TX400 and HC110

[Henry Alive]

I hope this information could be useful for everybody in this forum. I would ask you to share any other similar information that you could have.

I have been studying this combo for a while, and these are the results that I have found:
Film: TX400, 35 mm.
EI 200
Pre-washed: Water, during 1 minute of constant agitation.
Developer: HC110 (E- 1:47)
Developed two rolls of film, continuous agitation during the first 30 seconds, and then 5 times each 30 seconds.
Time of developing: 6 minutes.
Temperature: 20ªC.
Stop bath: Kodak Max Stop, 1:15, and 1 minute with constant agitation.
Fixer bath: Tetenal, 1:9, 5 minutes. The first minute with continue agitation, and then 5 times each 30 seconds.
Results:
After having taken pictures of a Kodak grey card, I have found the following relative densities:
Zone 5: 0,68
Zone 1: 0,10
These densities have been measured with my RH Designs Analyzer Pro.
My conclusions:
For my working system I can say that TX400 (EI200) and HC110 (E), 6 minutes developing time, are perfect.

 

[Uhner]

Interesting. I have not done any thorough testing on this combination, but my tentative results on TX and HC 110 1+ 50 are similar.

 

[justpete]

I just finished testing a number of film and dev combinations with 400TX and HC110(D) being one of them.

EI=250 w/grey card exposures at -3, 0, +3 stops approximating zones II, V, and VIII.

Using a ProcessMaster II for temp comp in a tempering bath and verifying dev temp was within a few tenths C of the water the film densities above b+f for a 5.6min development were 0.11, 0.66, 1.23 agitating for the first 60s and for five inversion cycles every minute. Measurements were made with a ZoneMaster II and b+f was 0.18, which wasn't much different at 6.8 minute develop test time.

Stop for 60s constant agitation in a solution of PF TS-4 diluted 1:14 with distilled water (one shot) and fixed for 10.5 minutes (3x clearing time from snip tests) with agitation for the first minute and ten inversion cycles every minute thereafter in a solution of PF TF-4 diluted 1:14 with distilled water (one shot), both maintained at temp in the same tempering bath.

Washed using Ilford method (but double the number of inversions in each cycle), again using distilled water held in tempering bath. Tests using sodium sulfide solution and PF residual hypo test solution showed no staining on several of the film strips, fwiw.

I used dilution D to keep concentrate amount at or above 6ml per 250ml of developer solution to optimize capacity in a single reel spiral tank and it looks like the results aren't far off of yours. Thanks for posting, I was beginning to wonder if my tests were valid as this diultion seemed way more active than I'd expected it to be.

 

[BrianPhotog]

Hmm...1+32 for 6:30 @20C EI320 has always worked for me...

 

[Michel Hardy-Vallée]

Thanks for sharing, those can always be useful for people looking for a starting point. For my 35mm work, I prefer XTOL because I find HC-110 depresses the midtones a bit too much. It's useful in MF, though, especially when I have a scene that has its tones mostly at either end of the B&W spectrum.

 

[ElrodCod]

Many years ago a zone I film test put (old) Tri-X @ an I.E. of 200 in my Nikon F and I.E of 250 in the F2 in Picker's recommended HC110 dilution. Sorry...I don't remember what that was but it worked quite well when the developing time was dialed in, which I do remember was 5¾ minutes. Very close to what Henry's doing now. Sounds good to me.

 

[Henry Alive]

I always work with TX400 (EI200) developed with HC110 (1:47) for 6 minutes, 20ªC, and printed in a condenser enlarger. You can read what I wrote some months ago here:
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)
I hope it can help.
Henry.

 

[2F/2F]

I am just trying to figure this out myself. Kodak's bizarre developing time of 3:45 for dilution B at 400 has to be way off. I will not downrate my film, however. I use box speed with incident metering, my preferred method.

Your method (dilution E for 6 minutes at EI 200) sounds about right if the time for dilution B at EI 400 is 6:30, which I have gathered that it is from Ilford's recommended time using their Ilfotec HC (which is near identical to HC-110 IME). Sounds like it would be very close to a time published by Kodak for dilution E, if there was such a thing. (Is there? I have never seen it.) 6 minutes is probably just about the starting time I would extrapolate for an initial test if I wanted to use Tri-X at EI 200 and HC-110 dilution E.

