To squeegee or not to squeegee

Nige · Feb 9, 2006

df cardwell said:
This isn't meant as trolling, but WHY haven't I had trouble with scratches in 37 years of shooting ? And I know some OLD TIMERS who always squeegee ( or chamois ) their film ?

Gosh, that's like 10,000 rolls of film and it isn't a problem. Photo-Flo in distilled water, the whole thing ....

As David Vestal says, you do it with 'ritual slowness'.
.

have you bought a lotto ticket?

Actually, I used to squeegee using my fingers with no scratches (must have read that in a book since I was 'self taught' from the Kodak B&W Processing book) and squeegee with a squeegee (bought cause I thought i would be better than using my fingers) but why risk it when a dip in distilled with a hint of wetting agent, dries absolutely spotless.

One thing I add to the routine for films developed in reels, is I shake/flick the reel sideways (while the film is still on it) to remove the majority of water before removing and hanging using weighted clips.

df cardwell · Feb 9, 2006

but why risk it when a dip in distilled with a hint of wetting agent, dries absolutely spotless

I guess it's because, doing LOTS of film, there has never been a scratch but even being precise about washing and wetting, some water spots sometimes happen.

The odd water spot is more dangerous, for a scratch can be retouched....a water spot is a lot harder.

At least in my world.
.

Dave Starr · Feb 9, 2006

I don't use any wetting agent. I simply spray the negatives with distilled water & hang them to dry. No spots al all, and no chance of scratches.

fhovie · Feb 9, 2006

I thought my darkroom was haunted - it was that darned squegee chasing me around in the dark. It knows it done me wrong and I won't use it again. My fingers used as a squegee also caused tiny scratches as well. I guess I am just unlucky. I am never in a hurry for the film to dry so I am content to put it up wet and let it take its time - the wetting agent works to prevent spots.

fschifano said:
If you have a squeegee, throw it away immediately. No good will come of it. Sooner or later it will get you. Use PhotoFlo, Edwal LFN, or whatever wetting agent of your choice. It could even be a drop or two of dishwashing liquid in a quart of water - just enough so that the water doesn't bead up on the film. Hang it to dry and that's it.

donbga · Feb 9, 2006

Derek Lofgreen said:
Noob here so if this has already been discussed sorry. I sometimes end up with water spots on my film (35mm) because I can't seem to get enough of the water off the film when I hang it to dry. I was wondering if I should buy one of those little tong squeegee things to get better results. Ideas?

D.

Derek,

Regardless of what others have suggested here is what you should do.

1) Use Photo-flo or some other wetting agent made for film diluted properly. You can make a small batch and reuse it if you start with distilled water and isopropol alcohol. I make a 1/2 gallon batch and use a 750 ml bottle of either 70% or 90% isopropyl. Filter the alcohol with a coffee filter and be sure your container is clean. You can reuse this solution for quite a while but watch for the presence of organic contaminants that can grow. If any are observed dump the solution.

2) For 35mm film you have a natural squeegee available at all times, your fingers. Simply dip the index and middle finger of your dominant hand in the wetting solution and after hanging the roll, slide the film between your fingers from top to bottom. You are done.

The alcohol will speed the drying.

Don Bryant

agGNOME · Feb 9, 2006

Never adopted a squeegee, I've always felt safer using fingers if I were to squeegee. Actually the technique I use is: a wetting agent (photo-flo), shake the excess off, hang, then I use "Premier PhotoWipes" with the lightest touch imaginable, hardly touching the film, one pass and one side at a time from top to bottom. I don't use the photowipes on sheet film other than to soak up the water in the lowest hanging corner. The film is dry in about 15-20 minutes using a film dryer without curl-inducing heat. The Premier Photowipes are lintless, non-abrasive,and highy absorbent. With this technique I never get water spots or scratches. But, just like all of the other techniques if it's not done properly you can still end up with spots or scratches.

Derek Lofgreen · Feb 9, 2006

Wow! There are a lot of great suggestions. I didn't know there was going to be such a debate over to squeege or not to squeege. I already use my fingers to get rid of excess water along with photoflo. I think I need to use the destilled water trick too. It seems the water isn't shedding the film and leaves spots from minerals in the water. If I use distilled water it may stop my problem all together. I will shoot a roll tomorrow and let you all know how it works.

D.

dancqu · Feb 10, 2006

[QUOTES=Derek Lofgreen]
"I do use photoflo, read above.
The thing is, water still beads up."

Drip dry also gave me problems. For years I used a well
kept Yankee Sponge squeegee. I've since up-graded; an
eight blade Jobo.

