Thinking of a Speed Graphic

Tom1956 · Oct 20, 2013

An important question--help fast plz

So today the Speed came, the one with the 152 Ektar in a Supermatic-X shutter. The camera is unusable; back tracks are busted and the focus rail has nothing to hold it on its tracks. Back shutter fair-to-good, semisilver Kalart mirro appears to give second image in rangefinder. Camera is kinda junky, but not total junk, except you can't use it because it needs all new focus rails in bed and body.
But the 152 Ektar glass is very good. It needs to come apart to clean between the elements, but wonder of wonders, it has no "cleaning marks". And while the shutter needs CLA, it DOES operate reasonably well. I paid $177 plus shipping for what I thought was a usable camera. The seller says to send it back.
So the question is, is keeping this purchase worth it for the lens alone, along with a body that will need some more money for a parts-body to fix? Or is this a borderline case where I should forget about this nice lens? Remember, the next Speed I end up with will probably have the standard Optar/Graphex combo.

shutterfinger · Oct 20, 2013

Open this PDF service manual :
http://www.southbristolviews.com/pics/Graphic/manual-pdf/servicemanual.pdf
it will open faster if you save it to your HD.
Go to PDF page 38, figure 7 Bed Complete.
Is the rear of the yoke index 3 broken? Yes or No.
Is Index 20 B and /or C , guide-case, left and right broken? Yes or No.
Is Guide, bed Left, index 1, or Guide, bed Right, Index 8 missing or damaged?
Are Block-bed left and right index 10 & 11 good as best as you can tell?

Ian Grant · Oct 20, 2013

Tom1956 said:
So today the Speed came, the one with the 152 Ektar in a Supermatic-X shutter. The camera is unusable; back tracks are busted and the focus rail has nothing to hold it on its tracks. Back shutter fair-to-good, semisilver Kalart mirro appears to give second image in rangefinder. Camera is kinda junky, but not total junk, except you can't use it because it needs all new focus rails in bed and body.
But the 152 Ektar glass is very good. It needs to come apart to clean between the elements, but wonder of wonders, it has no "cleaning marks". And while the shutter needs CLA, it DOES operate reasonably well. I paid $177 plus shipping for what I thought was a usable camera. The seller says to send it back.
So the question is, is keeping this purchase worth it for the lens alone, along with a body that will need some more money for a parts-body to fix? Or is this a borderline case where I should forget about this nice lens? Remember, the next Speed I end up with will probably have the standard Optar/Graphex combo.

these cameras aren't difficult to fix. I bought two Speed Graphics a few years ago sold as parts to make one good one only to sind one was pre-Anniversary the other a Pacemaker and there's no common parts. I found new Guides on ebay for the rear rails on the Pacemaker, the secret is they are shimmed to allow smooth retraction of the standard. Both cameras are now rebuilt. With a little patience you can get the camera back full functional.

Only you can decide whether to send it back or keep it, but the lens is worth around $77 perhaps a touch more so you have a $100 Speed Graphic body.

Ian

shutterfinger · Oct 20, 2013

The bed and case guides are made of aluminum. They break when the bed is closed with the yoke not fully retracted into the body.
The case guides are easily made from 1/4 x 1/2 inch aluminum bar stock, a drill, drill bits, and Dremel with cutoff wheel or a thin kerf hacksaw. The case guides were changed to use set screws to align them with the bed guides in place of the shims which were made in 3 thicknesses.
The Top RF Pacemaker Speed is the same basic body as the Side RF Pacemaker Speed.

Tom1956 · Oct 20, 2013

Thanks. But I know I can repair things, because I can fix anything. That's not really my question. My question is whether my $177 can still be considered a good buy. I really didn''t buy something because I wanted another fix-it project. But I'm liable to, considering how much I'd have to pay for the next decent EBAY Speed Graphic if I send this one back. Thanks.

BrianShaw · Oct 20, 2013

For someone with so much confidence I'm surprised you lack the confidence to answer the question yourself. I'd send it back. It is no deal if you have to fix too many things and don't really want to fix things. There may be a better deal waiting out there, especially if you are in no rush. I once found a Anniversary Graphic (retrofitted with a Graphlock back) that was fully functional for $24 + shipping. I used it for 2 years before needing to have the shutter overhauled... and even after that it was still a good deal.

shutterfinger · Oct 20, 2013

But I know I can repair things, because I can fix anything. That's not really my question. My question is whether my $177 can still be considered a good buy.

