under the lens red safty light

[grant miller]

Can anyone tell me what red filter to use as a under the lens safety light filter, with a Aristo V 54 lamp. I just upgraded to it. I've been using the red safety filter that comes with the Ilford Multigrade Filters. It works fine the Aristo W 55 and W 45 lamps but not at all with the V 45 lamp, I can't see any image on the easel. I use the safety filter alot when dodging and burning small areas.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

There may not be much red content in the spectral output of the Aristo V 54 lamp. Hence, nothing is let through by the filter and you cannot see an image on the easel. Switching to a different filter will help you see but it may not be 'safe' anymore. I use a piece of cardboard, red on top and flat black on the bottom, to dodge and burn. That let's me see the image and does no harm to the paper.

 

[grant miller]

Thanks for the reply Ralph, I'll give it a try. I would still like to hear from someone using the Aristo V 45 lamp. I do some post Fogging in small areas of the print by laying a mask over the whole easel. I need to be able to see the image on the easel to line the mask up exactly where it needs to be.

 

[ic-racer]

Go back to using the W45.

Or you could rig up some sort of incandescent lamp inside your lamphouse to use when lining up your masks (or bright amber or red LEDs).

You could try some amber filters. I always thought it odd that under the lens safelight filters were always red, whereas every safelight I have ever owned in 35 years has been amber (Kodak OC).

 

[RalphLambrecht]

... You could try some amber filters. I always thought it odd that under the lens safelight filters were always red, whereas every safelight I have ever owned in 35 years has been amber (Kodak OC).

No filter is safe. All filters only protect for a certain time. OC filters are a compromise between safety and being able to see. They reach further into the visible spectrum than red filters, making it easier for humans to see. A red filter is as safe as it gets for paper and the best option for under-the-lens safelight filters.

 

[Roger Cole]

I've never really seen the point of the under the lens red filter. My Omega D2 doesn't have one, though the parts to add one are readily available used. I just don't see the point. How exactly does such a filter help with dodging and burning? I don't get it.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I've never really seen the point of the under the lens red filter. My Omega D2 doesn't have one, though the parts to add one are readily available used. I just don't see the point. How exactly does such a filter help with dodging and burning? I don't get it.

I almost always use a standard or customized burning card to fine-tune the print (see attached). It is helpful to do a dry-run with the red safelight filter in place, aligning the card before committing the actual exposure to paper.

 

[Roger Cole]

Hummm... ok. But you could do the "dry run" without paper in the easel or with a scrap sheet turned back side up for focussing. That's what I do.

Not that it matters - of course do what works for you. I was just curious if I was missing something and should get the filter and holder for my enlarger.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

As you said, there is more than one way. To me, it's more convenient to expose right after trying out the right 'position' for the dodge or burn. When I have to get the paper after the trial run,I seem to 'forget' the exact position for small-area burns and mess it up a bit.

 

[tkamiya]

Another way to do it.....

I usually have two "tools" in my hand. "Dodge/burn" tool will be held my left hand in approximate position on top and a blank sheet will be held my right hand covering the entire area of paper under the tool. I set my timer to "metronome" position and set it few seconds longer. The extra second will be used to align the tool with paper covered. Then, at the right timing, I remove the card on right hand.

More complex to explain than do it.... it works for me.

 

[heespharm]

The under the lens filter has a diffraction factor and throws the focusing off... Do not use

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I fully agree, but I've never seen a recommendation to use it for focussing.

 

[grant miller]

I was hoping that someone who actually uses a Aristo V45 lamp would be able to tell me, what under the lens safety light works for them? Since the standard lens does not work. I use a safety light when I lay a mask on top of the photographic paper, to burn in a very specific area with white light. The mask has to be put in the exact correct position or a unwanted line will show up on the print.
Thanks, Grant

 

[grant miller]

Correction: I just realized I've typing in Aristo V45 lamp, what I should've typed is Aristo V54 lamp!!!!! There is no V45 lamp only a W45 lamp. My mistake!!!
Grant

 

[ic-racer]

No filter is safe. All filters only protect for a certain time. OC filters are a compromise between safety and being able to see. They reach further into the visible spectrum than red filters, making it easier for humans to see. A red filter is as safe as it gets for paper and the best option for under-the-lens safelight filters.

Good point.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

I was hoping that someone who actually uses a Aristo V45 lamp would be able to tell me, what under the lens safety light works for them? ...

We did, but you didn't like the answer: 'none'

Any filter allowing you to see the light of this lamp will also fail to protect your paper!

By the way, see the 'edit post' menu after posting a message? That's where you can correct or edit your recent posts for about an hour or so.

 

[fschifano]

I have an Aristo V54 cold light that I hardly use. It's pretty blue and only suitable for graded papers. There is very little red in the spectrum of that lamp so it's no surprise that you can't see anything on the baseboard through a red filter. There isn't any red light for the filter to pass. Sorry pal, there is no safe filter going to fix that. You need red light to be somewhat safe, and it just ain't there.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Thanks Frank. I don't think Grant liked my answer.

 

[fschifano]

Apparently not Ralph. Maybe our little discussion will get Grant interested enough to explore the spectral output of different kinds of lamps. It was a similar discussion I had many years ago with a very old, and now sadly deceased, darkroom rat who put me onto this. And it was just this discussion that led me to the discovery that different lamps will cause variable contrast filters to behave differently when used with different lamp houses. Like the man says, YMMV; and there is no substitute for testing under your darkroom conditions. No two are the same.

BTW, I really like the work in your web site's gallery. Nice control of light. Can't tell where or even if you're using auxiliary lighting, and to me that's the way it's supposed to be. I'm working on it, but I'm not there yet. Now that I've put my toes into the "Dark Side", I'm a lot less hesitant about experimenting since film costs are taken out of the equation, and instant feedback is factored in.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

...Maybe our little discussion will get Grant interested enough to explore the spectral output of different kinds of lamps. It was a similar discussion I had many years ago with a very old, and now sadly deceased, darkroom rat who put me onto this. And it was just this discussion that led me to the discovery that different lamps will cause variable contrast filters to behave differently when used with different lamp houses. ...

I have two book recommendations on that subject:

Eastman Kodak Company, Kodak Filters, Kodak Publication B-3, 1981
This book is for scientists whose use of filters requires extensive spectrophotometric data. However, the graphical representation of light transmission clearly illustrates filter functionality to all.

and

Thomas Woodlief, Jr., SPSE Handbook of Photographic Science and Engineering, John Wiley & Sons, Inc., 1973
This reference book reminds us of many things previously learned but not regularly used. In 1,400 pages, compiled by over 100 contributors, it provides very technical information about any possible aspect of photography. The book is directed at the experienced, practicing engineer and scientist. Almost every section of the book contains tutorial material but not enough for the beginner to learn an unfamiliar field.

The 1st contains the spectral data for filters and the 2nd for numerous types of light sources. A small spreadsheet can easily calculate the resulting output.