Took the plunge and entered home developing - please help the newbie!

I started a thread about Ilford FP4+ a while back and I was very happy with the feedback and answers received from this most knowledgeable of internet forums.

I have decided to start developing my own B&W film. I have been shooting colour film for some years now but I entered a mono phase recently - I just love the look of silver-based film. Having recently purchased a d1g1t@l SLR I figured home developing of mono film would complement it well.

So I put in a big order at AG Photographic, a large traditional photographic retailer here in the UK. Here are the goodies:

Paterson Universal Developing Tank + additional reel
D-76 in powder form (I heard that powders were not ideal for small batches - is this the case?)
Ilfostop 500ml or so
Kodak Powder fixer (again, would liquid fixer have been a better choice? I guess it's a bit late now)
9" Thermometer
Storage bottles
FP4+ (35mm, 10 rolls)
HP5+ (2x35mm, 1x120)
Ektar 100 (35mm, 5x)
100 neg storage pages

Total came to around £130 which isn't a bad deal at all considering how long it will keep me going for.

A few questions: which of the chemicals can be re-used? Do I need replenishers? Any precautions for storage/will they deteriorate over time?

I have a roll of FP4+ in my Yashica Electro 35 at the moment, it'll be the first roll that I develop myself. I'll post results asap!

All help much appreciated

Alex

I've used powdered D76 - mixed a large batch (5L from memory) and process my film happily. I keep track of how many films I develop and then throw when it's reached the maximum. When I used Atomal FF I used to replenish and it lasted me forever! Still have some bags of the stuff that I was given, just waiting to use up the D76.

Fixer seems to keep on going - like the Duracell bunny! Again, it will deplete after multiple uses - I keep track of the number of films processed as well, plus I do a leader test every so often. This simply consists of snipping a piece of unexposed film (not TMAX) and dropping it into a small batch of fixer. Typically it will take about 2 mins to clear - any longer and I know the fixer is exhausted. Never used powdered form, but I have quite a few bottles that I was given and not yet started to use that all seem fine.

Best to keep in airtight containers (as much as you can) and store in a cool, dark place. Amber bottles help, but my darkroom is purpose built - once the light is out and the door is closed, it's dark until I go in again, so amber or clear - you can't tell the difference.

All can be used again, the stop bath (is it indicator?) will change colour to purple when exhausted (if it is). If you really want to be safe, just use the developer and fixer as "one shot"; use it once and then dispose.

Enjoy!

Alex...

1) You forgot to buy a wetting agent, like Kodak's Photo-flo, or Ilford's Ilfotol.

2) You bought a powder, non-rapid, hardening fixer. A rapid, non-hardening fixer would have been the best choice, like Ilford's Rapid, or Hypam. Film will take more time to fix and you'll need to wash longer. Modern mainstream films (Kodak, Ilford, Fuji) don't require a hardening fixer.

Fixer and stop bath can be reused. Ilfostop has an indicator dye, which will turn purple once it's exhausted, so you know when to toss it. Fixer can also be reused. The bag will probably state the capacity in 36exp films per US gallon/litre or something similar. If you want to be on the safe side, make the solution and do the "leader test". Take a piece of film (the leader is a fine choice), put a drop of fixer on it and leave it there for 1-2'. You'll notice that a clear spot is formed. Then immerse the film in a graduate with fixer and stir every 30''. Count how much time it takes so that the spot and the rest of the film are equally clear. In the end you shouldn't be able to see the spot. Multiply that time by 2 or 3* and that's your film fixing time. Clear film isn't properly fixed film. You need to do that test periodically (actually, every time you process film isn't a bad idea) and monitor the time it takes to clear film, with the same film (you may sacrifice a roll for that purpose). When the "clearing time" doubles, it's time to discard your fixer and make a new solution

I wouldn't recommend reusing D76 without replenishment. I wouldn't recommend replenishing developer to beginners either. For that reason, dilute D76 with an equal part of water and discard after use. It's a good way to use it, you won't have problems finding development times and you can get fine results consistently. Trust me, consistency matters.

*It's hard to "overfix film", but going beyond 3 times the clearing time serves no purpose. Fixing for more that twice the clearing time will also remove more of the dyes that films have (see sticky thread about magenta cast, Tmax etc).

I agree about D-76 - use it diluted, one part stock solution to one part water, and discard after use. Not only will you get more consistency, you'll also get better sharpness (at the expense of a slight increase in grain).

As to whether D-76 is better than liquid developers, or worse, consider this: if you buy a liquid developer you're buying a lot of water and shipping all that water around. Presumably you have your own water supply.

Powdered chemicals must be mixed up in their entirety for reasons of consistency, but if you keep D-76 in full, closed bottles, it will last a good six months.

Incidentally, if it's less expensive, consider Ilford's ID-11 which is identical in function to D-76. Because it's in metric packaging, I've always preferred it to D-76. (The smaller D-76 package has been one litre for the last few years, instead of one US quart, but I don't like US measurements being shoved down my throat, and I work in metric anyway, so I always prefer metric packaging.)

