Toning Ilford's new MGRC paper

johnnywalker · Jan 18, 2022

Ilford advertises that this paper is a good alternative to toning Warmtone papers. Almost all the toning I do is with either Selenium or Sepia. With Selenium, I always had good results toning the warmtone papers but not the RC papers. I'd like to hear if anyone has any experience toning the new MGRC paper before I order a box. I am loathe to spend the money on the warmtone paper if the MGRC paper is a good alternative.
TIA,

Alan9940 · Jan 18, 2022

Acceptable results are, of course, in the eye of the beholder, but I've toned the new MGRC paper with both selenium and sepia and have been satisfied with the results.

koraks · Jan 19, 2022

Other than inherent differences with paper surface/finish, I never noticed anything particular about RC papers in toning. Which is to say, they respond pretty much the same to toning as their fiber counterparts. One example of particular interest is Rollei Vintage warmtone RC, which is a thin (rather flimsy...) very warm tone paper that somewhat resembles Fomatone in its responsiveness to toning. Which is to say, there's no inherent problem with toning RC emulsions and I couldn't think of a reason for it either. So give it a try, odds are it'll work fine. However, never expect an RC paper to look exactly like a fiber based one. It's just a different animal.

radiant · Jan 19, 2022

Foma Sepia toner bites well on the V paper, I would say just as fast as fiber papers.

MattKing · Jan 19, 2022

The MGIV RC neutral tone papers are rewardingly resistant to any apparent response to selenium toner.
I've had quite satisfactory responses using sepia toner with them. Same for brown toner.

johnnywalker · Jan 19, 2022

I should have been clearer. I found that the MGIVRC papers toned with Selenium OK if it were the warmtone version. With the "normal" MGIVRC the Selenium toning made hardly any difference, if any. I'm hoping that the new 'Normal" MGVRC tones better in since I can't find any outlets in Canada selling the warmtone version.

johnnywalker · Jan 19, 2022

Alan9940 said:
Acceptable results are, of course, in the eye of the beholder, but I've toned the new MGRC paper with both selenium and sepia and have been satisfied with the results.

Alan, were you using the new "normal" MGRC paper or the Warmtone version for toning? What I am hoping for is the purplish-tinged black and higher contrast that I could achieve with the MGIVRC warmtone papers.

MattKing · Jan 19, 2022

johnnywalker said:
I'm hoping that the new 'Normal" MGVRC tones better in since I can't find any outlets in Canada selling the warmtone version.

Have you tried Amplis' (the Canadian distributor) web store?
https://store.amplis.com/collections/ilford-photo
If Amplis have it, Beau Photo con also order it for you from them.
And in case it isn't clear, there is no new warmtone or cooltone version - the previous warmtone and cooltone RC papers were actually newer than the MGIV versions.

pentaxuser · Jan 19, 2022

johnnywalker, Ilford did a video on this but it was FB paper and the toning effect at 1+4 was amazing although it might not be what you want at this very strong dilution. Unfortunately it was not MGRC V. A few people asked about the new RC paper and selenium. The reply from Ilford was that it would try to upload examples of RC once the site re-opened. Ilford and the U.\K. at the time was in total lockdown(April 2020 ) but the site was re-opened in the summer of that year so if the Ilford spokesperson was as good as his word then somewhere on the Ilford Photo site there should be examples of RC selenium toned papers

I can't say there are such examples because I haven't looked

pentaxuser

gijsbert · Jan 19, 2022

The other day I toned an Ilford RC V print 3min in 1:9 (well, it was 1:9 long ago, probably lower dilution now), subtle but visible change, even without a non-toned print as reference, slightly reddish/purple, pleasant tone for me. I haven't tested going longer.
I didn't compare to Ilford WT for this print, but from previous experiences WT would have been much redder/purple.
I really like RC V, sometimes I miss the slightly lower contrast of RC IV grade 00 when I print my over developed negatives!

Alan9940 · Jan 19, 2022

johnnywalker said:
Alan, were you using the new "normal" MGRC paper or the Warmtone version for toning? What I am hoping for is the purplish-tinged black and higher contrast that I could achieve with the MGIVRC warmtone papers.

Sorry, I must have misread your original post. I was working with the non-warm tone version.

Richard Jepsen · Jan 20, 2022

I have toned Classic fibre and MGRC Deluxe in KRST 1:8. up to 8 min with little response in tone. Ilford touts the papers having an improved response to toning. If so they may be talking about sepia or a toner other than selenium.

Impressive paper as you can print on RC and use the same settings to print on Classic. Both papers so sharp you can skip selenium toning if used to crisp up the image.

if you want warm tones you are likely better off with Ilfords WT. if cost an issue look at Foma.

NB23 · Jan 20, 2022

Kentmere responds very well to toning. Much better than ilford mgiv, and probably same as the new Ilford line.
Kentmere; Excellent paper, from harman, a bit cheaper.

pentaxuser · Jan 21, 2022

Richard Jepsen said:
I have toned Classic fibre and MGRC Deluxe in KRST 1:8. up to 8 min with little response in tone.

I wonder if there is a "tipping point" at which Ilford FB suddenly responds to Selenium toner beyond that of 1:8? Certainly at 1:4 as was used in the Ilford video the response is amazing

Of course the presenter was using Ilford selenium toner and not Kodak's but surely selenium is selenium

pentaxuser

spijker · Jan 21, 2022

Are we talking about the same video? In this video by Ilford, Rachel uses RC WARMTONE paper, not the neutral tone paper. My experience with Ilford Classic FB and MGIV RC is that is it does not go to a brownish tone but always a purplish tone when fully toned.

MattKing · Jan 21, 2022

spijker said:
MGIV RC

That is the old version of the paper. I think that the discussion here is about the new MG RC Deluxe, often referred to by others as MG V RC.

pentaxuser · Jan 21, 2022

spijker said:
Are we talking about the same video? In this video by Ilford, Rachel uses RC WARMTONE paper, not the neutral tone paper. My experience with Ilford Classic FB and MGIV RC is that is it does not go to a brownish tone but always a purplish tone when fully toned.

Thanks, yes,it's the same video and you are right to an extent but she says she is using FB WT not RC. What made me think that the MGRCV must show more of an effect than Richard got was the question asked in the comments and Ilford's answer as follows:

Tanguy Lejedi
1 year ago
I would love to see selenium toned prints with the new RC Multigrade V. It is said in its datasheet that it provides better results with toning than the fourth gen RC paper. Could you please show us some examples ?

REPLY
ILFORD Photo
1 year ago
Thanks for the feedback Tanguy. We do have some toned prints of the new MGRCDL paper in the office, i will try to get them shared once the site re-opens.

You are right,spijker, that it was WT and the effect may well be different but if there was little or no effect then it seems to me that Ilford's reply is somewhat misleading or at least I feel that at best the reply from Ilford is not as accurate as it should have been. If I had asked that question I'd have expected at least some reference to MGRCV Deluxe having a very subdued reaction and not something as spectacular as was the case in the video

Thanks

pentaxuser

pentaxuser · Jan 21, 2022

Yes I was trying to help johnnywalker with his question about new MGRC which is the Deluxe paper and was simply saying that based on the video comments it would seem that MGRC Deluxe to which most members refer as MGRC V does response noticeably in selenium based on what users of the Deluxe have said and as Ilford has also said

I cannot speak for johnnywalker but I find it confusing when members refer to their experience with MGRC IV which doesn't seem to really help johnnywalker as it is not MGRC IV to which he refers but new MGRC i.e. MGRC Deluxe

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Toning Ilford's new MGRC paper

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