Viability of Stockpiling B&W Film with Recent Ilford News in Mind

Andre Noble · Sep 17, 2015

Ilford makes some tremendous quality black and white film. But Their future of continuing same is unknown with their recent sale.

I just wanted to share with people that recently I shot and developed 50 year old roll Kodak Plus X film that I found in a hot Tijuana Camera store. To the casual eye you would not know it was 50 year old film stored outside a freezer.

If you love film like I do, just realize that stockpiling ASA 100 and 125 Ilford Film is a legitimate option if you have the resources and commitment.

But I think there will always be some company making quality B&W film... In the N. California wild fires going on now where people have minutes to evacuate their homes - they are grabbing the pets and family photos.

Ricardo Miranda · Sep 17, 2015

It is my opinion that stockpiling film isn't necessary and causes more problems than resolves anything.

You are panicking.

Rick A · Sep 17, 2015

Ricardo Miranda said:
It is my opinion that stockpiling film isn't necessary and causes more problems than resolves anything.

You are panicking.

+1 Yup

removed account4 · Sep 17, 2015

hi andre

i have been shooting expired film for a long time and it looks fine.
and none of it has been cold stored ...
be prepared for a chorus of people telling you what a terrible
thing you are doing suggesting expired film might be OK ..

do what you need to do if you have to do it ... and enjoy yourself.

that said, it seems ilford is growing, not shrinking ... and will still be making the
emulsions and films you enjoy.
i bought a ton of film IDK 14 years ago, and it was more of a PITA than a good thing ..

Ian Grant · Sep 17, 2015

No Ilford's (Harman) future is encouraging and the company growing I just wouldn't bother stock piling film for the sake of it.

Ian

Wallendo · Sep 17, 2015

There is no advantage to stockpiling currently manufactured film. If Ilford discontinues a particular film, there will be more than enough available supply to stockpile at that time.

None of us know what Ilford's new owners have in mind, but I doubt they would pay a lot of money for the company just to shut it down with no warning. Moreover, if films are to be discontinued, I suspect the niche films (Pan F+, SFX, and Delta 3200) would be the most likely victims.

Jeff Searust · Sep 17, 2015

Wallendo said:
Moreover, if films are to be discontinued, I suspect the niche films (Pan F+, SFX, and Delta 3200) would be the most likely victims.

I would believe just the opposite. I can easily foresee the new company producing MORE niche films rather than less. -- Film is a mature technology. The science is all there. If you own a company that produces an item that is basically a license to print money (film) you would want to use it as much as possible. The raw materials costs on film are low, there are few if any royalties needed to be paid, and the machines are all paid for. There are customers with money to purchase the product. The only limiting factor is not making too much of anything.

Film will be around for a LONG time.

pentaxuser · Sep 17, 2015

So assuming you can safely stock for 50 years and let's ignore for the moment the devastating effect on the film makers if most of us did that, then if for reasons of stockpiling or just a falling out of love with film the market collapsed, are you going to be able to obtain the chemicals, paper, processing equipment etc that is going to allow you to continue with analogue?

Some skilled and dedicated experts in both chemistry and paper emulsion making might manage but 99% of us would not

Not a good strategy in my opinion

pentaxuser

Andre Noble · Sep 17, 2015

I am not suggesting stockpiling just yet. Some world class films are no longer manufactured, but are sitting safely in my 14 cubic foot chest freezer at -14F. Astia, Velvia. EIR. IR820. 35mm Plus X. 120 REALA. and more. I am still paying the loan I took out to do so.

I missed the boat on some like 120 format Plus X.

That will not happen again with Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100.

BradS · Sep 17, 2015

Ricardo Miranda said:
It is my opinion that stockpiling film isn't necessary and causes more problems than resolves anything.

You are panicking.

++

georg16nik · Sep 17, 2015

Andre Noble said:
I am not suggesting stockpiling just yet. Some world class films are no longer manufactured, but are sitting safely in my 14 cubic foot chest freezer at -14F. Astia, Velvia. EIR. IR820. 35mm Plus X. 120 REALA. and more. I am still paying the loan I took out to do so.

I missed the boat on some like 120 format Plus X.

That will not happen again with Ilford FP4+ or Delta 100.

You know, we've had this talk years ago.
I keep the freezer filled and once there's some empty space in it, I check the current batches of the good stuff and buy in bulk.

...on APUG you will hear mostly nay, don't bother.

The kids and amateurs who don't know how to properly store photographic materials, long term, will surely say it's not worth it.
These guys are perpetually unprepared for the future.

removed account4 · Sep 17, 2015

georg16nik said:
You know, we've had this talk years ago.
I keep the freezer filled and once there's some empty space in it, I check the current batches of the good stuff and buy in bulk.

...on APUG you will hear mostly nay, don't bother.

The kids and amateurs who don't know how to properly store photographic materials, long term, will surely say it's not worth it.
These guys are perpetually unprepared for the future.

naaah

not unprepared for the future
because in the future some of us
will be coating our own, papers and glass
and aren't really worrying about it ...

dwross · Sep 17, 2015

jnanian said:
naaah

not unprepared for the future
because in the future some of us
will be coating our own, papers and glass
and aren't really worrying about it ...

And film. Please don't forget to add film to the list. And really, folks, it's not hard to make emulsions. There's something about the general APUG mindset that always paints it as nearly impossible, but it is not.

