Warm tone paper and developer

I know the right thing to do is to buy some of this stuff and try it myself but.... I would like to hear from people who has already tried this just to get some idea before I plunk down more $$$..... (geez this is an expensive hobby!)

I'm wanting to branch out from just using cold tone paper and regular paper developer to something little different. I'd like to try warm tone stuff. My favorite is Ilford paper so I guess that would be the Ilford MGIV WT. When I say "paper", I mean Ilford MGIV FB and my current developer is Dektol but warm tone dev will be Ilford.

Could someone please tell me what would happen if:
1) process regular cold tone paper in warm tone developer
2) process warm tone paper in cold tone developer
3) process warm tone paper in warm tone developer

and compare all that to cold tone paper processed in cold tone developer? How do they compare to each other? How would you rank the degree of "warmness?"

Just speaking on MGIV and MGWT: With MGIV you won't see much if any difference in tone between developers in an un-toned print. Developer comes into play more when it comes to toning. MGIV in a warmtone developer will appear slightly greenish. A cold tone developer will tame this greenish tint very slightly.

MGWT will respond to developers much more than MGIV. In a warmtone developer it is quite nice and when selenium toned will go nicely brownish-red if allowed to. Cold tone developers don't cool MGWT much, the only one I have found that will is Moersch SE6 Blue. It's amazing what that developer will do to MGWT. When selenium toned it almost looks like a neutral toned paper.

So overall, don't get too caught up in paper/developer combos. I use both MGIV/MGWT and two developers, a cold toned version of 130 with BZT added and LPD which I highly recommend to everyone.

Some of the warmest developers are Ilford's warmtone developer, Neutal WA, and ID-78. Not many cold tone commercial developers available, just Arista and Clayton's Ultra-cold tone and Edwal's Ultra-black. I've used the Ultra-cold developers and personally don't see the cold tone traits in them at all. I use Ansco 130 formula without the bromide and add benzotriazole instead which makes it a cold tone developer. It's very nice with MGIV and cools MGWT slightly.

I've always been too cheap to get MGWT, but I broke down and am now into my second box and I don't think I'll use another paper for conventional printing again. It is so easy to get what I want and it tones wonderfully in selenium, sepia and sepia/gold. I'm using Arista Legacy pro and it is great with MGWT. Most of my recent postings are on this paper.

Buy whatever paper you want to use and develope it in Ethol LPD. You can adjust the tone(cool/warm) with dilution of the developer. Diluting 1+1 gives cool tone, 1+4 warm, developing times do not change. These numbers are what I use, you will have to experiment to find what works for you. Now all you have to do is find a stash of Forte Elegance Warmtone paper and you're all set.

tkamiya - Brian's observations echo mine.

I also generally agree with Brian's comments. To my eye, there is not a huge difference between MGIV and MGWT, although a side by side comparison does show subtle variations, especially when used with neutral, warm, or cool tone developers.

I have been using the ID-78 formula that Ian Grant published here, adding KBr and shorter development when I want warm tones and benzotriazole and longer development for cool tones. This seems to enhance the warmth or coolness of the finished print, especially after toning in selenium. And it is more economical than stocking 3 different developers.

Choice of developer makes a huge difference with Warm tone papers as does exposure and development time, dilution, and temperature.

Another variable is the age of the paper, they tend to get colder with ageing particularly MGWT.

Ian

You might try Edwal's Platinum II.

In a darkroom workshop we had the students try a variety of developers with a wide variety of papers. The above developer was one of them. Diluted at 1:15 IlFord's cool tone paper even had a light tan color cast. Which was not expected, let alone what happened with a warm paper.

This developer as LPD can be used at various ratios to create "different" looks. At school we use LPD 1:4 as the standard,

Thanks everybody!

I'll have to give Warm Tone paper a try then. Things to try (and the expense!) never ends....

Ilford MGWT paper is very nice and worth trying. I use it with dektol and it's got a slight warm tone resulting. I use the RC version and find it very nice to use, easily the best RC paper I've used. The results look nice and it doesn't have much dry down changes, saving time and frustration.

I like the results such that I don't bother to tone it afterwards.

Warmtone

I have had great success using Arista EDU Ultra paper and Ethol LPD for a very nice warm tone that can be greatly enhanced with selenium. If you then dip the toned print into a weak ferri bath there is a fabulous range of tones available depending on amt of selenium toning done and strength/time in ferri. I have found that this paper also gives very neutral to coolish tones in ilford PQ developer with Benzotriozole insteade of potassium bromide and when briefly selenium toned(2min) the cooling is intensified. Have Fun