So from what I gather I'll dilute ALL of the developer and fixer powders and store them in the bottles, instead of using a little powder at a time. Is this correct?

Alex1994 said:

So from what I gather I'll dilute ALL of the developer and fixer powders and store them in the bottles, instead of using a little powder at a time. Is this correct?

Click to expand...

Yes.

Alex1994 said:

So from what I gather I'll dilute ALL of the developer and fixer powders and store them in the bottles, instead of using a little powder at a time. Is this correct?

Click to expand...

Dissolve rather than dilute, just in case you meant that wording on purpose. The stock solutions are more stable when stored at their intended stock strength. D76 is a great choice as it is versatile and is generally the comparison point for alternative developers as you venture forward someday.

craigclu said:

Dissolve rather than dilute, just in case you meant that wording on purpose. The stock solutions are more stable when stored at their intended stock strength. D76 is a great choice as it is versatile and is generally the comparison point for alternative developers as you venture forward someday.

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Yes, dissolve ;-)

Looks like you have all the bases covered, now you need to start. The only thing I see you need to do is follow all the directions supplied by the manufacturers for mixing the chems. After that, write out a step by step processing plan that you can read while processing, so you dont get confused and keep everything in order. You also must have an accurate thermometer, this is a must for consistant results. Take notes of everything you do from exposure through printing, aids in developing good skills as a photographer, and repeatable results.

Fixer and Stop Bath can be reused. You may want to get some hypo-check to be able to check to see when the fixer is all done. If it's Kodak's stop bath, it will turn bright purple when used up. You will also need to have some kind of measuring beakers to get the chemicals prepared to put in the film tank. If you have three, one for each of the basic chemicals, you can prep them all ahead of time. Possibly a thermometer if your location isn't kept around 20 degrees. You're looking very good though. Best of luck to you! It is a magical experience. (Printing is 10 times more magical )

Also, the chemicals should be good for about a month or two. If the D-76 turns odd colors, it is definatly done.

D76 has been around a long time. There's a good reason for that. If there are problems mixing it up in small batches, it's taking more than the forty years I've been using the stuff for me to find out what these problems are! Powder developers are nowhere near the hassle that some would have you believe. Like others, I use it in 1+1 and treat it as one-shot, but I've found the shelf life to be very good.

I don't bother with those squeezy concertina bottles, there's evidence they're a waste of time as far as reducing oxidation is concerned. Instead I use brown glass bottles (the brown probably isn't important) with capacities of 200ml to 500ml, as these correspond well to the volumes I need for my developing tanks. I also got into the habit of using a water bath to equilibrate stuff before starting a session. The dev tank sits in the 20C water bath throughout processing, which makes keeping the developer temperature constant very easy.

I've nothing against stop baths, I just don't use them. The Paterson tanks fill and empty very quickly, and it only takes me seconds to do two rinses (from a bottle already in the water bath for the purpose). Replenishment is only something you want to get in to if you're doing very high volumes of processing, because the components of a developer get exhausted at different rates, so replenishers have different concentrations from the native stock. I think if you're using D76 stock a second time, the increase in processing time is 10%. It's not worth the hassle, which is why most are recommending 1+1 as one-shot. Kodak's D76 is, incidentally, the same formulation as Ilford's ID11.

FP4 in D76... classic.

Thanks for the info, looks like I should be fine - can't wait to start developing!

Have a look at the Ilford Harman website. There's a really concise guide to getting started (along with loads of other useful stuff. It's obviously aimed at Ilford materials but the process is the same whatever.
http://www.ilfordphoto.com/applications/download.asp?n=386

Rob

Welcome to the club!

I am new to film and development things, and i came here and people helped me about starting developing my own at home, very helpful here, and i am happy so far with my developing even i just started and didn't do much yet, we we are in the same boat, and i think D-76 will be my next [second] developer to use

Two Strengths - Maybe Three

Alex1994 said:

So from what I gather I'll dilute ALL of the developer and
fixer powders and store them in the bottles, instead of
using a little powder at a time. Is this correct?

Click to expand...

WORKING strengths are used for processing. Often they
are derived by dilution from stores of STOCK strength.
CONCENTRATES may be diluted to STOCK or directly
to WORKING strength.

As as a GENERAL RULE photo chemistry should be kept as
long as possible and practical at it's greatest concentration.

For example, I use the dry 'concentrate' sodium thiosulfate
for my fixer, film and paper. It is quick and easy to mix.
The WORKING strength solution is prepared at time of
use. Photo Flo, some developers, and stop baths are
further examples of CONCENTRATES being diluted
to WORKING strengths at time of use.

