Thanks again for Fed Ex after a long trip

StephenS · Dec 3, 2006

After another extended stay in the OPT, I'm finally back and just mixed up my last gallon of developer to finish processing my film. Hope to have the remaining rolls done in a few days.

I must say how great, once again, Fed Ex is when it comes to flying with film. For those who travel you've probably noticed the number of CT scanners popping up. These will, no matter what the guy running the thing tells you, ruin your film. And if you are outside the U.S. there's no guarantee you'll get an inspection by hand. Certainly not where I fly out of.

Last spring I learned the hard way when I ruined a number of unexposed rolls I didn't want to pay the shipping home on. This time I shot almost everything I'd taken with me and although the Fed Ex bill was around $100, it was more than worth it. Considering I spent a long night in an Orwellian police station for some of what I shot, along with the usual bad stuff that goes on there, it's a small price to pay for piece of mind.

I still buy my film in the U.S. and take it with my carry on stuff, so the expense is only for the return. Hopefully, I'll still be able to do it that way for a bit.

On another note, since I'm still a film shooter for my personal work I do need a way to get my images into digital form for printing and other uses, I just recieved a new Nikon Coolscan and after a day of using it think it's awesome. No more driving to the university to use their equipment and the bother that entails. I can now work at my leisure. And work it will be as I have thousands of rolls of film from the last 15 years - some of which I've hardly even looked at. Ugh!

By the way, the situation where I work gets worse each time I go back. Terrible. People are really hurting.

P C Headland · Dec 4, 2006

StephenS said:
...

I must say how great, once again, Fed Ex is when it comes to flying with film. For those who travel you've probably noticed the number of CT scanners popping up. These will, no matter what the guy running the thing tells you, ruin your film. And if you are outside the U.S. there's no guarantee you'll get an inspection by hand. Certainly not where I fly out of.

Last spring I learned the hard way when I ruined a number of unexposed rolls I didn't want to pay the shipping home on. ....

Well, hundreds of thousands of travellers would disagree with you.

I've travelled quite a bit, round Europe and Australasia, and NEVER had a problem with fogged or damaged film that was scanned with HAND BAGGAGE scanners.

When in Europe, and taking weekly or twice weekly return flights (every flight in NL is international !), I always carried my Minox 35GT (plastic/macrolon) loaded with ISO400 film. Sometimes the film would pass 20 or more times through the scanners. Never saw any problems. Prior to returning to New Zealand, we travelled through France and Italy then on to Singapore and onwards to New Zealand. In this case, I was shooting TriX (120) at EI1000 for developing in Diafine. In spite of several trips through the hand baggage scanners, there was absolutely no evidence of fogging.

Don't forget, that in Europe, Australasia and many other places in the world scanning of hand luggage, at least for international flights, has been routine. Photographers in these places weren't experiencing (verifiable) problems.

Having said all that, I am glad your trip was successful

StephenS · Dec 4, 2006

P C Headland said:
I've travelled quite a bit, round Europe and Australasia, and NEVER had a problem with fogged or damaged film that was scanned with HAND BAGGAGE scanners.

Never said HAND BAGGAGE scanners. I said CT scanners.

These are not simple x-ray machines and they will ruin your film with a single pass through. These are big, complex, and expensive devices - therefore not everyone has them yet.

If you read my post you'll see my film travels with me to my destination and is put through a normal x-ray 3 or 4 times. It's the return that's a problem because going that way there's a CT scanner.

So if you'd like a nice sine wave through your film, have at it.

Dave Krueger · Dec 4, 2006

What is OPT?

If you carry the film as carry-on for the trip there, why not take it as carry-on for the return trip as well?

I'm planning a trip to India in February, so I am very concerned about this. I just plan to take the film as carry-on both ways. I will ask for hand inspection, but if they run it through the hand check baggage scanner, I've heard it won't hurt the film.

StephenS · Dec 4, 2006

OPT = Occupied Palestinian Territories, i.e. West Bank and Gaza.