Well, the yoke (rails) usually sell for $70 on ebay. A striped body goes for $50-$75. A good curtain on the rollers $40. There's $160-$195 before shipping if you need the parts or strip it and eventually sell them minus the listing time, packing and shipping time, and listing fees.

You have failed to state exactly what is broken and it may be just misassembled. Then there is the overall appearance to be considered.
Generally a Speed body needing servicing and or minor repair goes for $100 to $150 depending on what is wrong.

The camera and leaf shutter in working condition with clean lens goes for around $350 and said freshly serviced around $500 unless you buy from the seller looking for the collector that has to have that one then you'll pay 2 to 3 times those figures.

you probably got a good buy but without seeing it or knowing what is broken it will be a SWAG to give a definite yes or no answer.

I'll fix it for you for $250 + shipping both ways or I'll lease you my 5# sledge hammer for $50 + shipping.

BrianShaw · Oct 20, 2013

... so you don't want the sledge hammer returned?

Tom1956 · Oct 20, 2013

Thanks guys. It's that 152 Ektar with the glass in such beautiful condition that keeps nagging at me. Most camera an/or lenses on EBAY have "cleaning marks", so the sellers say. And if they say nothing, and you open the box, there are those damn "cleaning marks". They're called SCRATCHES. And this Ektar doesn't have any. This has been a tough call, but Monday is my deadline for sending it all back.
I already have a 10lb sledge, and a maul.

shutterfinger · Oct 20, 2013

... so you don't want the sledge hammer returned?

No, I'll just go to the big orange box store and get a new one and pocket the rest.

Ian Grant · Oct 20, 2013

shutterfinger said:
Well, the yoke (rails) usually sell for $70 on ebay. A striped body goes for $50-$75. A good curtain on the rollers $40. There's $160-$195 before shipping if you need the parts or strip it and eventually sell them minus the listing time, packing and shipping time, and listing fees.

You have failed to state exactly what is broken and it may be just misassembled. Then there is the overall appearance to be considered.
Generally a Speed body needing servicing and or minor repair goes for $100 to $150 depending on what is wrong.

The camera and leaf shutter in working condition with clean lens goes for around $350 and said freshly serviced around $500 unless you buy from the seller looking for the collector that has to have that one then you'll pay 2 to 3 times those figures.

you probably got a good buy but without seeing it or knowing what is broken it will be a SWAG to give a definite yes or no answer.

I'll fix it for you for $250 + shipping both ways or I'll lease you my 5# sledge hammer for $50 + shipping.

A bit of patience and you'd get the parts for far less. I've done that repairing a Speed & Super Graphic OK I waited about a year for the Super Graphic parts and they were from this Forum

I have a large map draw full of Graflex bits unfortunately nothing spare to help the OP and surprisingly they came from Paris (France not north america).

Ian

Shootar401 · Oct 29, 2013

I bought my first Speed an Anniversary with a 135mm lens, and a Heiland flash for $180. My second Speed was a 5x7 with a Graflite flash and a 7-1/2" Kodak lens for $80. My third speed was another Anniversary with a 127mm Ektar for $90, My forth cost me just $40.

Deals are out there if you want to wait.

Tom1956 · Oct 29, 2013

Since somebody pulled up this thread today, I thought I'd pass on what I finally did. I sent back that Speed, and won an auction for a Super Graphic AND the original flash, all in good condition for $197. It's supposed to get here tomorrow. Can't wait. If this works out, I'll get rid of my 2 Crowns I've had for ages, AND my Calumet view. This Super looks like it has all the front movement I ever had use for on the Calumet. I can't recall in 35 years of owning it if I ever used a rear-standard movement. This is a small house, and this can clear out a ton of space around here.

E. von Hoegh · Oct 29, 2013

Tom1956 said:
Since somebody pulled up this thread today, I thought I'd pass on what I finally did. I sent back that Speed, and won an auction for a Super Graphic AND the original flash, all in good condition for $197. It's supposed to get here tomorrow. Can't wait. If this works out, I'll get rid of my 2 Crowns I've had for ages, AND my Calumet view. This Super looks like it has all the front movement I ever had use for on the Calumet. I can't recall in 35 years of owning it if I ever used a rear-standard movement. This is a small house, and this can clear out a ton of space around here.

How long before you return that?

Tom1956 · Oct 29, 2013

E. von Hoegh said:
How long before you return that?

I won't be returning it. It looks to be in good shape, I got a good price, and if it has problems, I'll fix them.

smithdoor · Nov 2, 2013

I have new Crown Graphic since 1973 it is only 4 x 5 I have Work great

Dave

Thinking of a Speed Graphic

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency