Tips and tricks for MF/TLR/Autocord

nick_clark · Jun 21, 2016

Hi all, thanks to a member here I've just taken delivery of a 'new' Minolta Autocord (early meterless model with Seikosha MX shutter and 'Chiyoko' Rokkor). I'm pretty excited to run some film through, but also quite nervous - this is my first experience with medium format, a TLR, or an Autocord...

So, does anyone have any tips and tricks to get the most out of it? There's heaps of resources floating about for MF, but far less it seems for Autocords, and a lot of the online links I've found are no longer current. Any thoughts, suggestions or experience from the brains trust would be appreciated.

I've been shooting 35mm film more or less exclusively for a couple of years so I'm not a complete amateur, but I'm not far off

Cheers, Nick

baachitraka · Jun 21, 2016

1. Load film.
2. Cock the shutter.
3. Focus
4. Fire
5. Advance the film.
6. Again from step 2.

* Not sure whether it auto detects the film and stops at frame number 1 during loading.

locutus · Jun 21, 2016

A TLR is a TLR, i am not sure what tips and tricks you are thinking about, but a couple of suggestions of the top of my head for people coming off 35mm:

DOF issuess:

Keep in mind that DoF is smaller, f/3.5 is similiar to f/2 on 35mm camera.

This of course means that often you need to stop down more to get similar DoF and thus more light.

Film flatness:

120 film is more likely to bow and sag, one recommendation is to advance the film just before you take your shot so as to keep the film tight, advancing and then waiting a while (hours, days) for the next shot might result in film sag.

How much that really affects things varies depends on who you ask

Film choice and smaller apparent grain:

As the negative is so much bigger, grain is smaller and thus ISO400 film is a good starting choice. As you often will need more light due to smaller apertures used.

If you have any more specific questions, just ask

Steve Smith · Jun 21, 2016

Point it at something interesting... press shutter!

Steve.

mooseontheloose · Jun 21, 2016

The Autocord is my favourite TLR, I have multiples of them. Like the others have said, a TLR is a TLR, but if you have never shot with a waist-level viewfinder that will take some getting used to. I like the Autocord better than any other brand for 3 reasons - one, it's super easy to load and the film remains flat from the uptake spool to the take-up spool, so there is no issue of film flatness due to film being wound around other bits, no matter how long the film has been in the camera (so please don't follow the advice above - wind your film after every shot so you are ready to go); two, despite the fact that the focusing lever can be prone to breaking (which, btw, has never happened to me, and I own at least 6 of these cameras) it is one of the easiest ways to focus and trip the shutter (no need for switching hands like some cameras); finally, it doesn't have the same name brand recognition (or cost) as a Rolleiflex but it takes equally great photos. Have fun with yours!

Dan Daniel · Jun 21, 2016

Practice holding, firing, viewing. If you watch TV, play with the camera while sitting there. Get used to the viewfinder, etc.

Be prepared for comments and conversations with people on the street. Practice, 'Yes, they still make film.' 'Really, your grandfather had one, you say?' 'No, I do not know where to get artisanal local goat cheese in this town.' (hipster bonding attempt) 'Let's get coffee and you can show me your instagram site.' (young woman or man depending on your tastes)

Practice telling people that the viewing screen is an LCD screen, one of the first prototypes developed for NASA. See how long you can string someone along. I'm up to six minutes!! This works best with young people who have no idea that images can be on anything other than an LCD.

nick_clark · Jun 21, 2016

Thanks for your thoughts everyone, should be fun! And thanks for the Autocord Dan.

I especially like the 'point at something interesting' suggestion, too often forgotten with new toys. At least I don't have a cat...