As I said, on the return trip the airport I fly out of now uses CT scanners for all carry-on baggage. They have been using them for several years. (There is another reason I don't bring 60 rolls of exposed film home through this airport as well, but it has nothing to do with x-rays.)

On the way there, there are no CT scanners in place. This, however, may soon change as I believe there are new machines in use at JFK. I am not certain of that and had no problems this time.

Depending on the airports you're using and even the airline you're on, it may or may not be a problem. But after having a decent amount of unexposed film destroyed - all 400 ASA Tri-X 35mm and 120 - the small fee associated with Fed Ex is well worth it considering the other costs involved with travel and photography.

And the reason to use Fed Ex - since they use there own aircraft they don't x-ray cargo the way other carriers do. Again, this may change and can vary depending on where it is shipped from.

Tony Egan · Dec 5, 2006

Australian photographer Stephen Dupont had a nasty experience having his film completely ruined by Israeli customs after multiple trips through what was probably a CT scanner "just to be sure". He was working on a series on the Wall and I guess he was being "monitored". On previous trips I believe he travelled overland through Jordan but decided to try and save time and fly out from Israel carrying his film - a bad choice in retrospect.
Welcome back StephenS.

dxphoto · Dec 6, 2006

I had my tri-x shoot at EI1600 without any problems. I took them into the Met in NYC a few times and got scanned with their x-ray machine. I tried to get them hand checked but the guy insist as long as it's not iso 1600 it was out of question. And I didn't want to explain to him what was called "push processing". Anyway I didn't have the problem. But I thought about mail the film to hotel before the trip via USPS. I am not sure even ask them to put "DO NOT X-RAY" on the package will stop them being x-rayed. I do bulk loading, the 135 cassettes are marked from 100 to 400 anyway, regardless what the actual films are.
One thing for sure is the check-in luggage x-ray is much more powerful!! In this case, can you use those x-ray block wrap to protect the film?

bill schwab · Dec 6, 2006

Earlier this year I had my film run through a CT scanner on return from a trip to Scotland at Detroit's Metro Airport. They got the bag before I knew what was happening so I didn't have a chance to ask for a hand check. Fortunately I had no trouble with it fogging my film. Perhaps there are different types or strengths of machines?

B.

naturephoto1 · Dec 6, 2006

billschwab said:
Earlier this year I had my film run through a CT scanner on return from a trip to Scotland at Detroit's Metro Airport. They got the bag before I knew what was happening so I didn't have a chance to ask for a hand check. Fortunately I had no trouble with it fogging my film. Perhaps there are different types or strengths of machines?

B.

Hi Bill,

I haven't travelled by air in sometime. But, as I understand it there are different and different kinds of machines. Additionally, the x-Ray output for the machines can be adjusted by the operator.

Rich

copake_ham · Dec 6, 2006

dxphoto said:
..... But I thought about mail the film to hotel before the trip via USPS. I am not sure even ask them to put "DO NOT X-RAY" on the package will stop them being x-rayed. ....In this case, can you use those x-ray block wrap to protect the film?

In order to "balance" my film supply b/w New York and Tucson, I send film out there via USPS just prior to heading there. Generally send it with a larger package of stuff I don't want to hassle with as carry-on (e.g. "nasty looking" bicycle crankshafts etc.).

What I do is put the film in the lead-lined film bag inside the box. If they do X-ray it (I don't think so but not sure) - the film should be fine (I haven't sent anything faster than 400 ISO).

Then, if I shoot chromes in Tucson, I use mailers and have the processed slides sent to my NY address.

For, print film, I put the exposed rolls in the film bag (which the USPS has kindly delivered to me in Tucson ready for my return trip) and do carry-on with "hand inspection"

naturephoto1 · Dec 6, 2006

I have used a technique that we used while working in the environmental field for 8 years to ship film and hiking/backpacing equipment. When working in the environmental field, we had to collect environmental water and soil samples that we shipped to the lab in Coleman or Igloo coolers. We would pack the samples in the cooler and use duct tape to seal the packages. Though the samples sent to lab were kept under custody seals, that I never use with my personal shipments.

