thoughts on the announced Kodak film price increase?

[DMJ]

Saw this news by Kosmofoto (Stephen Dowling) posted on Twitter. Does anyone know about it? There is no source.

https://kosmofoto.com/2021/10/kodak-alaris-announces-significant-price-increases-for-january-2022/

 

[removed account4]

sounds like kodak. LOL
The last time I bought kodak sheet film new was from B+H back in 2001, it was 65$ SHIPPED. 100 sheets tmy(400), and I thought that was expensive.
I'm afraid to look up at how expensive it is now.

John

 

[cramej]

No official source on that article yet - only "was shown examples of new pricing from one UK distributor" and that it was "confirmed by Kodak Alaris". Take the announcement with a grain of salt. There are no press releases on the KA website yet. However, 20% on top of the already $20 for a roll of 135 E100 will make it and every other Kodak film now a complete loser in the financial sense. They're already stupid expensive. If they really are going to raise prices, I'll probably just shoot what little Portra I have left and then stick to B&W. And NO, just be cause the calculated inflation blah blah this and that doesn't make it "not that bad". Ok, rant over...

 

[removed account4]

No official source on that article yet - only "was shown examples of new pricing from one UK distributor" and that it was "confirmed by Kodak Alaris". Take the announcement with a grain of salt. There are no press releases on the KA website yet. However, 20% on top of the already $20 for a roll of 135 E100 will make it and every other Kodak film now a complete loser in the financial sense. They're already stupid expensive. If they really are going to raise prices, I'll probably just shoot what little Portra I have left and then stick to B&W. And NO, just be cause the calculated inflation blah blah this and that doesn't make it "not that bad". Ok, rant over...

they used to raise the price of their film by x% 2x a year for decades. this really is nothing new that is why I said "sounds like kodak".

 

[faberryman]

Wowser! Ektachome will be $23.99/roll. We are lucky to have it at all; still, at some point people will stop buying it.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Facts of the matter are that demand is outstripping supply - and there will be a price point at which it's worth other companies stepping to fill that demand. Prices are apparently still considerably below that point.

 

[mshchem]

Facts of the matter are that demand is outstripping supply - and there will be a price point at which it's worth other companies stepping to fill that demand. Prices are apparently still considerably below that point.

Yes. Film, especially color film, is in short supply. It's a luxury good. I have used several rolls of E100, it's outstanding Film, so is Provia. Portra is amazing.

The way central banks are flooding the world with new money, it's bound to result in price increases.

 

[flavio81]

So, is there any solid source on this? Or only KosmoFoto... who cite no solid sources?

"According to credible sources"
https://silvergrainclassics.com/en/2020/11/2021-kodak-film-price-increase-announced/

Reddit cites the previous URL
https://www.reddit.com/r/AnalogComm...update_on_2021_kodak_price_increase_only_915/

Other forums just cite the KosmoFoto url. No other sources, apparently.

 

[flavio81]

No official source on that article yet - only "was shown examples of new pricing from one UK distributor" and that it was "confirmed by Kodak Alaris". Take the announcement with a grain of salt. There are no press releases on the KA website yet. However, 20% on top of the already $20 for a roll of 135 E100 will make it and every other Kodak film now a complete loser in the financial sense. They're already stupid expensive. If they really are going to raise prices, I'll probably just shoot what little Portra I have left and then stick to B&W. And NO, just be cause the calculated inflation blah blah this and that doesn't make it "not that bad". Ok, rant over...

Yes.

And since ORWO is planning to release color movie film. It's only a matter of time until they decide to release it on 35mm still format, without the remjet. With the current inflated pricing from Kodak and Fuji, they can become a best seller if they drop the prices a little bit.

 

[Lachlan Young]

Yes.

And since ORWO is planning to release color movie film. It's only a matter of time until they decide to release it on 35mm still format, without the remjet. With the current inflated pricing from Kodak and Fuji, they can become a best seller if they drop the prices a little bit.

