ULF Film----Special order----20x24 AND BEYOND

lynux · Aug 5, 2007

ULF FILM ----SPECIAL ORDER----20x24 AND BEYOND

Hello,
I am currently looking for other potential buyers in order to get enough people together for a special order of EFKE PL100 in Rollformat (175 micron polyester support):

Film width= 9.5 Roll Length=10m Minimum order quantity=10 Rolls
Film width= 20 Roll Length=10m Minimum order quantity=10 Rolls
Film width= 40 Roll Length=10m Minimum order quantity=10 Rolls

My main interest is focussed on the 20 width rolls, for following reasons:
1. you can cut out 20*24 as sheets
2. you can cut out 20* XXX, for anything larger as experiment
As long as you stick to the 20width, you are able to get paper for making contact copies as a standard product.

I have a minor interest for the 9.5 width rolls, which would allow to have panoramic cameras 9.5 by XXX; the reasons for only "minor" interest:
1. you can get aerofilm in this size
2. I do not think that you have available paper in this width as a standard product.

The very large width of 40" is currently of little interest to me, as it is simply too wide,
And I see no practical way to cut it into a standard smaller format. Nevertheless it is always good to know, there is a company out there willing to supply this as a special order.

The current commercial proposal has been worked out by Lotus View Camera in Austria,
and I think it would be best to email them directly to show your interest in a group ordering for 20" wide film.

Disclaimer: This is not a commercial posting. I have no personal interest in this matter, except that I want to get enough people interested to attain the minimum order quantity of 10 rolls.

---george w.

sanking · Aug 5, 2007

lynux said:
ULF FILM ----SPECIAL ORDER----20x24 AND BEYOND

Hello,
I am currently looking for other potential buyers in order to get enough people together for a special order of EFKE PL100 in Rollformat (175 micron polyester support):

Film width= 9.5 Roll Length=10m Minimum order quantity=10 Rolls
Film width= 20 Roll Length=10m Minimum order quantity=10 Rolls
Film width= 40 Roll Length=10m Minimum order quantity=10 Rolls

My main interest is focussed on the 20 width rolls, for following reasons:
1. you can cut out 20*24 as sheets
2. you can cut out 20* XXX, for anything larger as experiment
As long as you stick to the 20width, you are able to get paper for making contact copies as a standard product.

I have a minor interest for the 9.5 width rolls, which would allow to have panoramic cameras 9.5 by XXX; the reasons for only "minor" interest:
1. you can get aerofilm in this size
2. I do not think that you have available paper in this width as a standard product.

The very large width of 40" is currently of little interest to me, as it is simply too wide,
And I see no practical way to cut it into a standard smaller format. Nevertheless it is always good to know, there is a company out there willing to supply this as a special order.

The current commercial proposal has been worked out by Lotus View Camera in Austria,
and I think it would be best to email them directly to show your interest in a group ordering for 20" wide film.

Disclaimer: This is not a commercial posting. I have no personal interest in this matter, except that I want to get enough people interested to attain the minimum order quantity of 10 rolls.

---george w.

George,

If 20X24" is the main interest why not just try to put together an order for film cut to that size and boxed?

Sandy King

Nick Zentena · Aug 5, 2007

Could the 9.5" be cut down to 4x10? Or is the 9.5" 1/4" too short for the 10" side?

David A. Goldfarb · Aug 5, 2007

I think Jim Galli's been shooting 8x9.5's cut from aerial film. If it's short on the long side it will still fit the holder, as long as you push the film in all the way, and I'd tap it down with the filmholder darkslide handle down before shooting so the film will be where you expect it to be in the holder. You would also want to shoot verticals with the darkslide handle end of the back down.

Nick Zentena · Aug 5, 2007

30metre roll would only be about 100 sheets I think. I wonder if it makes more sense then ordering pre-cut from Fotoimpex. :confused:

lynux · Aug 5, 2007

ULF Film ----Special order----20x24 AND BEYOND

Hi all, thanks for the responses

here some additional comments:

1. 20x24" is not the issue here, I have enough in the freezer

2. the goal is to have an alternative in panoramic format, e.g.
-20x30" or
-9.5x30" or... or...
...with variable length to be able to use all the lense's circle of illumination

3. why 9.5 instead of 10"?
if a special back is being constructed, 9.5" will also allow the use of aerial
film, that is available in chrome and color negative

4. why 10m instead of 30m?
the per roll cost is much more manageable in shorter roll lengths,
remember that minimum order quantity is always 10 rolls, *independent
of width or length*

5. why order NOW?
the film business is a quickly changing market, with very few players;
I do not know how long there will be a company willing to execute
special orders at so low a minimum order price; after the surprises of the
last 2 years, i would be interested to put two or three rolls in the freezer,
whatever the width

...george w.

