TOYO 4X5 Cut Film Holder Question.

[sherpa]

Fist Time Use TOYO 4X5 Cut Film Holder...I dON'T Know Wnatis it? Two Small hook ?What is function?

 

[colrehogan]

They are to ensure that the darkslides remain in place. Turn one to cover one darkslide and turn the other to cover the opposite darkslide. Then you cannot accidentally remove the darkslide and expose your film.

 

[Roger Hicks]

Go to www.rogerandfrances.com; then to the Photo School; then to 'How do I...?; and finally to '...use cut-film holders?'

That will (I hope) answer all your questions, and more. And it's free.

Cheers,

R.

 

[sherpa]

Thanks colrehogan

 

[reellis67]

I seems like some people cut these off, which is very annoying when buying used holders. I've ruined 6-8 sheets, mostly ones that have been exposed, when using holders that have had these removed. I go to pull the holder out of my bag and inevitably the dark slide gets pulled up just enough to expose the film...

- Randy

 

[jstraw]

I seems like some people cut these off, which is very annoying when buying used holders. I've ruined 6-8 sheets, mostly ones that have been exposed, when using holders that have had these removed. I go to pull the holder out of my bag and inevitably the dark slide gets pulled up just enough to expose the film...

- Randy

I recently acquired ten, otherwise lovely Fidelity Elites that had the retainers removed. I use a heavy rubber band around the whole holder, lengthwise to ensure that I don't pull a darkslide while removing a holder fro my film bag.

 

[reellis67]

that's a good idea, thanks! I've been frustrated with them opening like that and the rubber band idea sounds better than selling them and trying to buy others, testing, re-taping, etc. all over again.

- Randy

 

[jstraw]

I feel guilty about one thing I do with my holders. I recently adopted the system of indexing them with needle files which has proven enormously useful. Looking at a contact sheet, I knew immediately which of several, similar sheets I'm looking at, and I know what holder was employed...in the event of a holder problem.

But I can't help feel I've "ruined" all of my holders. I may not be their last owner. I was the first owner of none of my holders. The next potential owner may not want them indexed or they may not be indexed compatibly with their indexing system.

 

[Sanjay Sen]

I seems like some people cut these off, which is very annoying when buying used holders. I've ruined 6-8 sheets, mostly ones that have been exposed, when using holders that have had these removed. I go to pull the holder out of my bag and inevitably the dark slide gets pulled up just enough to expose the film...

- Randy

The exact same thing happened to me also, so I got rid of those holders without the pins and got new ones that have the locking pins. For 4x5, I prefer and use only the Fidelity-Riteway that have the locking buttons. Recently I got some 8x10 holders and one holder has a pin missing.

 

[Bandicoot]

My favourite holders for 4x5 are Arca-Swiss branded ones based on Fidelity Riteways. They have little locking buttons for the slides that stop them being pulled out accidentally: the button gets pushed in by the camera when the holder is loaded into the back, so the slide can then be pulled out easily.

The A-S ones add another 'tweak' that saves me getting out the needle files. Each holder is numbered, and the numbers are repeated on a tiny transparent strip set into the rebate area on one edge of the film. The number on the holder thus also appears 'printed' on the edge of the film. Very nice


Peter

 

[roteague]

I have to admit that I've bought all my holders new, so I've never run into this problem.

 

[jstraw]

My favourite holders for 4x5 are Arca-Swiss branded ones based on Fidelity Riteways. They have little locking buttons for the slides that stop them being pulled out accidentally: the button gets pushed in by the camera when the holder is loaded into the back, so the slide can then be pulled out easily.

The A-S ones add another 'tweak' that saves me getting out the needle files. Each holder is numbered, and the numbers are repeated on a tiny transparent strip set into the rebate area on one edge of the film. The number on the holder thus also appears 'printed' on the edge of the film. Very nice


Peter

Very very cool...two questions. How do you get unique numbers and what do those babies cost?

 

[Bandicoot]

re. Arca-Swiss frame-numbering film holders

Very very cool...two questions. How do you get unique numbers and what do those babies cost?

Well... You can order them from A-S and tell them what numbers you want (I think they still make them). That presupposes that you have deep pockets however.

I acquired a few with rather miscellaneous numbers along with a camera I bought second hand. Once I'd found how nice they were I simply started looking out for more on *Bay. It only took about two or three years to fill in the numbers so that I now have a set of ten consecutively numbered holders - frames 1-20. Some sellers list the numbers in their listings, others had to be asked.

Bought that way, they didn't cost any more than ordinary Fidelity or Riteway holders in similar condition would have cost me. I suspect that a consecutive set would sell for a lot more than the sum of buying them as odd numbers would though. I wasn't short of (ordinary) holders to begin with, so I didn't mind the fact that it took some time to acquire the A-S ones: they're nice enough to have been worth the wait.


Peter

 

[jstraw]

Well... You can order them from A-S and tell them what numbers you want (I think they still make them). That presupposes that you have deep pockets however.

I acquired a few with rather miscellaneous numbers along with a camera I bought second hand. Once I'd found how nice they were I simply started looking out for more on *Bay. It only took about two or three years to fill in the numbers so that I now have a set of ten consecutively numbered holders - frames 1-20. Some sellers list the numbers in their listings, others had to be asked.

Bought that way, they didn't cost any more than ordinary Fidelity or Riteway holders in similar condition would have cost me. I suspect that a consecutive set would sell for a lot more than the sum of buying them as odd numbers would though. I wasn't short of (ordinary) holders to begin with, so I didn't mind the fact that it took some time to acquire the A-S ones: they're nice enough to have been worth the wait.


Peter

Thanks. None on the bay currently...

 

[Sal Santamaura]

As far as I know there's nothing special about Arca-Swiss' version of the Riteway holders. Available brand new from Calumet for $30:

http://www.calumetphoto.com/item/RW4500K/

I don't particularly care for the number wheels, which tend to rotate sporadically. Also, if the image has low values where the wheels are, there won't be any numbers recorded on film. Note that Linhof cameras are reportedly incompatible with these holders.

 

[jstraw]

As far as I know there's nothing special about Arca-Swiss' version of the Riteway holders. Available brand new from Calumet for $30:

http://www.calumetphoto.com/item/RW4500K/

I don't particularly care for the number wheels, which tend to rotate sporadically. Also, if the image has low values where the wheels are, there won't be any numbers recorded on film. Note that Linhof cameras are reportedly incompatible with these holders.

I've never seen them but the description was not for wheels and that the numbers appear in the rebate.

Are you thinking of Grafmatics?

 

[Roger Hicks]

Very very cool...two questions. How do you get unique numbers and what do those babies cost?

Linhof used to do something similar with tiny number squares -- the number was perforated straight through the metal -- and one trick a friend tried many years ago was to make up missing numbers with tiny little liths of the numbers he wanted. It was successful but fiddly.

Cheers,

R.

 

[k_jupiter]

I feel guilty about one thing I do with my holders. I recently adopted the system of indexing them with needle files which has proven enormously useful. Looking at a contact sheet, I knew immediately which of several, similar sheets I'm looking at, and I know what holder was employed...in the event of a holder problem.

But I can't help feel I've "ruined" all of my holders. I may not be their last owner. I was the first owner of none of my holders. The next potential owner may not want them indexed or they may not be indexed compatibly with their indexing system.

You callows bahstad. Now in penance, you will send me all your modified film holders, I will send you a check for $1.00 a piece plus actual shipping. I can't believe you have done this to those holders.

Please also send your file key so I can integrate it with my own self filed film holders and not make any mistakes.

tim in san jose

 

[Bandicoot]

Arca-Swiss numbered film holders

I don't particularly care for the number wheels, which tend to rotate sporadically. Also, if the image has low values where the wheels are, there won't be any numbers recorded on film. Note that Linhof cameras are reportedly incompatible with these holders.

These are not number wheels, each holder is individually numbered - hence the need to buy/find/make-up a set. The numbers are in the rebate area and don't intrude on the image. You are right that if there are low image values there nothing will show up, but in my use of the holders I've found it pretty rare for the numbers to be entirely unintelligible.

I hadn't heard about any Linhof incompatibility - not a problem for me personally.

Linhof used to do something similar with tiny number squares -- the number was perforated straight through the metal -- and one trick a friend tried many years ago was to make up missing numbers with tiny little liths of the numbers he wanted. It was successful but fiddly.

The Sinar Zoom back has narrow slots above and below the image area that are designed for a similar idea using lith film. These are long enough that they will accomodate a name and copyright info. Very fiddly, as you say, and I've never actually bothered to do it.



Peter

 

[Sal Santamaura]

I've never seen them but the description was not for wheels and that the numbers appear in the rebate.

Are you thinking of Grafmatics?

No, not Grafmatics. I've never seen a 602002 film holder, but would be very surprised if Arca Swiss manufactures its own. Arca roll film holders are re-badged Horsemans; Sinar sells standard sheet film holders with adhesive added. This approach (modification to use inserts rather than Riteway's standard wheels) would make much more sense for a small firm like Arca than setting up injection molds to satisfy a tiny potential demand.

 

[Sanjay Sen]

As far as I know there's nothing special about Arca-Swiss' version of the Riteway holders. Available brand new from Calumet for $30:

http://www.calumetphoto.com/item/RW4500K/

I don't particularly care for the number wheels, which tend to rotate sporadically. Also, if the image has low values where the wheels are, there won't be any numbers recorded on film. Note that Linhof cameras are reportedly incompatible with these holders.

I personally prefer these holders because of the locking buttons - the number wheels are an added benefit. But, as you mentioned, the wheels turn on their own sometimes and do not retain the number you set them at.

 

[jstraw]

No, not Grafmatics. I've never seen a 602002 film holder, but would be very surprised if Arca Swiss manufactures its own. Arca roll film holders are re-badged Horsemans; Sinar sells standard sheet film holders with adhesive added. This approach (modification to use inserts rather than Riteway's standard wheels) would make much more sense for a small firm like Arca than setting up injection molds to satisfy a tiny potential demand.

Man, I'm confused. Maybe because I've never had a Fidelity Riteway in my hands but my perception is that they employ neither wheels or inserts.

I don't even know what "602002" refers to.

 

[Sal Santamaura]

Man, I'm confused. Maybe because I've never had a Fidelity Riteway in my hands but my perception is that they employ neither wheels or inserts.

I don't even know what "602002" refers to.

Michael,

602002 is the Arca-Swiss catalog number for its 4x5 holder. Riteway holders, as seen in the Calumet link I posted above, use two number wheels that put an identifier from 00 - 99 in the rebate area, image brightness permitting.

 

[jstraw]

Bandicoot says the A-S holders don't use wheels. You say that the F-R holders are the same holders and use wheels. *shrug*

 

[Bandicoot]

No, not Grafmatics. I've never seen a 602002 film holder, but would be very surprised if Arca Swiss manufactures its own. Arca roll film holders are re-badged Horsemans; Sinar sells standard sheet film holders with adhesive added. This approach (modification to use inserts rather than Riteway's standard wheels) would make much more sense for a small firm like Arca than setting up injection molds to satisfy a tiny potential demand.

That's why I noted in my initial post in this thread that they are based on Fidelity Riteways.

The difference, with my A-S holders, is the fixed numbers rather than rotating wheels. Less flexible, perhaps, but they can't get moved and thereby cause confusion.


Peter