Trials and tribulations of Pan F plus and Rodinal

[Brian Jeffery]

As a number of people on this site seem to like rodinal I thought I'd try it with Pan F plus. So whilst I was at Silverprint the other day I purchased some Pan F and some of the recently re-introduced Rodinal.

After a trip to Manchester I duly had a film to develop. I thought I'd try stand development: something I've not done before. After reading through the APUG forums I tried Rodinal diluted at 1:200 for 90 minutes with 10 seconds initial agitation and a single agitation halfway through. Results, the film was distinctly over developed.

After another trip to Manchester I had another film to develop. Well, I thought, I'd try Ilford's recommendations: Rodinal 1:50 for 11 minutes at 20 degrees C. Results, another film over developed.

Right, back to the drawing board. I decided to conduct some personal film speed and development tests. Something I should have done in the first place.

After reading some other forums I decided to try the following stand development: Rodinal 1:250 with for 2 hours with 30 seconds intitial agitation only. Result, over developed.

Next I repeated the above test but for 1 hour...

Whilst that film was souping, I developed another film with an Ilford style development. That is, 10 seconds of agitation every minute. I decided to use a 1:100 dilution for 10 minutes 30 seconds. (Someone recommended it on a thread somewhere).

The results of the tests:

Ilford style development resulted in a film speed of 40 I.E whilst the time of 10' 30'' was pretty spot on.

Stand development resulted in a film speed of 50 I.E and the time of an hour was also pretty close. Just a little under developed.


So,

Is the new Rodinal, as produced by A&O, different to the old Rodinal as I've had to reduce the development by staggering amount? (In the case of the Ilford style development I've halved the dilution and reduced time by 30 seconds)

Which of the two development methods should I use; normal agitation or Stand? Decisions, decisions.

For anyone who's interested I've developed the film for use with a colour enlarger head, read the density of the negative using an analyser pro and use the densities from table on p. 288 of "Way Beyond Monochrom" by Ralph W. Lambrect and Chris Woodhouse.


sorry to go on,


Brian

 

[Gerald Koch]

If you are unfamiliar with Pan-F and Rodinal, why don't you start out by using a standard dilution. Check the Massive Development Chart for recommendations.

Pan-F builds contrast very fast so try not to over-develop this film.

 

[Kobin]

I use the time and dilution found at the unblinking eye website under articles:

http://unblinkingeye.com/Articles/Developers/Times_Rodinal/times_rodinal.html

Works fine for me.

K.

 

[Markok765]

i find it at iso 25 for 12 min in rodinal 1:50 with gentle agitation, once per min, it turns out well

 

[reellis67]

I really like Pan F+ in Rodinal, but my typical dilution is 1:100. I do use stand development (1:200 @ 1 hour), but not with negatives that have a good deal of smooth gradation as I've read that stand can cause mottling in these areas (although I've never seen it myself - because I've never tested). Stand development gives different results than using 'regular' agitation methods and I find that some subject benefit from the effects of stand development and others are better suited to a more regular agitation method.

If I were just starting with this film and developer combo, I would stick with the plain-jane times and dilutions for the first few rolls until I got a good feel for what results can be achieved with that method, and then start working other ideas in one change at a time, paying close attention to the changes they produced compared to the initial results.

- Randy

 

[Steve Roberts]

Is the new Rodinal, as produced by A&O, different to the old Rodinal as I've had to reduce the development by staggering amount? (In the case of the Ilford style development I've halved the dilution and reduced time by 30 seconds)

Seems to me, Brian, that you need to shoot a roll of PanF, chop it in half and develop one in "old" Rodinal and the other in the "new" type for a definitive answer.

I have only the old type, but your message is perhaps a warning to check the characteristics of new Rodinal before committing anything important to it.

Steve

 

[Jim Chinn]

I am still working with the "old" rodinal so I will have to remeber to do some tests when I run out and start to use the new stuff.

With the old I have always got good negs EI 50/10min @ 20c and EI 25/8min @ 20c.

 

[Petzi]

I am still working with the "old" rodinal so I will have to remeber to do some tests when I run out and start to use the new stuff.

Folks, this is a myth. There has never been a change to Agfa Rodinal. There is no "old" or "new" Rodinal.

 

[Markok765]

yes, i use my 10 year old bottle and my new bottle and the results come out the same

 

[Petzi]

yes, i use my 10 year old bottle and my new bottle and the results come out the same

This is another product feature of Rodinal.

 

[Brian Jeffery]

I'm sorry if I've mislead people, but I've never used the original Rodinal (pre A&O). I just wondered if there was a difference to account between my personal development times and those published by Agfa/Ilford.

Brian

 

[Tom Stanworth]

As a semi relevant topic....I have found that using ilfosol S with this film I get beautiful negs but horrendous probelms with stubborn air bubbles which seem harder to dislodge than I have ever experienced. I litteraly have to hammer the tank so hard on the ground to remove them that I am concerned about breaking the tank. A couple of bangs wont work. I have to severely thump a totally solid floor and even then I still have probs. Is this a Pan F 'ism' or something to do with this developer or combination? Does this problem occur with Rodinal?

 

[srs5694]

I don't recall ever seeing evidence of air bells with my Pan F+ film. I've developed it with D-76, XTOL, PC-Glycol, DS-12, and Rodinal, but never with Ilfosol S. I generally use a stainless steel tank with Hewes reels today, but I began with a plastic AP tank and I developed some rolls of Pan F+ in it.

 

[reellis67]

I've never seen this problem with Rodinal or Pan F+. Have you tried a pre-soak by any chance? Ilford states that a presoak is not needed, but if you are having problems with air bubbles, it might be worth the attempt. I can't imagine that it could hurt anything at any rate.

- Randy