Dan Daniel said:
'No, I do not know where to get artisanal local goat cheese in this town.' (hipster bonding attempt)

This would be funny, if I didn't know exactly where to get good artisanal goats cheese in Sydney's Inner West, which is probably one of the most 'hipster' districts in Oz

Dan Daniel · Jun 21, 2016

nick_clark said:
This would be funny, if I didn't know exactly where to get good artisanal goats cheese in Sydney's Inner West, which is probably one of the most 'hipster' districts in Oz

Well, I thought of it because, well, it happened to me once, and yes, I can find it in at least two places within a half kilometer of my home. And this is in a town of 40,000. Sydney will have artisanal everything at the checkout line at the corner booze store before you know it!

mweintraub · Jun 21, 2016

If you focus close, remember what you see in the viewfinder is not what the taking lens sees.

moto-uno · Jun 21, 2016

^Never truer words were spoke ! Peter

onre · Jun 21, 2016

Learn to fully use the waist-level finder, sports finder and square format to your advantage. In additional to usual waist-level perspective, you can easily do eye-level with the sports finder, and additionally you can turn the camera upside down and hold it with your arms stretched upwards. This can be rather useful when trying to take photographs over fences, vegetation etc. There's also the additional bonus of getting weird looks from passers-by.

Dan Daniel · Jun 21, 2016

Oh, I forgot- along with the people who home in on you like a dog to a fire hydrant, most people will completely ignore you. And I mean completely. I've stood three feet in front of someone pointing the camera at their face and hardly a glance, much less any reaction to being photographed. Something about a TLR simply doesn't register as a camera to lots of people.

nick_clark · Jun 21, 2016

mweintraub said:
If you focus close, remember what you see in the viewfinder is not what the taking lens sees.

I keep forgetting there's no parallax correction, thanks for the tip!

onre said:
Learn to fully use the waist-level finder, sports finder and square format to your advantage. In additional to usual waist-level perspective, you can easily do eye-level with the sports finder, and additionally you can turn the camera upside down and hold it with your arms stretched upwards. This can be rather useful when trying to take photographs over fences, vegetation etc. There's also the additional bonus of getting weird looks from passers-by.

I'll give it a go

gone · Jun 21, 2016

I guess the usual stuff. Make sure you leave the house w/ film in it, if you use a lens cap you WILL leave it on and get great shots of the back of it, make sure to use the magnifier, because although it may look a little weird, you really can't trust your unaided eyes to focus with, the sports finder is your friend so just get focus and hold that baby up to your eye like a SLR, and yes, people either love TLRs or they are invisible to them. Great lens on your camera.

MattKing · Jun 22, 2016

momus said:
if you use a lens cap you WILL leave it on and get great shots of the back of it,

If the lens cap covers only the taking lens, stick a tab on to it that will interfere with the view from the viewing lens as well - so you notice it when you compose your photos.

If the lens cap covers both the taking and viewing lenses, you shouldn't have this problem .

Learn to recognize the "navel" eye view of the world. For some things, it is superb. For others, like some portraits, not so much.

tanner · Jun 22, 2016

Yup, people will stop to talk to you. I've experienced this firsthand with my Mamiya C220. It's awesome. If you're into street portraits, the victims will come to you, no need to hunt Plus, you meet cool people this way and get a chance to spread the word about film in this post-silver world.

Shooting with a TLR has completely changed the way I see the world through glass. I don't know if it's the square, the way a TLR makes you shoot due to the specifics of the camera or the look of medium format. Probably all of those and the reversed image in the viewfinder. It abstracts reality just enough to make you explore even boring looking stuff.

Susan J. · Jun 22, 2016

my 1958 Minolta Autocord is so sharp and out of my entire herd I'd have to say it has taken the best photos so far...great camera.

calebarchie · Jun 22, 2016

When using magnifier, better to use at waist level distance rather than having eye against it, the 'snap' is more evident that way.

nick_clark · Jun 23, 2016

Regarding parallax - does anyone know how much of what you see in the VF will actually be in the frame at minimum focussing? Ie. everything below the top brightline?

Dan Daniel · Jun 23, 2016

nick_clark said:
Regarding parallax - does anyone know how much of what you see in the VF will actually be in the frame at minimum focussing? Ie. everything below the top brightline?

The brightlines are for, I believe, 8x10 format or something like that. Not for parallax.

