Viewmaster Camera & Flash

BAK61 · Oct 14, 2016

OK, it's been quite some time since I e been on this sit, but , I have a question that requires knowledge I don't have. I recently bought a VM personal camera & cutter. Love it ! Today, I was able to land a flash attachment. The manual states it uses SM type flashbulbs, but I was wondering if I can use any bayonet based flashbulb. Availability and costs are factors here.
Thanks, in advance, for the help.

John Koehrer · Oct 14, 2016

SM=screw mount?

Prof_Pixel · Oct 14, 2016

http://www.flashbulbs.com/flash_info.htm says SM (Speed Midget) bulbs are fast peak bayonet bulbs

BAK61 · Oct 14, 2016

John Koehrer said:
SM=screw mount?

SM = speed midget. Not sure how it got that name. It's a bayonet mount bulb.

BAK61 · Oct 14, 2016

Prof_Pixel said:
http://www.flashbulbs.com/flash_info.htm says SM (Speed Midget) bulbs are fast peak bayonet bulbs

Thank you. I had already checked them out. I think their prices were about $42/ dozen. That's a bit steep, but if I have no other option, they will be used sparingly.

I still think I can use other bayonet mount bulbs.

BAC1967 · Oct 15, 2016

I've been flash bulbs with my Viewmaster camera for years. I got an adapter that allows me to use M5 and M3 bulbs instead on M25. I mostly use ISO 100 film and M25 bulbs are too bright if you want to get closer to your subject. M5 bulbs seem to be a bit more plentiful and cheaper as well. The adapters can be found on eBay, just search for flash bulb adapter.

Prof_Pixel · Oct 15, 2016

BAK61 said:
Thank you. I had already checked them out. I think their prices were about $42/ dozen. That's a bit steep, but if I have no other option, they will be used sparingly.

I still think I can use other bayonet mount bulbs.

Fast peak bulbs are the equivalent of electronic flash units from a sync timing point of view and fire when the shutter is fully open. Medium peak bulbs start their burn before the shutter is open, so if you really need fast peak bulbs, using medium peak bulbs will result in throwing away most of the light.

summicron1 · Oct 15, 2016

at one time it was possible to have a pc plug installed on viewmaster personal cameras ... not sure who does those any more, the guy who did mine is dead, but it is worth asking around. Then you can use an electronic flash and save a gazillion dollars.

bsdunek · Oct 15, 2016

Glad you got help on the flash. Now, my question is, do you have a source for reels?
I have thought of getting a VM camera, as I love the way the reels are. I have a huge collection of the old VM reels, but would need new ones to use with film from a camera.
Just wondering, and thanks.

BAC1967 · Oct 15, 2016

bsdunek said:
Glad you got help on the flash. Now, my question is, do you have a source for reels?
I have thought of getting a VM camera, as I love the way the reels are. I have a huge collection of the old VM reels, but would need new ones to use with film from a camera.
Just wondering, and thanks.

I buy them on eBay, just make sure they look good like no stains or fading on the boxes or reels. If they weren't stored properly the glue dries out and they tend to fall apart. Also make sure they have not been used.

BAK61 · Oct 15, 2016

bsdunek said:
Glad you got help on the flash. Now, my question is, do you have a source for reels?
I have thought of getting a VM camera, as I love the way the reels are. I have a huge collection of the old VM reels, but would need new ones to use with film from a camera.
Just wondering, and thanks.

I get them on E-Bay also. There is a site that sells a newer version, 3Dstereo.com. I have never used them, but they are out there. I may try them as the older reels are getting expensive. Supply & demand.

BAK61 · Oct 15, 2016

Thanks for the info guys. I am going to look for that flash adapter.

BAK61 · Oct 15, 2016

BAC1967 said:
I've been flash bulbs with my Viewmaster camera for years. I got an adapter that allows me to use M5 and M3 bulbs instead on M25. I mostly use ISO 100 film and M25 bulbs are too bright if you want to get closer to your subject. M5 bulbs seem to be a bit more plentiful and cheaper as well. The adapters can be found on eBay, just search for flash bulb adapter.

Thanks for that tip. Wow what a difference in availability and price ! Will definitely take this route.

BAK61 · Oct 16, 2016

Sorry, which adapter is it ? Is it the Press 25 to M3,M5, M25 ?

