TLR Users: Which Would You Recommend and Why?

photobum · Mar 22, 2007

I have a pretty complete M/F SLR set. But if I'm going to be carrying that much weight I tend to go with 4x5. I'd have the same thoughts with a C330.

For on the go easy carrying M/F it's a Rolleiflex 3.5F for me.

Rolleiflexible · Mar 22, 2007

Although they seem similar, a Rolleiflex and a Mamiya are completely different cameras. The Rolleiflex has one lens set; the Mamiya has interchangeable lenses. The Rolleiflex is small and light and unobtrusive and elegant; the Mamiya is none of these things. Hold both in your hands, and you will get the difference instantly.

In boating terms, a Rolleiflex is a sleek one-design; the Mamiya, a cabin criuiser, more flexible, but bigger and heavier. A Rolleiflex is a joy in the hand; the Mamiya is a chore to lug around.

Use your SLR for its interchangeable lenses, when you need that flexibility, but get a Rolleiflex for the times when you want to go strolling with your camera.

Sanders

DougGrosjean · Mar 22, 2007

I haven't used the Mamiya, so I can't compare Rollei vs. Mamiya.

But... I'm one of the people mentioned several times that if reduced to one camera, I'd take the Rollei.

I have a Rolleicord V and a Rolleiflex of about the same vintage. I own perhaps a dozen cameras, nothing really expensive. Couple 6x9, couple 35mm SLR, 4 MF TLR, a Widelux 35mm.

But the Rolleis both feel precise in use, like a micrometer. They have great optics. Film is easy to load in both. Parts, service, and repair are easily available. They're reasonably small and light, while still being sufficiently robust that I can travel with them on motorcycle trips (sometimes even offroad motorcycle trips).

I prefer the crank wind and shutter release of my Rolleiflex. But my Rolleicord V has a bright viewscreen, with a "Rule of Thirds" grid just as I asked for when I had had it CLA'd. So the bright viewscreen usually trumps the 'Flex's crank and shutter button.

Someday I'll get around to putting a brightscreen in the Rolleiflex, and sell off the 'Cord. Someday.... but am in no hurry. I love 'em both.

Sirius Glass · Mar 22, 2007

George,

One more thing, I have the CdS Porroprism on my C330. The meter is toast and has not worked properly for years. That said the Porroprism gets rind of the annoying right-left reversal.

The camera came with the magnifying hood which I have not used yet.

I am thinking of off-roading in Sedona one weekend in April or May. Are you interested and in the area then?

Steve

naturephoto1 · Mar 22, 2007

Hi George,

I have not had any experience with the Mamiya C series TLRs. I have only had experience with several Rolleiflex F series and T series cameras, and a Yashica 124G. Though I do not use it that frequently my Rolleifelx 12/24 3.5F Zeiss Planar was my favorite of all my TLR cameras. As mentioned, elegant, well built, excellent balance, very good for parallax adjustment, and beautifully sharp lens with excellent color and contrast. The Zeiss Planar (2.8 and 3.5) and Schneider Xentar (2.8 and 3.5) lenses will give your Hassy lenses a run for their money and may actually outperform the Hassy lenses.

Rich

DougGrosjean · Mar 22, 2007

BrianShaw said:
I'm not very tall so the only other "issue" is that most of my snaps have a low camera angle. Again... only a problem with portraiture as it tends to emphasize nostrils in the most unflattering sort of way.

In a book, I've read the tip of shooting with the TLR over your head, so the groundglass is on the bottom. Handy for shooting over crowds, around corners, etc.

Have read that the original TLR was based on German periscopes used in WWI trench warfare. Dunno if that's so, but it could be. Timing is about right...

naturephoto1 · Mar 22, 2007

As far as I know, F & H- Franke & Heidecke- who made stereo cameras (viewing lens between 2 taking lenses) removed one of the taking lenses to make the original Rollei (flex) which should as far as I know be the first TLR.

Rich

DougGrosjean · Mar 22, 2007

I've read a stereo tie-in to the Rolleis, too. That the 6x6 was chosen because 60mm is roughly the distance between the eyes, and would allow contact prints to be used in stereo viewers.

I've got a hunch that all the stories have a grain of truth, yet none are exactly right. Been nearly 100 years now, all the witnesses are long gone.

