Tungsten film that requires an 85B filter AND an 81A filter together?

StoneNYC · Nov 28, 2014

I was researching some sheet film I had bought a while ago in preparation for a color printing class.

I was reading the literature on it and it says for daylight shooting for this tungsten film that requires an 85B filter AND an 81A filter together, which seems odd.

It's Fuji RTP

This is the data sheet.

http://www.fujifilmusa.com/shared/bin/T64_PIB.pdf

Thanks for any info/clarification.

Truzi · Nov 28, 2014

Okay, I don't know what I'm talking about, but...

The data sheet seems to suggest that combination for daylight, but an 85b alone for flash. From what little I understand of these things, it does seem perhaps a little odd, but not totally weird. I imagine that daylight is not equivalent to flash when dealing with a tungsten film. I would trust the data sheet.

Better comments will surely follow, and will satisfy my curiosity so long as they are not over my head, lol.

MattKing · Nov 28, 2014

Blue sky illumination is more blue than general "daylight", so for this film an 85B is too blue. You need to add a filter to warm it up.
There may be an "85" filter that could do the job alone, but I don't know of it.

In days gone by, we were used to encountering a variety of tungsten light sources, and picking films to match.

StoneNYC · Nov 28, 2014

MattKing said:
Blue sky illumination is more blue than general "daylight", so for this film an 85B is too blue. You need to add a filter to warm it up.
There may be an "85" filter that could do the job alone, but I don't know of it.

In days gone by, we were used to encountering a variety of tungsten light sources, and picking films to match.

Hmm this may have been a type for possible making an interneg? Maybe that's why it's not totally "standard" Tungsten?

Thanks.

As for the other answers, wow that second reply was depressing....

Also, I don't do "correcting it later in Photoshop" I get it right in camera.

Also I'm betting the film is just fine, it's not that old and it's slow, and has been frozen almost its entire life.

We shall see... Now I need an 81A in 77mm

Xmas · Nov 28, 2014

I read it that it says use a colour temp meter...

And then suggests if you don't have one.

use one filter for diffuse white cloud
two for middle of death valley zero cloud

It is a film for fash girly mag photos where the color accuracy was uber critical and the printer would be given the materials to match exactly with a grey card in shot to be cropped.

I found that some people had perfect colour like perfect pitch and could detect colour film errors weeks later when they saw the rush of their wedding shots.

Do they use colour temp meters on cine shots?

MattKing · Nov 28, 2014

StoneNYC said:
Hmm this may have been a type for possible making an interneg? Maybe that's why it's not totally "standard" Tungsten?

Thanks.

As for the other answers, wow that second reply was depressing....

Also, I don't do "correcting it later in Photoshop" I get it right in camera.

Also I'm betting the film is just fine, it's not that old and it's slow, and has been frozen almost its entire life.

We shall see... Now I need an 81A in 77mm

This is/was a transparency film - not an internegative film.

You were expected to either project it, view it on a light table, or submit it to your client for their needs (think brochures or bus stop ads).

It was fine tuned to 3200K tungsten illumination. Which is to be contrasted with tungsten illumination of slightly different colour temperature.

When this film was current, one could go into a high end photo supplier and choose between photo floods of different colour temperature.

The 85B filter is exactly matched to films which were intended for photo floods and other tungsten sources which are/were of a slightly different colour temperature. Quite possibly, Kodak vs. Fuji materials.

And as for APUGuser19's post, you too Stone might become old and jaded with change over time. Or maybe not

StoneNYC · Nov 28, 2014

Xmas said:
I read it that it says use a colour temp meter...

And then suggests if you don't have one.

use one filter for diffuse white cloud
two for middle of death valley zero cloud

It is a film for fash girly mag photos where the color accuracy was uber critical and the printer would be given the materials to match exactly with a grey card in shot to be cropped.

I found that some people had perfect colour like perfect pitch and could detect colour film errors weeks later when they saw the rush of their wedding shots.

Do they use colour temp meters on cine shots?

Yes they do have color temp meters on movie sets, definitely, they have to match color perfectly between scenes, days, angles etc.

StoneNYC · Nov 28, 2014

MattKing said:
This is/was a transparency film - not an internegative film.

You were expected to either project it, view it on a light table, or submit it to your client for their needs (think brochures or bus stop ads).

It was fine tuned to 3200K tungsten illumination. Which is to be contrasted with tungsten illumination of slightly different colour temperature.

When this film was current, one could go into a high end photo supplier and choose between photo floods of different colour temperature.

The 85B filter is exactly matched to films which were intended for photo floods and other tungsten sources which are/were of a slightly different colour temperature. Quite possibly, Kodak vs. Fuji materials.

And as for APUGuser19's post, you too Stone might become old and jaded with change over time. Or maybe not

Thanks,

CDU II is an E6 film and is for making internegs isn't it?

StoneNYC · Nov 28, 2014

APUGuser19 said:
Jaded? No. Disappointed, yes. I wish that was still the technology today. Unfortunately the film is now outdated ebay junk with no new film being offered. Here I am at my age studying real estate because this business now belongs to the Computer. Computers and digital cameras are NOT photography. You can quote me on that. That's my story and I'm sticking to it.I didn't leave the business. It left me.

This isn't eBay crap, it came from a trusted forum member.

Xmas · Nov 28, 2014

StoneNYC said:
Yes they do have color temp meters on movie sets, definitely, they have to match color perfectly between scenes, days, angles etc.

Yes I recall you needed tanning as well and I've spent happy time watching a Bollywood leading lady being 'painted'.

The filters hold the (correct) grey card at optimal and give optimal dynamic range (ie balancing both).

If the film is old you probably need a different correction a difficult trade off.

Somewhere I have a set of CC filters with just a trace of colour - in 40mm for Canon LTM.

eddie · Nov 28, 2014

If I recall correctly, Joel Meyerowitz shot 8x10 tungsten (unfiltered) for Cape Light. I remember doing this in college, because I liked the muted tones he got with this method, but printing them (for me, anyway) was a bit more difficult than non-tungsten negatives.

MattKing · Nov 28, 2014

StoneNYC said:
Thanks,

CDU II is an E6 film and is for making internegs isn't it?

Nope.

If my internet searches respecting what CDU II is are correct, that is a dupli\cating film.

You use it to make duplicate transparencies.

Arklatexian · Nov 28, 2014

Back when I used tungsten color, I tried to always buy Type "B" tungsten film and only use 3200K photoflood lights. My memory tells me that the 85B was all you needed to use that film outdoors. It sounds to me as if the film here is balanced for 3400K (No.2 & No.1 photofloods) and needs the extra filter to correctly balance that film to daylight.

wildbill · Nov 28, 2014

Just put on an 85 filter and be done with it.

StoneNYC · Nov 28, 2014

MattKing said:
Nope.

If my internet searches respecting what CDU II is are correct, that is a dupli\cating film.

You use it to make duplicate transparencies.

It is a slide duplicating film...

Looks like E-6 to me

StoneNYC · Nov 28, 2014

Oh!!!!!!! Ugh......

Slide duplication makes a copy not interneg... Wow I'm slow...

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