"I think Surly and others have a good idea using distilled
water in the final wash with photoflo."

That Jobo has a soak in that distilled + Photoflo prior to use.

FWIW, I sponge dry prints. Just brought into inventory
a new large size of photo grade. Dan

Marco Gilardetti · Feb 10, 2006

df cardwell said:
This isn't meant as trolling, but WHY haven't I had trouble with scratches in 37 years of shooting ?

Dunno, but I'd recommend NOT changing your personal squegee.

pnance · Feb 10, 2006

Lloyd Erlick (heylloyd.com) recommends spraying your negatives with distilled water as they hanging, to let the distilled water rinse down the negatives. It sounds good, as does most of the advice in this thread.

Myself, I've used wetting agent, photo-flo generally, fingers, film wipers, etc. A film wiper must be very soft to feel, with no grit in the rubber. I've seen some that feel as if they are made of sand, be very careful if you go the wiper route.

My current practice is to soak in the wetting agent for 30 sec or so, then soak the film wiper also. Hang film, wipe once, let dry. I get no scratches.....so far.

df cardwell · Feb 10, 2006

Marco Gilardetti said:
Dunno, but I'd recommend NOT changing your personal squegee.

AN old teacher swore by the blade from a '68 VW bus.

A new one from the store is better.

And really, healthier than fingers.

.

Claire Senft · Feb 10, 2006

A couple of thoughts: Do you use a hardening fixer? Do you make large magnification prints? Do you use diffusion, condenser or point light source?
If you were to use a squeegee what would you expect for a benefit?

Here is what I do. I use a hardening fixer. I use all three types of light sources. I have had some irregularities with point light source that I suspect may have been due to using a squeegee. I wash my film. I give a final rinse in distilled water and photo flow. With the film still on the reel and lifting rod I give it three very vigorous swings using centifical force to throw off excess water. I then turn the film over on the lifting rod and repeat the process.

Then the film is hung to dry.

Marco S. · Feb 10, 2006

I've noticed certain films scratch easier than others. Everyone's suggestions here are great. Here's what has worked well for me, add one (1) drop of Edwal's wetting agent to the tank filled with distilled water. Soak for about a minute, shake off excess and hang to dry. You could also use one of those labratory squeeze bottles with the bent little straw comming out of the top to rinse off the film after hanging.

Marco

Clyde Rogers · Feb 11, 2006

It sounds like lots of folks here fill their developing tanks with water and wetting agent. I've often heard dire admonishments about photo-flo and such gumming up plastic reels, making them sticky and harder to load.

Is this just false, or does it only happen with strong wetting agent solutions, or does it only happen with a particular wetting agent, or does everyone but me use stainless steel reels (or something else...)?

Thanks,

--clyde

df cardwell · Feb 11, 2006

What else is there but stainless reels ????

.

Dave Miller · Feb 11, 2006

df cardwell said:
What else is there but stainless reels ????

.

proper ones?

rbarker · Feb 11, 2006

Not to complicate the discussion, but shouldn't "squeegee" refer to the film, and the thing doing the squeeging be called a squeeger?

Bob F. · Feb 11, 2006

Clyde Rogers said:
It sounds like lots of folks here fill their developing tanks with water and wetting agent. I've often heard dire admonishments about photo-flo and such gumming up plastic reels, making them sticky and harder to load.

Is this just false, or does it only happen with strong wetting agent solutions, or does it only happen with a particular wetting agent, or does everyone but me use stainless steel reels (or something else...)?

Thanks,

--clyde

The trick, I expect, is to not let the wetting agent dry in the reels. As soon as I hang up the film I rinse out the tanks and reels under hot running water.

I would rather soak the film for a few minutes than trickle the distilled water over the hanging film. That way, the hard water in the emulsion can leach out, taking most of the calcium deposits etc with it. As always YMMV!

Cheers, Bob.

Derek Lofgreen · Feb 11, 2006

Okay, so I shot a roll and souped it. I didn't use distilled water but I used some filtered water. Guess what, no water spots. I didn't even squeege or "squeeger" the film with my fingers. I just used photo-flo and filtered water and no spots. Thanks for all the input.

D.

dancqu · Feb 11, 2006

rbarker said:
...and the thing doing the squeeging be called a squeeger?

I the squeeger? I did do just that last night, squeegeeed. Dan

removed account4 · Feb 11, 2006

i am a bit late in the conversation here .....
but i think the dilutions that are on the photoflo bottle
are totally insane. i have been on the same bottle of photo flo since 1981 and it is still 1/2 full.

- john

To squeegee or not to squeegee

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