Paul Howell · Mar 22, 2007

I have owned both a C33 or C3 and a Koniomegaflex and many Yashicas Ds and 124s, I currently have 2 Ds and 1 124. I liked the Konica better than the C because of the 6X7 back, but I have always kept a Yashica on hand, much lighter and easy to pack, when I shoot 4X5 or 6X9 with my Universal I will take a Yashica with several rolls of film as a back up.

mcgrattan · Mar 22, 2007

I have a Flexaret VII which was my father-in-law's.

I like it, it takes decent pictures and it's easy to use. The focusing screen is OK and the film advance (while it feels a bit rough) tends to produce quite well-spaced negs.

Down-side, the lens is a little lacking in contrast. I find that it really benefits from higher contrast film and/or the use of a yellow filter, it can be a little soft/flat otherwise.

The close-up lenses for it, the Flexpar(s), are very good though and I've taken some photos I really like using them.

Rollei fan · Mar 22, 2007

I have a Mamiya C220F and a C220 + 55, 80 and 180mm Super lenses. I also have a Rolleiflex 3.5F with Planar lens. I also have one inherited Ikoflex and also a Flexaret, which I never use.

Rolleiflex is more compact and also better ergonomically than the C220/C220F and the Planar is a sharper lens than the Mamiya-Sekor 80mm. I also like the slightly wider angle of the 75mm Planar better than the 80mm Sekor (remember also that the Rolleiflex 2.8F has 80mm and the 3.5F has 75mm lens). C220F has a brighter finder, though. The interchangeable lenses are of course a big plus, the 55mm is a very good lens. The 180 is a little awkward to use handheld, at least at shorter distances.

The Ikoflex is still capable of producing nice sharp pictures when stepped down to F8 or F11, but the viewfinder in mine at least is very dim, the mirror should be resilvered I guess.

My verdict:
if you can do with one focal lenght and can afford it, get a Rolleiflex 3.5F and if you are on a tighter budget, a Rolleiflex T or a Rolleicord.
if you want interchangeable lenses you have but one option, the Mamiya. I would recommend the C220F or the C330S, because they are the newest models.

If you don't mind carrying stuff, get a C220F + 55 + 180mm lenses AND a Rolleiflex 3.5F, then you got the best of both worlds =)

BrianShaw · Mar 22, 2007

DougGrosjean said:
In a book, I've read the tip of shooting with the TLR over your head, so the groundglass is on the bottom. Handy for shooting over crowds, around corners, etc.

I read this too... even tried it. It works to a certain degree. Holding a camera over one's head like that isn't the most steady position from which to compose and shoot. It does work, but only in a pinch.

Sirius Glass · Mar 22, 2007

BrianShaw said:
I read this too... even tried it. It works to a certain degree. Holding a camera over one's head like that isn't the most steady position from which to compose and shoot. It does work, but only in a pinch.

Hey, I do not like getting pinched in any sense of the word!

[Puns intended]

Steve

copake_ham · Mar 22, 2007

Well so far, if I've learned nothing else from this thread, it is clear that TLR folks are as passionate about their camera of choice as are the RF crowd!

Thanks all. You've given me a lot to think about and research. Not just between makes but also b/w models of each maker!

Rolleiflexible · Mar 22, 2007

copake_ham said:
Well so far, if I've learned nothing else from this thread, it is clear that TLR folks are as passionate about their camera of choice as are the RF crowd!

Thanks all. You've given me a lot to think about and research. Not just between makes but also b/w models of each maker!

George, of course we've all collectively proven the old adage, that opinions are like [deleted] because everybody has one.

The one essential piece of information that none of us bothered to ask of you is: What do you want to shoot with the camera?

Sanders

DBP · Mar 22, 2007

copake_ham said:
Well so far, if I've learned nothing else from this thread, it is clear that TLR folks are as passionate about their camera of choice as are the RF crowd!

Interesting comment. There are a lot of parallels between the reasons to like TLRs and the reasons to like rangefinders - light weight*, unobtrusive*, quiet operation and the ability to see the subject while the shutter fires being the obvious parallels. As for disadvantages, there are parallels there too, namely parallax and the limited selection of interchangeable lens options (compared to SLRs and view cameras).

Other than a quiet shutter, the Mamiya won't offer anything that a MF SLR doesn't. Given that you have one of those, I would suggest something else, though what, exactly, will depend on your budget and vanity. You can get good results with anything from a good Ciroflex on up.

* Except the Mamiyas

Helen B · Mar 22, 2007

Of course Rolleiflexes have interchangeable lenses - it is just that you have to change the rest of the camera at the same time. Let me know if you would like to try them some weekend in New York.

