Warmtone Paper/Developer combinations

Hi everyine,
I'm new here and not sure if this topic has been talked about as yet. I'll keep looking though.

I'm looking at printing black & white warmtone images and amwondering what my best combination would be. I don't want to be formulating developers as I don't have a lot of time.

In terms of commercial availability I can get Ilford Harman warmtone and Agfa Neutol WA.

In regards to paper I have the option of eitherIlfrd warmtone or Kentmere VC select.
I'm going with RC papers becuse I don't have facilities or time to deal with fibre, plus i have never used fibre before.

Can anyone offer any suggestions? I don't think the Kentmere is actually a warmtone paper but have been told it is if it is developed in a warm tone developer.

Any suggestions would be more than welcomed.

Kentmere makes a warmtone paper but that's fibre-based. A quick look at their site should answer if they make that in RC, although Ilford does make its warmtone in FB and RC.

I found the Ilford warmtone developer works well with its matched paper -- giving a warmer tone than just regular MG developer.

Depending on your time constraints, you're best off trying it out as your personal visual taste or definition of 'best' is something no one else can really know. If you can set up two sets of trays in the darkroom and try them side by side it would likely be your best answer.

The most important thing is to start with a good warm tone paper. We are lucky that these are coming back into fashion. Ilford, Fotokemika, Foma, and Kentmere (and probably others) all make them. I find that Ilford Warmtone is just slightly warm and Foma is decidedly warm. I haven't used the Kentmere product, but the prints I've seen have been excellent. The next problem is the developer. Warm tone papers show more variability with different developers that cold tone papers. I've been using Ilford ID-72 (which I understand is related to the old Ilford Warmtone Developer) with good results. There are many warm tone developers out there, but they can be hard to find. Photogrphers' Formulary offers Formulary 106, TD-32, and D-52. I've found they are reliable and have high quality. Compounding your own from raw chemicals is probably the best way to go if you have a scale. You can use a regular developer, but the tone will not be as warm or as full as you get with warm tone developers. Many people like the results from warm tone paper developed in Ansco 130 developer, which is designed for neutral tones. Warm tone papers also react differently than cold tone papers with toners, but I don't have much experience in that area.

Agree, Foma is warmer and more responsive to toners than many others. Formulary makes an Amidol developer kit, which in my opinion gives most pleasing results with any papers, warm toned or otherwise. PITA to mix and it stains everything, but the blacks are unbeatable.

Formulary 106 mentioned above is less finicky, won't stain and you have some control over tone with dilution. Longer tray life than Amidol, you should be able to get a couple sessions out of it.

Ilford WT paper in Ilford WT dev only has a very subtle warmth in my opinion. Don't expect anything like a brown colour. Your idea of warm and mine might be very different of course. I'd point you in the direction of the APUG gallery as Les McLean posted a couple of examples of Ilford paper combinations some while ago but you aren't a subscriber so can't exercise that source of information.

What I'd describe as warm is Forte paper( now defunct). That did have a brown look although there was a hint of olive there. So if you've ever seen Forte WT paper then you'll have something to visualise and I can say that Ilford WT in Ilford WT developer is nowhere near as warm. I have heard good reports of Agfa dev as well in terms of warmth. It might produce a little more warmth with Ilford WT paper than Ilford WT developer but I don't know.

What you really need is someone who has used Ilford paper with both Agfa and Ilford WT developers. Hopefully such a person will respond. If all else fails in terms of information needed then buy a 1L container of each and print the same shot in both devs and compare.

Ilford dealers used to have a book of samples to demonstrate paper "looks". That might tell you something but a book of samples of Ilford paper in Agfa chems is likely to be impossible to find.

Finally if you feel you need extra warmth then experiment with higher temp and very dilute developer but be prepared to leave it in the dev for quite a long time.

Can anyone help here our newcomer with Ilford prints in both devs?

pentaxuser

I personally like and have used the Ilford RC warmtone paper. I find the warmth comes through very nicely after a few minutes in Kodak's selenium toner. I'm not picky about developers but Neutol WA was good when I could still get it locally. I've heard people say they like Oriental's WT paper as well...good luck!

Kathy

Just to chime in....use one developer since it has less effect than the paper. Agfa WA lasts a long time and is inexpensive so I use that. In regards to papers, I'd your choices are limited to Ilford and Foma in RC. I never found the Ilford warmtone RC to be all that warm. I haven't done much on Foma except lith abd in fiber base. Many papers react strongly to selenium toning to produce nice warm prints. Oriental and Kentmere are my favorites in fiber. Honestly, someone likes all these papers so any of them might appeal to you. Just choose one developer and get some selenium toner....the toner is really a must for reasonably warm prints.

Mark