That's wishful thinking that ignores the photochemical reality of ECN-2. Orwo/Inoviscoat are already able to make C-41 (CD-4) compatible materials, and by getting ECN-2 (CD-3) on the market it opens up both their ability to make other CD-3 based materials (E-6) & possibly also the last critical steps to making a 'good' C-41 as opposed to the incremental steps that have been turned into various Lomo products. And you'll need to reposition your thinking as to price - it's far more likely to be closely competitive with Kodak than significantly cheaper - Kodak have major institutional making/ coating advantages (e.g. can coat in a single pass through 2 coating stations, driers etc - the Inoviscoat setup requires a double pass through the machine to deliver the same number of layers).

 

[removed account4]

So, is there any solid source on this?

Prices go up, that is reality .. 20% this year. 5% 5 years ago doesn't really matter"

Im always amazed how people in this day and age, with the market shrinking as it is, and everything from materials to transport have skyrocketed in price can complain
about the cost of film when we are lucky to even have it.

 

[Lee Rust]

With a half-frame 35, the cost-per-frame for a $24.00 roll of Ektachrome would be about $0.33. Expensive color film was the reason half-frame cameras were originally introduced.

 

[mohmad khatab]

Yes.

And since ORWO is planning to release color movie film. It's only a matter of time until they decide to release it on 35mm still format, without the remjet. With the current inflated pricing from Kodak and Fuji, they can become a best seller if they drop the prices a little bit.

Yes I agree with you

 

[Ian Grant]

Facts of the matter are that demand is outstripping supply - and there will be a price point at which it's worth other companies stepping to fill that demand. Prices are apparently still considerably below that point.

There's something else going on here, 10 sheets of 10x8 Tmax 400 or Tri-X 320 are now £180 here in the UK, contrast that with 25 sheets of 10x8 HP5 for £155 and that's a hoge difference way more than 2.5 times the price for Kodak compared to Ilford. It's more like 2x the price for 5x4 Kodak than Ilford, add adox in the mix at slightly less than Ilford. Lets not forget Foma who are half the price of Ilford.

Kodak's market share for B&W films is now almost certainly smaller than Foma, Ilford have had more than 70% of the market for over 20 years and that used to be followed by Kodak but with Kodak's disaterous out sourcing of distribtion world wide they lost theremarket share in most countries. Here in the UK they closed their own distribution division and made the staff redundant and their new distributor Sangers went bust in a year. Luckily their former team stepped in setting up distribution.

In many countries their distributors concentrated on the colour market, larger labs and particularly minilabs, I know from first hand experience while living and travelling abroad Kodak B&W films where near impossible to buy, Ilford was availble everywhere as was Foma to my surprise.

Reality is I've just bought 100 sheets of 10x8 Fomapan 200 for £285, that £2.85 a shot compared to Kodak's £18, Ilford HP5 would £6.20 a third approx a third the cost of Kodak.

Ian

 

[Tom Kershaw]

There's something else going on here

What I don't understand about Kodak is that a few years ago the black & white film products were price competitive with ILFORD. If Harman can sort out the backing paper problems I would be happy to use Delta 100 and 400 in 120, as I use the Delta films in other formats.

 

[guangong]

As far as US inflation goes, as Al Jolson quipped, “You ain’t seen nothin’ yet!”

 

[removed account4]

What I don't understand about Kodak is that a few years ago the black & white film products were price competitive with ILFORD. If Harman can sort out the backing paper problems I would be happy to use Delta 100 and 400 in 120, as I use the Delta films in other formats.

That is really weird that KODAK BW films were priced competitive with ILFORD. The last time I bought 4x5 film (here in the states) Ilford was about 1/2 the price of KODAK. Do they have VAT Tax in the UK or there is a massive Tarif on US Films ? I can't say much about the film backing paper debacle other than maybe a smalle, agile company could figure it out.

 

[Ian Grant]

Facts of the matter are that demand is outstripping supply - and there will be a price point at which it's worth other companies stepping to fill that demand. Prices are apparently still considerably below that point.