Hugo Zhang · Aug 5, 2007

If they can cut the 9 1/2" into 19 1/2" length sheets and box them up, I will be interested in a few rolls.

lynux · Aug 6, 2007

@hugo,
well, you can cut the length at *any* length you want

doing just precut 9.5x19.5" is surely possible, but I doubt you will find enough
other people interested to attain the minimum order quantity for that very and
unique size

it is much easier to get people grouped for buying a roll, where everybody
can cut to his length (with an appropriate rig, cutting to length should
be straigthforward)

the longer I am thinking about 9.5" wide rolls, the more it takes my interest;
I am thinking of a multiformat camera back, working like the Sinar zoom rollfilm
cassette, allowing variable length per picture,
with this you would no longer need separate filmholders, and you could adjust
the side ratio to the scene (9.5x9.5", 9.5x17", 9.5x28.5")

anyhow EFKE is so much cheaper than TMAX or else, that in my eyes it is worthwhile
for doing some experiments

---george w.

Nick Zentena · Aug 6, 2007

I don't think the 9.5" works for me. I measured the 4x10 film holders and just think the film wouldn't sit right. It would be too much hit and miss on the exact film location. I guess I could tap the film down and compose for the far edge but the extra 1/4" or so to hit the normal width of 8x10 film would seem much nicer.

sanking · Aug 6, 2007

BTW, is there any source at all of 20X24" film cut to size at this time?

I assume since Forte went under the BPF 200 has dried up? Does Fotoimpex offer anything in this size?

Sandy King

Michael Kadillak · Aug 6, 2007

sanking said:
BTW, is there any source at all of 20X24" film cut to size at this time?

I assume since Forte went under the BPF 200 has dried up? Does Fotoimpex offer anything in this size?

Sandy King

John formerly of J&C has re-grouped and will announce a TMY offering initially in two formats very soon for 20x24 and 16x20 in 25 sheet boxes. He has paid for the film and is awaiting a ship date from Kodak as we speak. When he gets a specific date that the film has been cut, boxed and shipped, he will provide details as per pricing and shipping and an announcement will be made on the various channels and forums. This not a pre-order deal and as a result, it will be a first come first serve offering so do not hesitate if you are interested. We hope to bring TMY in two additional formats every two months for as long as people want or need TMY ULF sheet film.

Cheers!

PBrooks · Aug 6, 2007

how great is that!!!!! Can 14x17 be in there too?
Phillip

Michael Kadillak · Aug 6, 2007

PBrooks said:
how great is that!!!!! Can 14x17 be in there too?
Phillip

To be perfectly honest with you Phillip, 14x17 is down the list of popular formats and we must be aware of the fact that Kodak requires John to purchase a minimal volume of each size which just is what it is. It may require you to do some trimming of a larger size on your own. Popularity and numbers are the drivers in this business deal as the risk with unused inventory must be managed as intelligently as possible by John so he can keep the ball rolling.

That said I am completely confident that if enough interest in any format came forward it would be certain that it would be cut.

Cheers!

Simon R Galley · Aug 7, 2007

Dear All,

We have completed our 2007 run of ULF film including 20 x 24 in HP5+ and FP4+ whilst its all pre-ordered if you check the sponsors forum some of our ULF partners in the USA may still have stock.

Simon : ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited

sanking · Aug 7, 2007

Simon R Galley said:
Dear All,

We have completed our 2007 run of ULF film including 20 x 24 in HP5+ and FP4+ whilst its all pre-ordered if you check the sponsors forum some of our ULF partners in the USA may still have stock.

Simon : ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited

Simon,

Would you please provide a list and contact information for your ULF partners in the USA?

Sandy King

Sal Santamaura · Aug 7, 2007

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Dave Wooten · Aug 7, 2007

Fred's Place

Sal Santamaura said:
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

Thanks Sal and Simon.

Fred Newman Photography listed in the supplier link above is the View Camera Store, also an APUG Sponsor.

Michael Kadillak · Aug 31, 2007

Michael Kadillak said:
John formerly of J&C has re-grouped and will announce a TMY offering initially in two formats very soon for 20x24 and 16x20 in 25 sheet boxes. He has paid for the film and is awaiting a ship date from Kodak as we speak. When he gets a specific date that the film has been cut, boxed and shipped, he will provide details as per pricing and shipping and an announcement will be made on the various channels and forums. This not a pre-order deal and as a result, it will be a first come first serve offering so do not hesitate if you are interested. We hope to bring TMY in two additional formats every two months for as long as people want or need TMY ULF sheet film.

Cheers!

I have to eat my words here as John bailed out on all of us. He will never do business in the film business again in this lifetime so as a result, we are moving on. Good news will be forthcoming as I have just about got all of the details worked out to fill this void more effectively and without the lies.

Cheers!

Zebra · Aug 31, 2007

Michael,

Any chance Kodak has a heart and would be open to those of us left holding a rather large bag by John getting a SUBSTANTIAL break on the orders we originally had the first go around. Eating words in one thing--eating 2300 dollars is another! I'm kidding on the last line of course as I realize you don't have responsibility in the matter. I have to say though its hard to just 'move on' from taking such a significant hit. My wife is a glass blower and we used some of her money to make this 'once in a lifetime' kind of order.

