Tungsten lights withouth the appropiate 80A filter

zehner21 · Sep 2, 2015

Hi,
since I haven't received my 80A filter for shooting under tungsten light, I was wondering if it advisable, anyway, to overexpose the film by two stops (as the filter factor is).
I was thinking that, doing in this way, the blue layer should receive enough exposure to let me remove the excess of red/orange light in order to obtain a correct color balanced print.
Thanks

benjiboy · Sep 2, 2015

No it isn't, you will still get the orange caste but the film will just be overexposed by two stops.

RPC · Sep 2, 2015

I have heard of this, but have never tried it, so don't know exactly how well it works, but I think the idea is that when exposed at box speed with tungsten light, some of the blue components of the scene that should lie on the linear portion of the characteristic curve instead lie on the toe due to underexposure of the blue sensitive layer of the film.

Adding say two stops of exposure will move everything up the curve by that much, and now the blue components will be moved up on the linear portion and will be recorded properly. The red exposure of the film, which was more than usual, should still be on the linear portion of the curve thanks to the dynamic range of the film.

When printing or sca**ing there will be more color correction necessary than usual due to the tungsten exposure, but a normal looking image should be achievable using this method.

Mainecoonmaniac · Sep 2, 2015

If you can, use tungsten balanced film or tungsten bulbs with a blue coating to balance it for daylight.

zehner21 · Sep 2, 2015

Mainecoonmaniac said:
If you can, use tungsten balanced film or tungsten bulbs with a blue coating to balance it for daylight.

Are there any tungsten balanced film on sale?

@RPC: Yes, that's what I was thinking about. Eventually I'll do my tests.

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chrisaisenbrey · Sep 3, 2015

Well the red (-sensitive) and perhaps the green layer gets overexposed. The blue layer gets the right exposure. In theory it should be possible to compensate this during printing.

BUT

The over-exposure reduces of cause the quality of the red layer and even worse the red layer might have another gamma (depending on how linear the curve is) and you get some crossover which cant be compensated with a simple filter. At the end it is also a matter of taste: Perhaps you like the result even if it is technically not the right colors.

There are the cinestill films which are tungsten balanced. But they are repacked cinefilms which are not designed for c41. You will find a lot of different opinions of this film here.

David Lyga · Sep 3, 2015

I regularly expose daylight color negative film in tungsten lighting without any filtration. The negatives require more red filtration when printing, but the quality of the printed image is excellent. Make certain that you know that color film is about two stops faster in tungsten lighting than traditional B&W film is. - David Lyga

Mainecoonmaniac · Sep 3, 2015

Yes it is available

zehner21 said:
Are there any tungsten balanced film on sale?

@RPC: Yes, that's what I was thinking about. Eventually I'll do my tests.

Inviato dal mio iPhone utilizzando Tapatalk

Transparency film.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/27474-USA/Kodak_8602492_EPY_135_36_Ektachrome_64T.html

Color negative film.

http://www.amazon.com/Kodak-Portra-100T-36-PORTRA/dp/B00005MEAX

DREW WILEY · Sep 3, 2015

You can also get blue polyester "gel" sheets made by Rosco etc to place of the lights, spaced at an appropriate distance from the heat of the
bulb, of course. These are fairly inexpensive because they do not need to be image-forming. Tungsten films are largely a thing of the past.
If you find any, it's probably out-dated anyway. Trying to overexpose color neg film and post correct it will yield some "interesting" (weird)
results. Don't go down that road.

Mainecoonmaniac · Sep 3, 2015

If you want to follow Drew's tip, it's Rosco CTB. But read check out this link for various degrees of daylight correction.

https://www.rosco.com/filters/cinegel.cfm?menuReturn=quickFilmTV&CategoryID=1

TimFox · Sep 3, 2015

Mainecoonmaniac said:
Transparency film.
http://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/27474-USA/Kodak_8602492_EPY_135_36_Ektachrome_64T.html

Color negative film.

http://www.amazon.com/Kodak-Portra-100T-36-PORTRA/dp/B00005MEAX

That bh link is to a film that has not been available for many years. EPY was a national treasure, but it is gone.

Mainecoonmaniac · Sep 3, 2015

Oooh sorry

TimFox said:
That bh link is to a film that has not been available for many years. EPY was a national treasure, but it is gone.

I used to shoot Fuji RTP and Kodak EPT all the time for clients. Right now, I shoot only BW film and I'm not a pro anymore. It been over 15 years since I shot tungsten film. I still have some very old stock on my fridge next to the veggies.

Xmas · Sep 3, 2015

You can still get 400 foot of Kodak cine.
And make up the processing kit from raw chemicals.
You need to remove the REMJET. And to soup for longer to get unto silver halide paper.

Is 500T too slow?
http://motion.kodak.com/motion/Products/Production/index.htm?CID=go&idhbx=vision3

GarageBoy · Sep 4, 2015

It's sold remjet stripped as 800T Cine Still
I wish labs would ECN2 it, though- am worried about long term stability

zehner21 · Sep 4, 2015

Xmas said:
You can still get 400 foot of Kodak cine.
And make up the processing kit from raw chemicals.
You need to remove the REMJET. And to soup for longer to get unto silver halide paper.

Is 500T too slow?
http://motion.kodak.com/motion/Products/Production/index.htm?CID=go&idhbx=vision3

The problem is that cine film is low in contrast and I print using only the enlarger.

Mainecoonmaniac · Sep 4, 2015

I've been amazed at the new LED technologies that have increased light intensity and have color temperatures of daylight. In the old days, the only alternatives were HMI and geled tungsten hotlights. But now, things have changed.

http://www.amazon.com/Bonlux-Daylight-Balanced-Temperature-Photography/dp/B00URUGMMI

DREW WILEY · Sep 4, 2015

LED's aren't quite there yet, especially at fifteen bucks a bulb. If it's sold on Amazon or in a Home Cheapo store, there will be a significant
BS Coefficient included in the specifications. Professional lighting is a different category than mass-distribution retail.

M Carter · Sep 6, 2015

Well, LED panels have come a long way and are finally getting to where I'm thinking of one for an interview light. But you'd want a quality model made for video and still use.

Biax fluorescents (pioneered for film use by Kino flo) are widely available and in most cases are pretty clean daylight - sometimes needing 1/8 minus green gel. I use them weekly. A 4-tube unit puts out about a 1000w tungsten equivalent but pulls only 220 watts (and that's at 5400k or so, no CTB needed). They can be found for under $200.

I too shot a ton of tungsten film, though my favorite was 320T pushed 2, 3 or 4 stops. The grain was like candy, beautiful stuff. I'd use a mix of tungsten fresnels and speedotron strobes with full CTO. Just an amazing film.

Mainecoonmaniac · Sep 6, 2015

So true about tungsten film

M Carter said:
The grain was like candy, beautiful stuff. I'd use a mix of tungsten fresnels and speedotron strobes with full CTO. Just an amazing film.

I also shot it outside under shade then gelled my strobe with full CTO. What ever the strobe light lit, the color was neutral in a sea of blue. It was a hot technique with fashion photos in the 90's.

Tungsten lights withouth the appropiate 80A filter

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