 

[Rolleiflexible]

Film: TX400, 35 mm.
EI 200
Pre-washed: Water, during 1 minute of constant agitation.
Developer: HC110 (E- 1:47)
Developed two rolls of film, continuous agitation during the first 30 seconds, and then 5 times each 30 seconds.
Time of developing: 6 minutes.
Temperature: 20ªC.

This is the recipe I've used to process all my
Tri-X (thousands of 120 rolls) over the years.
An old photographer passed it on to me, but
described it as 5/8 ounce of HC110 syrup into
900 ml of water. I just now did the ratio, and
found that (surprise) it works out to 1:47.

I agree, the recipe gives great results -- plenty
of shadow detail without cooked highlights.

 

[pgomena]

Yep, falls right in the range of my experience. Tri-X 35mm, EI 200-250, HC-110B, 68 degrees, presoak, 30 seconds initial agitation, two gentle inversions on the 30 seconds for a total of 5 minutes. I used this process primarily for a cold-light diffusion enlarger.

Peter Gomena

 

[LisaU]

I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. I've been having issues with this combination ( tri-x 400 shot at 400 and Hc100 B) and also Neopan 400, shot at box + HC100 B. My negs are coming out thin. Is it because I'm shooting it at box speed? I took a look at your processes and they look like what I do. 68 degrees, presoak, 10 inversions to start, 3 inversions every 30 seconds for 6 minutes. stop for a minute then a 5 min fix. Lastly a 20 min wash with lots of fresh water. I don't think it's my exposures since they are thin throughout and my numbers are also not even black. I've been having to extend my developing time by 2 minutes which seems super excessive but works. I just don't know why.

 

[Carter john]

Try a different camera, maybe you have a fast shutter on the one you are using. My times are also like the ones mentioned in this thread, there are also people that claim different waters change times. I have not had this experience as I have lived in the same place for 33 years.

 

[Arvee]

I'm not sure what I'm doing wrong. I've been having issues with this combination ( tri-x 400 shot at 400 and Hc100 B) and also Neopan 400, shot at box + HC100 B. My negs are coming out thin. Is it because I'm shooting it at box speed? I took a look at your processes and they look like what I do. 68 degrees, presoak, 10 inversions to start, 3 inversions every 30 seconds for 6 minutes. stop for a minute then a 5 min fix. Lastly a 20 min wash with lots of fresh water. I don't think it's my exposures since they are thin throughout and my numbers are also not even black. I've been having to extend my developing time by 2 minutes which seems super excessive but works. I just don't know why.

Lisa, what camera, meter and exposure values are you getting in bright sunny conditions? Sounds like one of these might be off a bit.

-F.

 

[LisaU]

Thank you for your replies. I'm using a Nikon F100. For this roll I used A priority just to test but I've tried it with two different bodies and also a couple of different lenses. It's been an issue with both the 400 and the 800 ( pushed ) film all season. I was a little worried about exposure too but then I noticed that the roll numbers also look underdeveloped. I'm assuming it has to be a development issue. Like I said, I even tried two different types of film and mixing up different batches of stock solution just in case I might have mixed wrong for some reason ( although its really straightforward ). I'm stumped. I've tested the ph in my water and it looks fine as well. hmm....

 

[DanielStone]

just been experimenting with my own stuff (after using HC-110 mixed by school staff), mixing myself straight from the concentrate,

I seem to be getting good looking negs at 1/2oz HC : 31.5oz H20.

9min at 20deg C. negs seem to have good density, haven't been able to print yet though

sorry for the $ signs, i only have a trial version of my scanner's software, hence the watermarks

rough(totally unsharp scan, but pretty accurate for tonal range though, straight from the neg.

-Dan

 

[Arvee]

Thank you for your replies. I'm using a Nikon F100. For this roll I used A priority just to test but I've tried it with two different bodies and also a couple of different lenses. It's been an issue with both the 400 and the 800 ( pushed ) film all season. I was a little worried about exposure too but then I noticed that the roll numbers also look underdeveloped. I'm assuming it has to be a development issue. Like I said, I even tried two different types of film and mixing up different batches of stock solution just in case I might have mixed wrong for some reason ( although its really straightforward ). I'm stumped. I've tested the ph in my water and it looks fine as well. hmm....

