Thinking About A Bronica C/C2

[wjlapier]

I'm still considering a Pentax 6x7, but just recently learned about the Bronica C/C2's. I don't mind the non changeable film back. Who has used one and what can you offer as an opinion? Anything to know and ask before looking further into one? Obviously fungus and mechanics, and light seals and mirror foam. But beyond that?

I like looking into a WLF camera. Hasselblad are out of the question these days. For me to buy another $4-500 camera I have to sell something. I might let my Zeiss Ikoflex and Minolta Autocord go if the C/C2 is a nice camera. Provided I can get it looked at by a repair person would be a big deciding factor.

Thanks again folks.

 

[moto-uno]

Repairers for those older Bronica's are getting very scarce, as are the parts . Those 2 cameras are (let's just say) very different beasts . Good luck , Peter

 

[reddesert]

There is no Bronica C2. There is an S2, and a C, which is similar to an S2 with a non-removable film back (uses same roll film inserts). There is a lot of myth and lore about these cameras on the interwebs, much of it having to do with the winding gears (so, don't buy a broken one). The thing you should watch out for, other than that the basic operations have to work, is that there is foam pressing the reflex mirror and focusing screen into place, and if this foam has deteriorated, you would get focus errors. It's replaceable by a talented user but requires a light touch. Just google "Bronica S2 mirror foam" and you'll find information.

Lenses for the Bronica S2/C/EC system are pretty inexpensive when you find them compared to other MF SLR systems. The focusing helical for all but the longest lenses is on the camera, not the lens.

 

[Greg Kriss]

I used a S2 with 3 lenses and one extra back for years. Never let me down. Have heard about the winding gear problems. A camera repair person told me that those problems were almost always caused by rough handling by the owners. Trouble is that these cameras are going on being 60 years old now. If I found one that was in like new condition, I would have to wonder if non-use has actually taken a toll on the camera's moving parts.

 

[moto-uno]

Most of the mechanics in those bodies might suffer from drying lubricants ( nothing compared to former USSR cameras ) . The medium
format cameras with shutter in lenses tend to require maintenance from dried lubes and under use more than the Bronica S and C bodies.
Such has been my very limited experience , Peter

 

[removedacct2]

Provided I can get it looked at by a repair person would be a big deciding factor..

repairmen for mechanical cameras are a dying specie..

I don't have a C but two S2 (one 1st version, the other 2nd version aka S2a), bodies are cheap.

The winding gear reputation of the S2 being of brass is a silly online meme certainly originating in pros in the past abusing the mechanism in hectic sessions of fast paced shootings. The main winding gears/teeth of the S2a are just much bigger than the one of the S2 but both are steel.

with a C you won't have light leaks or mating/transmission glitches between back and body...

yes foam replacement under focusing screen and under mirror will have to be done at certain point. Despite the focus on the 2nd body I bought being ok, I replaced the foams anyway. I went my way very easily, posted with details there:
https://www.photo.net/discuss/threa...rror-and-focus-foam-adjustement-pads.5520618/

on the S2a I had to lube a bit/fix the spring of the shutter speeds dial which was very hard, but that was really simple, just remove three screws under the leatherette, I didn't had to get to the mechanism.

lenses availability: easy to get the bigger 40mm, the 50, 75, 100, 105 leaf shutter, 135, 150 and 200. The smaller 40 and the 80 are a rarity. Some Komura and some Görlitz lenses were manufactured for this Bronica mount but are also uncommon.
The focusing unit has a 57mm thread, possible to adapt other lenses.
The Sonnar can be adapted directly on the body's mount, after modification, not trivial but doable, as well as the 300mm Orestegor.

what I like a lot is the 24 frames ie. 220 film possibility, because I make my own 220 rolls from whatever 120 ones (i have a simplistic cardboard guide usable in the dark for stitching two 120 rolls with tape, and correct leader and trail). When I shot a lot it's very convenient, to reload every 23 shots instead of every 12.