Back to the OP: IMHO, stockpiling materials is the absolutely worst thing to do to the industry, unless you are buying up a product that has been officially discontinued.

georg16nik · Sep 17, 2015

jnanian said:
naaah

not unprepared for the future
because in the future some of us
will be coating our own, papers and glass
and aren't really worrying about it ...

yeah, sure, in case you have lots of spare time OR you do it as business.

removed account4 · Sep 17, 2015

georg16nik said:
yeah, sure, in case you have lots of spare time OR you do it as business.

yeah, really ...

here's a book on it: http://www.blurb.com/b/6465389-the-light-farm
and a website: http://thelightfarm.com

did it when i was in college ( around 30 years ago )
no internet, no help, no worries ..
from a recipie i found in an old
photography annual from 1904 ...
in my kitchen in the middle of the night
its really not as hard or time consuming as you think, and is actually pretty easy
depending on how sophisticated you want the emulsion to be ...

if you can bake a loaf of bread, or a cake, or mayonnaise or salad dressing
or mix stock chemicals to make a developer ...
or classic cyanotype chemistry you can probably make emulsion ...
===

sorry denise, i forgot FILM !

and congratulations on your new book !!!

MattKing · Sep 17, 2015

If you have reason to depend on a particular film or emulsion or paper for a particular project, then it makes sense to have enough of it to complete the project.

Otherwise, just keep reasonable amounts on hand.

Richard S. (rich815) · Sep 17, 2015

Viability of Stockpiling B&W Film with Recent Ilford News in Mind

I have small dorm fridge full of mostly B&W film. I started not because I was worried about emulsions disappearing but because pros were going digital in droves a few years ago and dumping their freezers of film on eBay and it was going cheap. i.e., one auction I picked up 86 rolls of fairly fresh Plus-X (120) for only 80 cents a roll. I also got some stocks of APX25 in bulk rolls and 120. Since I had freezer room I bought a few bulk rolls of Neopan 1600, 400 and 100SS, Agfa APX100/400, and others. I'm thrilled I did as I now get to use emulsions that are mostly long gone but that I also got quite cheaply. Sure the freezer costs some to keep running but not that much. If you have the room buy the film and freeze it. No need to horde I imagine though.

Colin Corneau · Sep 17, 2015

Hoarding isn't a viable strategy. Ilford's been stellar at supporting film photography and photographers and until that's demonstrably shown to be ending, panicking is counter productive and harmful to all involved. Support your film companies!
Geez, it's a step or two removed from stockpiling your own urine. Cooler heads, please.

RattyMouse · Sep 17, 2015

Wallendo said:
There is no advantage to stockpiling currently manufactured film.

Incorrect. Stockpiling protects you from price increases. Fuji has announced a 20% rise in prices across the board. A $2000 stockpile just saved you $400. That's good money saved.

ic-racer · Sep 17, 2015

If one likes using expired film go for it.

analoguey · Sep 17, 2015

Andre Noble said:
Ilford makes some tremendous quality black and white film. But Their future of continuing same is unknown with their recent sale.

I just wanted to share with people that recently I shot and developed 50 year old roll Kodak Plus X film that I found in a hot Tijuana Camera store. To the casual eye you would not know it was 50 year old film stored outside a freezer.

If you love film like I do, just realize that stockpiling ASA 100 and 125 Ilford Film is a legitimate option if you have the resources and commitment.

But I think there will always be some company making quality B&W film... In the N. California wild fires going on now where people have minutes to evacuate their homes - they are grabbing the pets and family photos.

You're stockpiling for a disastrous scenario, so your thinking would've to fit BCP / DR plan -

So, first you'll buy say 1000 rolls of film as stockpile. But then you realise having it all in one location is disastrous - cos things can go wrong.
Then you buy another 1000 rolls to stockpile in another place (for disaster recovery)- just in case.

Then you buy another 1000 cos you don't wanna dip into your regular/backup stock for shooting.

Also, you'll have to do the same for paper, chemicals, enlarger etc.,
(See where this is going?)

I don't think stockpiling on film or paper is gonna help much unless you're projecting far enough to cover enough possibilities(do you wanna keep shooting film until 5/10 or more years later?) . Plus whatever Skillset you need to survive any foreseen loss in analogue photography.
Because, just one set wouldn't be enough, imho.

The question would be if it's worth it.

Better off giving existing Film manufacturers a market instead?

Sent from Tap-a-talk

whojammyflip · Sep 17, 2015

I think there is some hypothesis that all threads eventually end up mentioning Hitler, but this kind of paranoid delusion drove his Lebensraum theories. Just place your trust in the idea that either there will be film as we need it, or there will be an alternative. Hoarding anything is not a good idea. This philosophy doesnt end with film, but you are welcome to extend it to any other resource. Just take a look on a British high street, and you will see droves of fat people who have been hoarding food in case of famine. The same goes for contents of bank accounts. Just wander round any street in the centre of London and you will hear people chatting about prices and lack of money, even though they are amongst the wealthiest in the world. This constant paranoia of running out of stuff is actually a mental illness.

Prepare the end is nigh. Oh no, no its not. And even if it is, who cares. Go get laid. Dont hoard stuff. Go shoot all the film in your freezer and throw your unused lenses into the street.

madgardener · Sep 17, 2015

hoojammyflip said:
<snip>

Prepare the end is nigh. Oh no, no its not. And even if it is, who cares. Go get laid. Dont hoard stuff. Go shoot all the film in your freezer and throw your unused lenses into the street.

No no, send those lenses to me for proper disposal, and the camera too. Especially any medium or large format cameras and lenses.

pdeeh · Sep 17, 2015

Well, that was a breath of fresh air.
Weird air, but fresh all the same ...

DAK · Sep 17, 2015

Where can I find the news that Ilford has been sold?

Dave

Viability of Stockpiling B&W Film with Recent Ilford News in Mind

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