I realize that my deal was with John and his character and thak Kodak didn't necessarily have a hand in this but as long as negotaiations are taking place maybe good will can reign supreme and win back some of those that are a little gunshy to 'move forward' in the future.

Thank you for your continued efforts and I hope this suggestion is received in the respectful manner in which it is intended.

Best,

Monty

Michael Kadillak · Sep 1, 2007

Zebra said:
Michael,

Any chance Kodak has a heart and would be open to those of us left holding a rather large bag by John getting a SUBSTANTIAL break on the orders we originally had the first go around. Eating words in one thing--eating 2300 dollars is another! I'm kidding on the last line of course as I realize you don't have responsibility in the matter. I have to say though its hard to just 'move on' from taking such a significant hit. My wife is a glass blower and we used some of her money to make this 'once in a lifetime' kind of order.

I realize that my deal was with John and his character and thak Kodak didn't necessarily have a hand in this but as long as negotaiations are taking place maybe good will can reign supreme and win back some of those that are a little gunshy to 'move forward' in the future.

Thank you for your continued efforts and I hope this suggestion is received in the respectful manner in which it is intended.

Best,

Monty

Kodak has indicated to me in sponsor replacement negotiations that they are willing to hold the film price from 18 months ago. I wish there was a way that I could clean this one up for you Monty, but we will have to work this the best way that we can. More later my friend.

Things are intensely close to having things wrapped up for the next offering of TMY and I am excited in one sense for how much better this go around will be to the film consuming public. But at the same time I am steaming for those individuals that trusted John and were rewarded with a cold shoulder.

Cheers!

John Z. · Sep 5, 2007

One other question Michael,
would you know of any efforts to make any more TMY in 11x14 format? Thanks for your efforts,

John Z.

mammolo · Sep 6, 2007

Michael Kadillak said:
John formerly of J&C has re-grouped and will announce a TMY offering initially in two formats very soon for 20x24 and 16x20 in 25 sheet boxes. He has paid for the film and is awaiting a ship date from Kodak as we speak. When he gets a specific date that the film has been cut, boxed and shipped, he will provide details as per pricing and shipping and an announcement will be made on the various channels and forums. This not a pre-order deal and as a result, it will be a first come first serve offering so do not hesitate if you are interested. We hope to bring TMY in two additional formats every two months for as long as people want or need TMY ULF sheet film.

Cheers!

In fact I would like to know the business rationale that led one to conclude that 16x20 is more popular than 14x17. I am not challenging this, mind you, I am just curious to know (yeah, I shoot 14x17...).

My impression from a few non-statistically significant polls is that both formats are rather uncommon and they are so by the same amount, and that half their size (8x20 and 7x17) is much more popular, but again by a similar amount.

If the 16x20 order had been presold then of course is a different matter, but apparently this was not the case, hence my curiosity.

Cheers!

Photo Engineer · Sep 6, 2007

With the ongoing thread on EFKE film defects, I am surprised that there is still interest in this.

PE

Michael Kadillak · Sep 8, 2007

mammolo said:
In fact I would like to know the business rationale that led one to conclude that 16x20 is more popular than 14x17. I am not challenging this, mind you, I am just curious to know (yeah, I shoot 14x17...).

My impression from a few non-statistically significant polls is that both formats are rather uncommon and they are so by the same amount, and that half their size (8x20 and 7x17) is much more popular, but again by a similar amount.

If the 16x20 order had been presold then of course is a different matter, but apparently this was not the case, hence my curiosity.

Cheers!

The odds are excellent that both 14x17 and 16x20 in T Max 400 can be cut as soon as we complete the paper work on the new deal with Kodak. I am giving everyone advance notice to start checking your frozen stock of TMY and get ready to rumble. The more interest there are in any format the better and the decision to proceed with any format is very reasonable.

The new deal will have enormous flexibility on both the sell and purchase side of the arrangement. We are working behind the scenes as quickly as we can to set things up and Kodak, as usual, has been great to work with.

Cheers!

Rick Olson · Sep 20, 2007

Kodak TMY ULF Order

Hello Michael,

Just doing a follow up to see if you will be announcing this soon. I am clearing out some freezer space for some 7 x 17. Thanks again for all your hard work in dealing with this project.

Rick

Michael Kadillak said:
The odds are excellent that both 14x17 and 16x20 in T Max 400 can be cut as soon as we complete the paper work on the new deal with Kodak. I am giving everyone advance notice to start checking your frozen stock of TMY and get ready to rumble. The more interest there are in any format the better and the decision to proceed with any format is very reasonable.

The new deal will have enormous flexibility on both the sell and purchase side of the arrangement. We are working behind the scenes as quickly as we can to set things up and Kodak, as usual, has been great to work with.

Cheers!

ULF Film----Special order----20x24 AND BEYOND

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