 roll pack to get costs down. So for sure, I would still make the decision to pay $185 instead of $280 if I didn't need it right now. It does raise tax income though which is not necessarily a bad thing.

Another example is a novel I bought recently. $10.57 from book depository, $16.99 from a generally reasonably priced local retailer. Even with an extra 10% tacked on, it's still less than 70% of the price. Also, I've heard that bicycle parts can be bought online cheaper than the wholesale price for local stores.

The other thing to be aware of is that the online shopping boom happened when the AUD was around parity with the USD. It's currently buying around 0.75USD.

guangong · Jun 1, 2018

At one time, under the regime of Mario Cuomo ( North Korea isn’t only country with dynastic rule) , New Yor state had NY State Police detectives photographing New York license plates on cars parked at New Jersey malls so that NY state tax department could pursue car owners for tax evasion.
Some of us are stuck in NJ, but why anyone would voluntarily move from NY to NJ to retire is beyond me. Some one remarked that Illinois has the most corrupt government among the 50 states, but one wag quipped that Illinois politicians go to Trenton for post graduate study.

BrianShaw · Jun 1, 2018

Poisson Du Jour said:
Pour 'nother covfefe...

TOUCHÉ

Helios 1984 · Jun 1, 2018

MattKing said:
In addition, the US will seek to enforce penalties and interest claims against people who have no connection whatsoever with the US other than the fact that due to their parent's having been US citizens at one time, they have the right to claim US citizenship.
How would you like to be a Canadian citizen born and always living in Canada and having filed income tax on income earned in Canada for all your decades of tax paying life, only to be presented with tax enforcement penalties for failing to file tax returns (almost always with no tax actually payable) each year with the US as well, all because your father held US citizenship for a while, thus entitling you to seek US citizenship?
It is retrospective application of illogical and unfair standards, based on the utmost of arrogance - that because one might decide to become a US citizen, one is "priviledged" and should be required to fulfill all the obligations of those who accept the advantages of such citizenship.

Arrogance is an understatement. *facepalm

Ces1um · Jun 1, 2018

Australia is charging GST on any foreign purchases. Don't say that too loudly or Canada will end up doing the same thing! Luckily for us amazon.ca has everything amazon.com does....for the most part.

AgX · Jun 1, 2018

I do not understand at all your upheaval abaut that taxation.

At one hand there is a lot of whining about local camera stores closing, with all their expenses. The same time there is now great happiness about those retailers not collecting taxes, as some importers or in the USA mail-order firms.

Well, that's it for Australians buying goods from overseas

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