BAC1967 · Oct 16, 2016

BAK61 said:
Sorry, which adapter is it ? Is it the Press 25 to M3,M5, M25 ?

This is the one I use:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/FLASH-BULB-...edccf8c8b:g:hxEAAOSw2s1UxaEO&autorefresh=true

BAK61 · Oct 16, 2016

BAC1967 said:
This is the one I use:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/FLASH-BULB-...edccf8c8b:g:hxEAAOSw2s1UxaEO&autorefresh=true

Thanks. That's the one I bought this morning

Truzi · Nov 10, 2017

Necroposting because I recently acquired a View Master Personal and want to ask what bulbs I can use. I will mostly use this outside, but I want to get some photos of my brother's newly adopted baby so I can surprise my mom with a reel for Christmas.
The flash came with the adapter mentioned above allowing M-class bulbs to be used. I've only used electronic flash, cubes, and flip-flash before; individual bulbs are new to me. I can't find information on the web to help.

I'm having difficulty finding specs for bulb interchange. BAC1967 mentioned using M3 and M5, but are they "fast" enough? Is there enough/too much light? It seems the SM bulbs are hard to find, especially the B's for color film.

I have a few dozen bulbs that came bundled with an unrelated purchase - 5B and M2. I used flashbulbs for the first time when testing the camera with FP4+, just two shots with the M2s, and I followed the instructions for the View Master flash unit. Since I never used bulbs before I tried 1/50 just for fun, and got nothing, as expected.

Using the recommended 1/25 I think I may have gotten too much light - but it's hard to tell from scanning (for me scanning is a stop-gap measure until I can print my own, so I'm not terribly good at it).

Guide numbers are new to me, though following the math seems easy enough (as well as generic shutter speed/f-stop charts), but is it really that easy? Am I over-complicating bulb substitution?

BAC1967 · Nov 10, 2017

I find with ISO 100 film the M3 bulbs are still a bit too bright. I’m often shooting at f16 at 1/25 and it’s still too bright for how close the subjects are. Being close works better for the 3D effect. I recently replaced the clear flash cover with a white translucent one that I made myself. I took some test shots to get the exposure figured out and now I have less threats of lawsuits for blinding people.

Are you reversing the FP4+ to view it in reels? You could use Velvia 50 which is closer to what the camera was designed for which would have been Kodachrome 40 or 25. The box of bulbs usually has a simple exposure table that you can use rather than doing the math. I wouldn’t say you’re over-complicating things if it gets you better exposure but color reversal film does have a lot of latitude for over exposure, much less if you under expose. I rarely get shots so overexposed that I can’t use them.

Truzi · Nov 10, 2017

No reversal, I just loaded some bulk FP4+ to test the camera since I can develop it easily (I'm not up for E6@home yet). I wanted to make sure the camera worked, had good frame spacing, etc. Scanning over 130 little images was a pain, but it has given me good feedback on framing a photo for 3D (though the cross-eyed viewing can hurt after a while).
I've pro-packs of Velvia 50 and Provia 100F for making reels (and to use with my Realist 45), and I'll send the first few rolls out to a professional - especially for making gift reels. Eventually I'll do E6 myself.

I must be getting old, as I followed the directions for loading the camera instead of doing what I usually do; I lost a couple frames as a result, lol. It also seems to have chewed sprocket holes at one point, but I'll have to go back and see where on the roll. I've still not mastered the bulk-loader, so may have tried to advance when at the "end" of the roll (before switching to "B").

The simplest solution would be to take pictures of the baby outside, but we live in Ohio, so it's too cold for that right now. I may just try to stop-down, and maybe bracket with and without a sheet of paper over the flash, and I may try some of the 5Bs. Since I'm still learning I expect some mistakes anyway.

Hmm... just had a thought - how would an ND filter work over the flash? I've a roll of some ND material somewhere - I bought it to fashion a filter for using Fuji FI-800 GT in a Kodak The Handle.

BAC1967 · Nov 10, 2017

I don't know why an ND filter wouldn't work, it shouldn't affect the color of the flash. I'm hoping that the white translucent plastic will diffuse the flash making the lighting less harsh. I usually take almost a year to finish a roll so I still have a little less than half a roll to go before I see the results. The tests that I did at the end of my last roll looked good though.