Lisa,
For B dilution I use 15.625 ml of HC110 syrup in 485 ml of H2O or 7.8 ml of syrup in 242 ml for my working solution. Be sure you are using at least 6 ml of syrup per roll. Some folks go much lower, down to 3-4 ml per roll, but I think this is a mistake and will not fully develop the film. Steve Anchell, of Film Developing Cookbook, also suggests not skimping on developer.

Also, don't be too gentle on agitation.

-F.

 

[LisaU]

Thanks Fred. I'll try that for sure.

I usually mix up the stock solution and put it in smaller bottles since I dev. many rolls at this time of the year and it's the easiest. But, I think I will start using it from syrup like many suggest.

I'm thinking it may be the dev itself since it's the only variable that I can't control. This only started to happen around September and then I started adjusting to the problem by extending another 2 minutes of dev time. Because there is only one store on island and I get all my HC110 there, could it maybe be a case of dev. that got left out in the sun or maybe it's really old stock? I ordered some online so I'll see if that makes a difference. I'm just worried that I'll get a "good" bottle or something and then dev. 2 min over and get crazy contrast.

 

[LisaU]

This is the same store where I got a stock of really old ilford paper which was giving me random spots. I sent it in to Simon and he confirmed mold on the old paper. He was great help me figure that out. It was driving me absolutely bonkers.

 

[Larry.Manuel]

Testing developer

Lisa, HC-110 usually keeps a very long time, but yours could be stale.

[pasted from a previous posting of mine]:

Test fixer and developer before using: Put a large droplet of undiluted developer on film, in room light, and let stand 3-5 minutes, or to your taste. Then fix in room light [in a small dish works]. A very black spot indicates good developer activity, thin grey indicates tired developer. Nice clear film around the black spot indicates healthy fix.

Note: This works for developers that are usually diluted 1+1 to 1+9 or so. I think it will work on HC-110 in syrup form.

 

[MattKing]

Lisa, HC-110 usually keeps a very long time, but yours could be stale.

[pasted from a previous posting of mine]:

Test fixer and developer before using: Put a large droplet of undiluted developer on film, in room light, and let stand 3-5 minutes, or to your taste. Then fix in room light [in a small dish works]. A very black spot indicates good developer activity, thin grey indicates tired developer. Nice clear film around the black spot indicates healthy fix.

Note: This works for developers that are usually diluted 1+1 to 1+9 or so. I think it will work on HC-110 in syrup form.

HC-110 is unusual this way - you need to add some water for this to work.

Matt

 

[LisaU]

Thanks Matt and Larry. I'll try this tomorrow. It's driving me crazy and I have a few jobs that are waiting for me to figure this out. I'm sorry Henry for overrunning your thread.

 

[Arvee]

Thanks Fred. I'll try that for sure.

I usually mix up the stock solution and put it in smaller bottles since I dev. many rolls at this time of the year and it's the easiest. But, I think I will start using it from syrup like many suggest.

I'm thinking it may be the dev itself since it's the only variable that I can't control. This only started to happen around September and then I started adjusting to the problem by extending another 2 minutes of dev time. Because there is only one store on island and I get all my HC110 there, could it maybe be a case of dev. that got left out in the sun or maybe it's really old stock? I ordered some online so I'll see if that makes a difference. I'm just worried that I'll get a "good" bottle or something and then dev. 2 min over and get crazy contrast.

Hi Lisa,

If your bottle of syrup is sunshine yellow or slightly darker orangish color, it is most likely okay. HC110 syrup keeps a very long time. I have some that is 3 yrs old that works fine but an orangish color. Diluted (stock) solutions have a much shorter shelf life. Check the Kodak data sheet and I seem to remember that 2 months is about it. I believe this is why most of us dilute from syrup.

Good Luck!

 

[LisaU]

Fred, my bottle was bright yellow and so was the stock solution when we mixed it to working strength right before development. So now I'm back to square one. I've tried changing cameras, lenses, film, agitation, time, and developer. I can't seem to figure it out. The testing continues.

 

[Jung Hyun LEE]

Thank you. I'll develop by using your data.

 

[johnnywalker]

Does anyone know for sure that Ilford's LC29 and HC are the same formulation (or close enough) to HC-110? They seem to be not as concentrated, but any other differences? The Ilford products seem to be a little more readily available where I am (at least the LC-29). I'd like to standardize on one of these highly concentrated syrups in lieu of mixing powders, assuming the quality is still there.