Minolta made a device called a 'paradjuster' that would raise the camera the 42mm distance between the two lenses-
http://www.crocuta.com/yashica/paradjuster.html
Link to the manual on the page so you can see it in action. Tripod use only, of course.

On a Rollei with an adjusting "parallax" frame, the frame moves maybe 4mm from infinity to close focus (3 feet/.9 meter). This gives you an idea of how much.

There are two issues with close focus. One is framing, which things like the Rollei sliding mask helps with, roughly. And then there is true parallax, meaning that where you are looking from and where the taking lens are looking from are offset, leading to different alignments of items in the image. This is the classic 'finger in front of your face' issue used to advantage in rangefinder focusing- hold a finger in front of your nose about 20cms out and close one eye and then the other. You'll see the alignment between the finger and items in the background shift. The Rollei mask doesn't deal with this, nor does the prism in Rolleinars (or the Minolta versions).

For framing, the Autocord viewfinder is a bit tight already. I would say that they built in half of the framing error into the viewfinder by simply not showing 2mm top and bottom.

For true parallax, you can frame then lift the camera in space ~42mm and shoot. You risk shifting front and back while doing this which can lead to focus errors. I'll usually frame and focus, then lift the camera a bit and accept that when I see now is 'wrong' but that what the taking lens is seeing is closer to what I want. If this is critical for your work, you need an SLR or view camera.

MattKing · Jun 23, 2016

nick_clark said:
Regarding parallax - does anyone know how much of what you see in the VF will actually be in the frame at minimum focussing? Ie. everything below the top brightline?

This is easy to test for on your first roll.

Photograph something like a sheet of broadsheet newspaper or anything else you can safely mark up. Be sure that the camera and the newspaper are as close to being parallel as you can. Make notes about where the corners on the viewscreen reach on the subject or, if possible, mark them on the target itself. Develop the film and compare the corners of the negative with the marked or noted corners of what you viewed.

If you have a manual for your camera, it might give you hints.

tanner · Jun 23, 2016

Or, don't put film in the camera, tape a translucent thing at the film plane and compare the projected image with the one from the viewing lens. You may also find that you don't get the full frame as it's recorded on film in your viewfinder. This is a good time to check for focusing issues. For that I highly recommend using a piece of ground glass at the film plane, since you can't trust floppy translucent paper or tape. Do that while focusing at infinity where focus is more sensitive. Use some sort of magnification. You can also test lens hoods for vignetting by looking through the empty back and trying to see the hood's edge through the lens.

nick_clark · Jun 23, 2016

Thanks for all the suggestions regarding parallax, some great info here.

The only manual I've been able to find if for the later Autocord 'Model L', although for all intents and purposes it seems to apply to my camera.

GarageBoy · Jun 23, 2016

tanner said:
Or, don't put film in the camera, tape a translucent thing at the film plane and compare the projected image with the one from the viewing lens.

I built a crappy camera obscura thing as a kid with a lens, a box and a thin grey shopping bag from the grocery store as a focusing screen

hsandler · Jun 24, 2016

I would advise getting a lens hood. The lens is coated, but like all TLRs is not deeply recessed in the body, so is prone to flare. There are plastic Bay1 hoods for only about $7 on the bay, but they use the inner bayonet and then you cant attach a yellow filter too, which would be useful for black and white outdoor shots. If you can find one, a metal hood that uses the outer bayonet is better, as you can still use filters with it.

The Autocord is great. Arguably the most well thought out TLR design with an excellent lens.

Tips and tricks for MF/TLR/Autocord

nick_clark

baachitraka

locutus

Steve Smith

mooseontheloose

Dan Daniel

nick_clark

Dan Daniel

mweintraub

moto-uno

onre

Dan Daniel

nick_clark

gone

MattKing

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tanner

Susan J.

calebarchie

nick_clark

Dan Daniel

MattKing

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tanner

nick_clark

GarageBoy

hsandler

Tips and tricks for MF/TLR/Autocord

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