Your camera may need some lubrication if it's tearing sprocket holes unless the end of the roll caused it. I did find instructions online for servicing this camera but it looks way too complicated for me. Do you have the cutter and blank reels so you don't have to strain your eyes?

Truzi · Nov 10, 2017

The question is how much ND to start with? The most difficult part will be finding the roll of ND material in my mes, though I do know where my Impossible ND filter is (for using 600 film in an SX70). I do like your idea of a diffuser, but believe it or not, it's a bit beyond my abilities right now - I know how to test in theory, but practice is another thing, especially with no darkroom yet and poor scanning skills.

After checking I found the chewed (but not broken) sprocket-holes are at the end of the roll, so I basically tried too hard before realizing it was time to flip to B and "rewind." I basically took pictures of the same things over a 3-day period, so my notes weren't much help, let alone how you reverse order half-way through... it was confusing to figure out which end was the leader.

I just got a cutter and some reels. I'm not going to cut this roll because I may try enlarging a few shots some day. I've some 35mm Polaroid OneFilm that is a bit too old to save with an FLD filter, so I sacrificed an unexposed roll just to see how well the cutter works. Clean cuts, though the film chips sometimes need a little help to fall out. I think it's more a matter of tight tolerances than being dull. I have played with adjusting the stop-bolt.

Here are a few quick pictures, meant for cross-eyed viewing. Keep in mind this was a quick-and-dirty test - even the developing. I didn't really do anything more to the scans than a few ImageMagick scripts.

BAC1967 · Nov 11, 2017

I think a test roll and got note taking is your best bet for figuring out the ND filter exposure. You do have to keep an eye on the frame count so that you reverse it at the right place before you get to the end like that. The chips sometimes need a little help getting out of the cutter, I think that’s normal. I can’t do the cross eyed thing but the shots do look good.

Truzi · Nov 11, 2017

Thanx.

I quickly found my filter material, which surprised the hell out of me. It's a roll of Lee 210 ND 0.6, which should be 2 stops. Lee's website also give specs on transmission; but I can't seem to find a good output comparison of flashbulbs.
Am I correct in assuming I will "lose" some intensity using M2 and M3 bulbs in a 5" reflector? (Not that I know the output to begin with.)

I might load some FP4+ tonite and play a bit. A shot with a bare bulb, then with one layer of ND, then 2 layers. It might also be a good opportunity to learn to use my newly acquired gray cards. I'm sure scanned B&W negative won't correspond exactly to color transparency, but it should put me in the general area. At the moment I have GE M2 and GE 5B bulbs to try.

BAC1967 · Nov 12, 2017

I’ve always gone with the table on the box of bulbs for exposure, I don’t think the reflector size made much difference.

Truzi · Dec 10, 2017

Hope this is a useful update:

I just got my developed Provia F (and Velvia 50) from Blue Moon Camera and Machine. Only about 12 exposures were indoor with flash. I've only looked at the strips so far - no cutting/mounting or scanning yet.

M2b bulbs seemed to work well on the exposures where I remembered to set the Guide Number on the flash's calculator. The ones before I set the guide number are a little overexposed, but do not seem blown/washed out - they still look nice. I won't know for sure until I get them in a reel. (This whole guide-number thing is new to me.)

2 stops of ND filter over the flash seemed to work well with clear M2 bulbs. This was tested with B&W negative film and scanning, so the usual caveats apply.

Things I have learned unrelated to flash:
The 36 exposure rolls are a bit tight when rewinding, causing the clutch to slip near the end of winding (back into the cartridge), so I have to be careful when unloading the camera.

I had no problem with Fuji film, but self-loaded FP4+ lost some sprocket holes even when I know I reversed direction before the film was fully out of the cartridge. The roll was loaded for ~20 regular exposures (and I purposely only did 8 before reversing). This could be my lack of skill bulk-loading.

The camera does not seem to play nice with a cable release. I'm sure it's something I'm doing wrong, but I get the shutter-opening-on-advance problem. This never happens without the cable release - though will persist until I reset the counter. I only did this with negative film tests, so didn't hurt my slide film.

I think my next test will be finding some cheap color correcting gel to put over a 3200k photo-flood from a Super 8 camera, though the gel will probably melt. (I could get lens filters, but if the test works I can still get filters, and the spare gel would be good for flash bulbs when I don't want to mess around with other things.)

Viewmaster Camera & Flash

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