For many darkroom workers there is no need to store any
large full or partially full bottles of chemistry. Dan

If somebody's already given this advice and I've missed it, my apologies: In addition to buying a wetting agent (Kodak Photo Flo or whatever), you might want to pick up some hypo clearing agent (HCA). This is a substance that will greatly reduce wash times, particularly if you're using something like the Kodak fixer you bought. Without HCA, wash times with an acid hardening fixer are on the order of 20 minutes, IIRC; but with HCA, it's a short rinse followed by a 2-minute bath in the HCA and then a 5-minute wash. HCA is pretty inexpensive and it helps stave off the boredom that results from 20 minutes of filling and dumping your tank, not to mention saving water.

reusing

i reuse d76, tmax, etc. add 15sec develop time for each roll of 120 equiv. after 10 rolls make a new batch. i use an index card to track it. similar to a shot card, except you keep the batch mix date, the type of batch, and mark you roll id and the time you used for each roll. then add 15sec to whetever you are planning to use for development time for each roll you have developed. so if you are on roll 3, you need to add 30sec to this roll. if normal time was 6.5min and you dont want to push, you then add the 30 sec and thats your time 7min. be sure to always use clean containers and dont leave them open. keep your camera film transports clean. dust and dirt in your camera goes on your film, then in your chemicals, then on your next film, etc etc. go to the web site for the films you will use and download their tech papers. read them and emulsion tech papers when you cant shoot or develop and youll learn all kinds of stuff. also batch cards, like shots cards also serve the purpose of slowing you down and letting you think. mark chemicals clearly, take notes, enjoy the process.

fixer lasts a while but you will get sick of waiting on old slow fixer. stop bath keeps on going but an indicator version is best because it does last a while and you need to be notified when its spent.

great info thus far

think all the bases have been covered re. chemicals, temperature, note taking, etc. one thing you want to pay attention to is technique! follow the instruction to start and if your you may need to adjust. some people agitate more/less vigorously than others, for instance. (I'm in the former category).

This has a direct impact on the quality of your negative. So you may need to adjust...

good luck - it's great fun!!!

Thanks for the pointers. AG Photo were all out of Kodak Fixer&Hardener so I swapped to Ilford Rapid Fixer which costs exactly the same.

OK so all the stuff on my shopping list has arrived and I have an exposed roll of FP125 dying to be developed - I'll get started this evening once it's dark and should have photos up by midnight.

One last thing: since I'm only developing 1 roll in a 2-roll tank, should I only fill the tank half way?

Alex1994 said:

One last thing: since I'm only developing 1 roll in a 2-roll tank, should I only fill the tank half way?

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I've seen advice both ways on this. Personally, I only put in enough solution to cover whatever reel(s) I use, plus a little for safety. That's 250 ml for my stainless steel tank when using just one reel, but most plastic tanks require more -- perhaps 300 or 350 ml. Check the tank's directions for details. Especially with plastic tanks, though, you should use both reels or otherwise ensure that the reel won't migrate upward on its spindle. This isn't as much of an issue with SS tanks and reels, but I generally put in a "spacer" reel atop the one that's in use to keep the in-use reel from bouncing up and down when I agitate.

Alex1994 said:

...One last thing: since I'm only developing 1 roll in a 2-roll tank, should I only fill the tank half way?

Click to expand...

Well, prepare to get different answers! Some will say it doesn't matter, as long as there are enough chemicals to cover the reel and a bit more to be on the safe side. Others will freak out with the thought of it. I've done it, many times actually, and I didn't notice anything wrong. What you need to make sure though, is to prevent the reel from moving upwards. Your tank might have a collar for the central column (tube). If so, put the reel and then put the collar. That should prevent the reel from moving. If it doesn't have anything like that, put the second reel on top.

Whatever you do, try to do it consistently.

As others have said, you will get two distinct answers to your question. The reason that there is disagreement is that when you agitate a half-filled tank, there is a lot more movement of chemistry and mixing of chemistry with air than if you (nearly) fill the tank. For some combinations of developer and agitation schemes, that may make a difference (rolls developed singly may receive more development than rolls developed 2 to a tank).

If you reuse developer, and particularly if you replenish your developer, there is no issue - you may as well use the amount of developer that would be required for two rolls. Just keep track of it/replenish it as development of a single roll.

I usually rotary process using fairly dilute developer, one shot. I don't worry about filling the tank. When I used inversion agitation, I was also using fairly dilute developer, one shot, which tended to give me longer development times. I found that it was unnecessary to (nearly) fill the tank when developing a single roll.

If you are using low dilutions, and short development times, my guess would be that it is better to (nearly) fill the tank when developing a single roll.

The issue of dilution is important, since there is a minimum amount of (stock-strength) developer needed to develop a roll. For instance, if you need 20 ml of Foo Developer to develop a roll, and if you mixed it 1+19, then you'll need at least 400 ml of working-strength solution to develop a single roll. If you only use 250 ml of working strength solution, then you'll only use 12.5 ml of the stock solution, which might not be enough, yielding thin negatives.

Personally, I've never had problems with using 250 ml of working-strength solution to develop a roll, using D-76 (typically at 1+1), XTOL (again, at 1+1), DS-10 (another 1+1), DS-12 (2+1), Rodinal (1+25 or 1+50), PC-Glycol (1+1+48), and more limited quantities of other developers. If in doubt, read the data sheet for your developer; it should specify recommended minimum quantities of stock solution.