I meant to add that's not true of the B&W market with regards to Kodak. They've almost killed demand for their sheet films here in the UK with their prices to the extent than few suppliersnow one carry or even list their 10x8 Tmax or Tri-X films any longer but they do stock Ilford, Foma, Adox, and more recently Shangai.

I had a discussion about this with my supplierquite recently and they felt Kodak had priced themselves out of the B&W market, they don't stock items that won't sell.

Ian

 

[Ian Grant]

That is really weird that KODAK BW films were priced competitive with ILFORD. The last time I bought 4x5 film (here in the states) Ilford was about 1/2 the price of KODAK. Do they have VAT Tax in the UK or there is a massive Tarif on US Films ? I can't say much about the film backing paper debacle other than maybe a smalle, agile company could figure it out.

When Tom says a few years ago I'd agree prices were close sometimes Kodak cheaper,. but like you when I last bought Ilford B&W 5x4 sheet film it was half the price of Kodak, this is still the case today.

Ian

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Saw this news by Kosmofoto (Stephen Dowling) posted on Twitter. Does anyone know about it? There is no source.

https://kosmofoto.com/2021/10/kodak-alaris-announces-significant-price-increases-for-january-2022/

They can afford it. It's getting harder and harder to get good film. I had to check with several online merchants before I got B&W film in 120 last week.

 

[removedacct1]

If Harman can sort out the backing paper problems I would be happy to use Delta 100 and 400 in 120, as I use the Delta films in other formats.

I am using both Delta emulsions in 120 format almost exclusively now - bought a lot of it this spring - and I have to say, I have experienced the backing paper issues more often with Kodak films than I have with Ilford. This is a problem with both manufacturers, and its something you're going to encounter if you allow your film stock to age. Once I stopped caching film and allowing it to reach its "best before" date, I stopped seeing the problem.

 

[removedacct1]

Im always amazed how people in this day and age, with the market shrinking as it is, and everything from materials to transport have skyrocketed in price can complain
about the cost of film when we are lucky to even have it.

While I understand the pain folks feel as prices inch up every year, ultimately, if you want to continue working with film, then find a way to afford it. You might not be able to afford Tri-X in 8x10 format (There's no way I will buy it at those prices), but at the very least, you can likely afford to make paper negatives with Multigrade papers. No, that might offer you the same latitude in results, but its much more affordable. Be glad you still have ANY materials available to you. It could be much, much worse.

Please read: https://silvergrainclassics.com/en/2021/10/film-price-analysis/

 

[mshchem]

As far as US inflation goes, as Al Jolson quipped, “You ain’t seen nothin’ yet!”

Absolutely!

 

[mshchem]

I seem to recall that Kodak Alaris pays a 3rd party to confection all the sheet film. Is this accurate?? The retail photo market in the US is so distorted thanks to the decades of zero tax collection by B&H and other online companies. B&H, Freestyle, Unique Photo and others enjoy volume rebates etc.
I buy Ilford and Foma sheet film, Tri-X is great film, but it's just not feasible for me. I have a 22 cu ft refrigerator freezer absolutely full of film and paper, and I still am buying new.

 

[MattKing]

seem to recall that Kodak Alaris pays a 3rd party to confection all the sheet film. Is this accurate??

No it is Eastman Kodak, although I don't know if Eastman Kodak has anyone else assisting them with this through contract.
See here: https://imaging.kodakalaris.com/photographers/film
The most common sizes are regular catalogue items, and are listed on the 2021 Pro Film List here: https://imaging.kodakalaris.com/sites/default/files/wysiwyg/film/2021_Pro_Film_Catalog_List.pdf
The special order size orders are placed and coordinated through KB Canham Cameras - see here for the list of special order sizes that have catalogue numbers: https://imaging.kodakalaris.com/sites/default/files/wysiwyg/film/2021_Pro_Film_Special-Order.pdf
If you have huge amounts of money, apparently they will make other sizes too.