Weird things on my film/hasselblad problem or bad development?

michaelsalomon · Aug 19, 2006

Im at wits end here. Im not sure what the problem is or what I coulbe be doing wrong. This is an example of a tri-x 320 negative developed in hc110. I think one problem may be with my hassy shutter not opening all the way (see how the top and bottom of the neg are less dense) but besides that, the neg looks totally uneven all over the place. I almost always get even development, but seem to see this problem crop up with faster shutter speeds and shots like the one posted with alot of open sky filling the frame. I have intentionally increased the contrast of the scan so you can see what im talking about. Shot was taken in 100+ degree heat of vegas, film also passed through security x-rays at the airport (not with my checked baggage, with my carry on)

Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions!

JHannon · Aug 19, 2006

Hi Michael. Did you use a manual tank or Jobo to develop? And what dilution of HC110 did you use. I am wondering if this is a lack of agitation, especially using more dilute developers.

I had some similar problems with Tri-X when I took some photos of a white card for testing. It was splotchy and uneven and I wound up increasing my agitation (Manual tank) to constant for the first minute then 5 sec each 30 seconds.

I am just throwing out some ideas and I may be totaly wrong...

Markok765 · Aug 19, 2006

Could be a light leak at the top of the back

glbeas · Aug 19, 2006

The dark area up top looks like a big air bubble trapped in the reels and the mark in the middle looks like a developer streak. A Hassy shutter being a leaf shutter would have an impossibly difficult time creating such artifacts. Do you presoak? If so it will sometimes do this with certain film developer combos especially if theres much time between the soak and develop. Also if your tank is slow to fill you might resort to prefilling and dropping the film in the tank in the dark for a more consistant result. It helps to have a spare tank for this.

Dan Henderson · Aug 19, 2006

Maybe its just me, but those artifacts look suspiciously like a street light and an imitation Eiffel Tower.

Seriously, I thought the same thing about the hassy leaf shutter, but how about the curtains at the back of the body? If they weren't getting out of the way fast enough, it seems that they could prevent enough exposure from reaching the top and bottom of the frame.

MikeK · Aug 19, 2006

michaelsalomon said:
Im at wits end here. Im not sure what the problem is or what I coulbe be doing wrong. This is an example of a tri-x 320 negative developed in hc110. I think one problem may be with my hassy shutter not opening all the way (see how the top and bottom of the neg are less dense) but besides that, the neg looks totally uneven all over the place. I almost always get even development, but seem to see this problem crop up with faster shutter speeds and shots like the one posted with alot of open sky filling the frame. I have intentionally increased the contrast of the scan so you can see what im talking about. Shot was taken in 100+ degree heat of vegas, film also passed through security x-rays at the airport (not with my checked baggage, with my carry on)

Thanks in advance for any help or suggestions!

Looks like a combination of uneven development + maybe not enough developer to completely cover the film.

Mike

rjas · Aug 19, 2006

Markok765 said:
Could be a light leak at the top of the back

i think this is the most unlikely thing. if it was a light leak it would be white on the print

michaelsalomon · Aug 19, 2006

I mistakenly said the shutter could be causing some problems, i meant to say the rear curtains. I use a manual tank, stainless steel reels. I use the dilution h, half of dilution b and agitiate for the first 30 seconds, then 5 seconds every 30 seconds.

glbeas, what is a developer streaks and how can I avoid em'?

JosBurke · Aug 19, 2006

Looks exactly like some of my errors in my limited experience and that was not enough developer in the tank in my case but looked just like that !!
I now presoak and use a tad more than the minimal amt needed---my wife said I was stingy and this is not the place for that !!

Ed Sukach · Aug 20, 2006

You didn't specify the Hasseblad model. Assuming it is one of the ones employing leaf shutters, you can test the effect of the rear "baffles" and mirror mechanism by depressing (upward) the "Mirror Release" located immediately below the film advance knob, before tripping the shutter. That will eliminate all "timing" errors, and leave nothing in the path but the shutter.

Is there any noticeable "play" between the magazine and camera body?

glbeas · Aug 20, 2006

michaelsalomon said:
I mistakenly said the shutter could be causing some problems, i meant to say the rear curtains. I use a manual tank, stainless steel reels. I use the dilution h, half of dilution b and agitiate for the first 30 seconds, then 5 seconds every 30 seconds.

glbeas, what is a developer streaks and how can I avoid em'?

Streaks can be caused by uneven wetting of the film prior to development. Presoaking is usually the solution to this if done right. Delaying putting the developer in after dumping the presoak can allow the film to start drying, unevenly, and inhibit developer uptake by the film. I've also heard of some film and developer combos which for some odd reason doesn't work with a presoak. You can also cause problems with an active developer by not filling and emptying the tank smoothly and quickly, hence doing the prefill. This can be a problem with the bigger multireel metal tanks. The larger Paterson tanks seem to be pretty good about filling fast. Last but not least the stop or water rinse after development. The water rinse needs to be vigorous enough to displace the developer from the surface of the film quickly-get the water in fast and agitate well. The stop bath needs to be in and agitated without wasting time too. Hope this helps, and hopefully theres a few more tips floating around out there I don't know about.

michaelsalomon · Aug 20, 2006

Ed, the model is a 501c. I just checked and there does seem to be just a tad of play between the back and the camera body

John Koehrer · Aug 20, 2006

michael,
remove the back & check to see if the light trap vanes are opening completely.
You will have to hold the shutter release in order to take a look since they close when you release the button. It doesn't matter if the lens is mounted or not.
When I worked on these we usually tightened them up rather than replacing them. They're held on the shaft by simple compression & can loosen up/rotate.

Bob Carnie · Aug 20, 2006

Micheal

This totally looks like uneven development. by looking at the image from the jpeg *small* you will see two wide minus development areas*or dark on screen* running down the middle of the image, These road ruts IMO are caused in the first 15 seconds of development. You say you are hand developing. Are the chemicals getting in fast enough and are you inverting and rotating the tank to evenly spread the developer?

But what perplexes me is the horizontal lines at the top and bottom *minus density* or dark on screen. I have never seen this type of distinct lines in conjunction with the road ruts running a different way.

I would really look at the first 15 seconds of development as the most critical stage of development. Specifically with large open areas of nuetral density*sky* and or grey back drops.

I would try shooting a full grey card filling the negative image space completely and measure the middle, edges and so forth.
Try one using the exact method you used for the shot you have posted, and then try one severly altering the first 15 seconds.
As well I would put on a polaroid back and see if the problems are there without going to the development stage.

This may be two problems , camera back as some point out, *horizontal lines top and bottom* and development * the road ruts running through the middle of the image in the opposite direction* .

Charles Webb · Aug 20, 2006

Don"t bother to check the camera and back, the problem is in the dark room!
Agitation or lack of is the problem!

Charlie............................

fhovie · Aug 20, 2006

agitation! - probably too vigerous. been there done that --- bought the t-shirt. some films just don't like a manly aggitation. My downfall was big tanks - 8 rolls of film and 3liters of developer- hard to aggitate without a lot of force in the soup swirling around. Now i am very very very gentle on aggitation in large tanks with a lot of fluid. Aggitation should be slow and gentle for many films. Tri-x can be shaken harshly but fp4+ is real sensitive to motion. It is very film sensitive. If your Hassy was the problem [my Hassy is often a problem] - it would be fog bands or a different orientation. Most Hassy problems are film back related in my experience - not what you have posted though!

Weird things on my film/hasselblad problem or bad development?

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