Best,
Helen

photobum · Mar 22, 2007

And just to throw another wrench onto the pile... If you really need that wide and long lens. You can get a .07 Mutar and a 1.5 Mutar to fix onto the front of the best TLR. The Rolleiflex. It would still be lighter than a Mamiya outfit.

naturephoto1 · Mar 22, 2007

photobum said:
And just to throw another wrench onto the pile... If you really need that wide and long lens. You can get a .07 Mutar and a 1.5 Mutar to fix onto the front of the best TLR. The Rolleiflex. It would still be lighter than a Mamiya outfit.

That may be true about the Mutars, but they are rare and unless things have changed recently rather expensive.

Rich

steven_e007 · Mar 22, 2007

Other than a quiet shutter, the Mamiya won't offer anything that a MF SLR doesn't.

I have a C330f outfit which I am thoroughly pleased with. It is my 'serious' camera which I always go for if anyone wants me to photograph anything important for them. Bomb proof, rugged, reliable and it didn't cost much!There is a massive range of accesories, too, and it all comes very cheap these days

I feel the TLR does have one big advantage over an SLR, apart from quietness.

When you click the shutter, the screen doesn't blank - not even for a fraction of second. When taking portraits or pictures of kids this is invaluable. Your brain is able to match up the click of the shutter to the image in the viewfinder. The point is, if the subject blinks or looks away, I always know because at the point I hear the click the very image that the film is exposed to also registers in my head vision, if you see what I mean.

I have never felt this confidence with an SLR, no matter how fast the mirror moves or returns.

Just my humble observation.

Steve

Mackinaw · Mar 22, 2007

copake_ham said:
About all I really know to ask at this point is that I'd like a model that isn't more than about 20 years old and, if this is even possible, uses interchangeable lenses for different focal lenght options.

I faced the same decision about a year ago. I was looking for a TLR and didn't have a clue which way to go. I opted for a Mamiya C220 mainly because I liked the idea of interchangeable lenses. I now on the 65mm, 80mm and 105mm lenses, all whch have proven to be good picture takers. I also really appreciate the quiet shutter and the fact there's no mirror blackout when I press the shutter. This camera and my Leica are my main cameras.

Jim Bielecki

Jojje · Mar 23, 2007

Besides Mamiya TLRs have interchangeable lenses, they have interchangeable shutter's too. if shutter goes south, change the lens. Convenient.

Sirius Glass · Mar 23, 2007

George,

Due to your interest in TLR, I offer my C330 with 56mm, 80mm and 250mm lens, filter, Paraminder ... in exchange for all your Hasselblad camera equipment. This offer is good if and only if you in fact have Hasselblad camera equipment.

Such a deal!

Steve

copake_ham · Mar 24, 2007

Sanders McNew said:
.....
The one essential piece of information that none of us bothered to ask of you is: What do you want to shoot with the camera?

Sanders

Sanders,

Thanks for bringing up this question because it does force me to think more about the TLR option.

The funny thing to me is that, what little I know of TLRs is that I think of them as portrait cameras, and I'm not usually much of a people-shooter. So it's kind of counter-intuitive for me to even have a curiousity about this type of camera. [Although it may explain my "fixation" on interchangeable lenses - since that, to my mind, expands the "usages" of such a camera.]

What's also confusing is how hard it is to learn much about TLRs. I have several books on medium format that I purchased before and after getting the Hassey - and although they "mention" TLRs - they tend to treat them as obsolete and provide little info.

Maybe the better way to phrase my question is to ask: "Given that you use Medium Format - When and Why would you choose a TLR over an SLR/RF?"

BTW: Helen, I liked your comment about "multiple bodies = interchangeable lenses" and the idea of trying out a couple of Rolleis. Thanks for the offer. I may well take you up on it.

Overall, now that I have the Hassey here and the Bronica in Tucson, I do want to increase my shooting in medium format (heck, I just ordered a Nikon 9000ED so I can scan the negs etc.) and think a TLR might be enjoyable to have around as another tool in the format.

Shmoo · Mar 24, 2007

Steve Smith said:
Like Brian, I prefer the Rolleicord over the Rolleiflex for its simplicity. i.e. no self cocking shutter combined with wind on to go wrong.

Steve.

I agree. I have an old Rolleicord IV that I "inherited"...and I love the simplicity and elegance of the Rolleicord. It's also a bit of challenge to work within the limitations of the fixed lens set up, but I find that it's a good challenge. The lens is incredibly sharp.

The other thing is that a Rolleicord will cost you a lot less to start off with than a 'flex.

S

TLR Users: Which Would You Recommend and Why?

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