Repairmen? well it depends your part of the world. If i had to have a body fixed, locally here in Scandinavia would be very expensive, so I would use a shop in Lodz Poland specialized in old mechanical gear, or couple master technicians in Russia, or this guy in Ukraine who advertises his services with many disassembly insights videos and this one for the Bronica ((haven't use him for repair but once bought one of his detailed commented full disassembly video tutorial, for the Kiev-60, which allowed me to repair one I have)

otherwise I would just send to Japan

 

[Alan Gales]

I used to shoot Bronica EC's and I also had an S2a for a short time. They all take the same lenses. These cameras have interchangeable film backs. I really liked the cameras and especially the lenses. I sold them all due to the age of the cameras and lack of support and parts.

The Bronica C and C2 models were early models so even older than the cameras that I had. I don't think there are very many around so good luck finding any parts or parts cameras. You would be better off with the Pentax.

Since you don't mind not having changeable film backs and you love a waist level finder, how about Mamiya TLR's? They are inexpensive and so are their lenses. I own a C220f and I like it. The lenses all have leaf shutters and are very quiet unlike early Bronicas!

 

[wjlapier]

I went the C which is a C2 actually with 1/1000th top shutter speed and a switch to use 220 film. So, I like the way it feels. Viewfinder on this one is pretty bright and so far I don't think I'll switch out the GG for an Oleson. I'm sure the foam needs to be replaced but I don't shoot wide open often and am usually around f/8-f/11. I'll take it out for a shoot soon and see how it does, but dry fire the shutter sounds about right. Oh, and I'll need to address the light seals in the film door if I'm to use 220 in this camera which I will when I go on vacation. I'll probably send it to Frank Marshman for the mirror foam and rear door light seals.



The strap connectors are from a Mamiya camera that came with a Mamiya strap. I use it on my Fujifilm GX680IIIs, but for now they work fine on the C.

 

[elmontanero]

Whats the going rate on a working C with insert , WLF, and 75mm? I have a seller and I'm tempted.
Was checking it out, is there a slight clunk at the end of winding normal?

 

[reddesert]

When you wind a Bronica S2, it winds more or less smoothly as the film winds and the shutter curtain is drawn across, and then there's a firm clunk with more resistance at the very end of the stroke. That seems to be normal. I assume the C is the same. The EC does not have the same noticeable clunk at the end.

This thread talks a little about what happens during the S2 wind/shutter cycle: https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/bronica-s2-film-advance.47873/

 

[wjlapier]

Whats the going rate on a working C with insert , WLF, and 75mm? I have a seller and I'm tempted.
Was checking it out, is there a slight clunk at the end of winding normal?

Working you mean it will fire but needs light seals and foam replacement? Or after a full CLA and all foam and seals installed? Mine I paid about $400 shipped from Japan but it's in immaculate condition. It is in working condition and all shutter speeds sound right. Even the GG is clean and bright. But it does need the foam under the GG and mirror. I just did the seals in the door--there was a tiny leak and I think I know where it came from.

It does have the slight clunk like the S2/S2A.

I might get another eventually to have as a backup. I like it a lot.

 

[elmontanero]

Thanks for the reply wjlapier. This is a workman's and neglected since the digital arrival.
All worked as I could see it. The cranking went fine then right at the end slight feel like I was almost breaking something. Frightful for me as I'm a fan of gentle camera handling.

 

[moto-uno]

That last part of the crank wind will never be something you'll ever call gentle . Peter

 

[Spot V]

The behaviour of the crank as described is perfectly normal for an S2A, and thus most probably for a C, too. After you overcome the increasing resistance, the knob suddenly turns without noticeable resistance and then bumps into a hard stop. I use either the knob without unfolding the handle or push the handle with my thumb while holding the knob with the hand. This allows me to not bump into the hard stop. Becomes second nature after a while.
But yeah, the winding process of an old Buroni is about as gentle as its noise when you take a picture :-D Part of the quirkiness (does that word even exist?). In my experience, the S2A is even a bit less refind than the S2, when it comes to the winding feel.

 

[Geodesiq]

Apparently some C's had the 1/1000 speed marked and some didn't even tho it was available. Odd.