Water Marks on Negatives

[Kilgallb]

I am at my wits end here. Every roll of 35 mm I develop has water marks or some sort of white substance on the surface.

A soak in distiller water with a drop or two of Kodak Photo-Flo fixes it. but have I made the negatives susceptable to fungus?

I use the unicolour kit (Dev-Blix-Wash-Stabilizer). I mix the stabilizer in distilled water and add a small amount of Kodak Photo-Flo.

Strangely, when I develop my 4x5 Ektar I do not have this issue.

Any suggestions anyone.

 

[MattKing]

Can you dry the film at a 45 degree angle from vertical?

The stabilizer may already have its own surfactant in it.

Kodak stabilizer is quite cheap.

 

[mr rusty]

Here's what I do - works for me. I used to find water marks despite using wetting agent but only on the shiny side of the neg. Now I do a final rinse with wash aid in a spare tank with the negs off the reel, then I hang and "squirt down" with a squirty bottle filled with a wash aid mix to flush any possible specks, then I have a small lens cleaning cloth hanging on the neg hanger which I use to carefully pass down the shiny side only, spreading and absorbing the big drips that potentially cause the water marks. Seem to have this beaten now. However, It may be my problem in any case arose from the old Johnsons washaid I have been using (inherited from the pro-photog I bought all my kit from). Maybe fresh wash aid would also eliminate.

 

[pentaxuser]

As I understand it, if you have had to use photo-flo after stabiliser to remove the water marks then to be safe you should stabilise again.

pentaxuser

 

[Terry Christian]

Don't use Photo-Flo with C-41 film -- just stabilizer only after washing.

Photo-Flo is for B&W film.

 

[darkosaric]

A soak in distiller water

How long you keep the film in distiller water?

 

[mr rusty]

My Bad. I hadn't spotted the thread was about C41. My comments relate to B&W

 

[drmoss_ca]

Going back to the OP's question, I have had exactly the same experience with my current Unicolor kit. White streaks from the stabiliser necessitating a second wash in PhotoFlo. Since the stabiliser contains a wetting agent I thought I would be clever and add a few drops of PhotoFlo to it, but I still get the marks. I think I will continue to use PhotoFlo after the stabiliser.

Chris

 

[cliveh]

Don't use Photo-flow, just dunk and agitate in de-ionised water for about 30 seconds before drying. If you still get water marks, they only form on the shiny side of the neg. When dry, place the negative shiny side up on a clean surface and breathe on the shiny side as you would when misting up a mirror, then wipe with a clean lens cloth. This should do the trick.

 

[drmoss_ca]

How does PhotoFlo damage colour negatives? I assume it must and didn't know that until reading this thread.

Chris

 

[cliveh]

It doesn't damage them, but simply not necessary.

 

[drmoss_ca]

Thanks!

C.

 

[Xmas]

The final C41 chemical is or was a fungicide C41 does not have silver left to kill little guys.

It is simpler using a pukka film squeegee

 

[MattKing]

The final C41 chemical is or was a fungicide C41 does not have silver left to kill little guys.

It is simpler using a pukka film squeegee

Let me translate .

Standard black and white negatives aren't at all attractive to bacteria - the silver in them kills bacteria. And fungus doesn't grow easily on them either.

Colour negatives are different. Bacteria find them quite tasty, and fungus is comfortable on them too. So it is necessary to dunk those negatives into something - stabilizer - that will kill bacteria and discourage fungus. And then leave that stabilizer on there to dry.

If you wash/rinse after stabilizer, you may as well not have used stabilizer at all.

 

[LikeAPolaroid]

White substance left on film by the C41 process is caused by the stabilizer. Don't agitate. You can gently rotate the reel but don't agitate. Moreover: stabilizer already contains some kind of PhotoFlo so if you add more it will be in excess and causing even more marks on the film.
Do not wash the film after the stabilizer or you will vanish its effect.

 

[drmoss_ca]

Part of my problem might be that I have an old Kleen Dri film dryer, which works grand on B&W films. I think I shall have to simply hang the colour films and wait the two hours before scanning.

Chris

 

[georgegrosu]

Water Marks are formed due to excess water remained in some areas of the suport.
What recommend Kodak for machine processing.
http://motion.kodak.com/motion/uploadedFiles/h24_08.pdf
For manual processing.
Any way to remove excess of water (solution) on the surface of the film is good.
Even with wet hands can to remove water (solution) on the film.
Attention! It was not scratched the suport.


Fungus does not appear immediately on the processing film.
Gelatine from the film is one that favors the development of fungus in certain conditions (high humidity).
Gelatin is food for bacteria.

George

 

[drmoss_ca]

Thank you, this is very clear! I will reform my wicked ways.

Chris

 

[mklw1954]

I use the Unicolor kits and get great results. For the last three 1-liter kits (about 55 total rolls developed) I eliminated water drying marks by adding 1/2 teaspoon PhotoFlo concentrate to 1 liter of stabilizer, repeating after developing 10 rolls. I've always used distilled water to make up the stabilizer, as well as the developer and blix.

Interestingly, initially I got drying marks only on my 135 film, not any 120 film.