What I would do is to get a cooler that is about perhaps 100 quart size, pack it with some film (frequently Fuji QL) along with a backpack, backpacking clothing and equipment, etc. As mentioned, the cooler would be duct taped closed and then shipped to a FEDEX depot for pick-up by me. The same could be done for DHL, UPS, etc. I have mentioned this practice to several other friends that are photographers that now use the technique. The coolers can cost perhaps $40 to about $65 dollars. They are insulated, strong, light, and durable. I have used the same coolers for years and have shipped these same coolers many times across the country. They get banged up but the film and equipment arrives in good order. I use the cooler to hide items when left in the car/truck and also use the same cooler to keep film cooler while on the trip. At the end of the trip I just ship the cooler, unused film and equipment back home to me. This works well at least traveling around the US, I can not say how this would work for international shipments.

Rich

jstraw · Dec 6, 2006

naturephoto1 said:
I have used a technique that we used while working in the environmental field for 8 years to ship film and hiking/backpacing equipment. When working in the environmental field, we had to collect environmental water and soil samples that we shipped to the lab in Coleman or Igloo coolers. We would pack the samples in the cooler and use duct tape to seal the packages. Though the samples sent to lab were kept under custody seals, that I never use with my personal shipments.

What I would do is to get a cooler that is about perhaps 100 quart size, pack it with some film (frequently Fuji QL) along with a backpack, backpacking clothing and equipment, etc. As mentioned, the cooler would be duct taped closed and then shipped to a FEDEX depot for pick-up by me. The same could be done for DHL, UPS, etc. I have mentioned this practice to several other friends that are photographers that now use the technique. The coolers can cost perhaps $40 to about $65 dollars. They are insulated, strong, light, and durable. I have used the same coolers for years and have shipped these same coolers many times across the country. They get banged up but the film and equipment arrives in good order. I use the cooler to hide items when left in the car/truck and also use the same cooler to keep film cooler while on the trip. At the end of the trip I just ship the cooler, unused film and equipment back home to me. This works well at least traveling around the US, I can not say how this would work for international shipments.

Rich

Excellent idea. Do you not include your exposed film in the return shipment?

naturephoto1 · Dec 6, 2006

jstraw said:
Excellent idea. Do you not include your exposed film in the return shipment?

Sometimes I will send the exposed film back. However, when possible and away for sometime, I try to find a Pro lab to process particularly the Sheet E6 film. That way I confirm that my exposures are right, wrong, or almost and that I have not had a complete loss on the shoot. Sheet (Quickload 4 X 5) film is just too expensive to not cover your butt on an extended trip. Smaller format film may be shipped back to one of the labs that I use (or used to as they are shutting down). That way I avoid the issue of running the film through x-Ray.

Rich

P C Headland · Dec 7, 2006

naturephoto1 said:
Hi Bill,

I haven't travelled by air in sometime. But, as I understand it there are different and different kinds of machines. Additionally, the x-Ray output for the machines can be adjusted by the operator.

Rich

The operators cannot adjust the level of the X-rays of the hand baggage scanners. All they can do is adjust the contrast of the image on the screen.

StephenS · Dec 7, 2006

Rich, the normal x-ray machines they use for hand baggage operate at lower levels (because people are around them) than those for checked baggage. I doubt all but the fastest film would be damaged after repeated passes. I've never seen evidence of unwanted exposure after half a dozen or more passes. In fact, I never ask for hand inspection because it's usually more trouble than it's worth and don't bother with lead bags as it usually generates a more thorough inspection.

Another thing to consider is fewer people are flying with film. Everyone has a digital these days and x-rays, ct scans, or whatever has no effect. This combined with increased security and affordability of new scanners will make flying with film an even bigger hassle. Somone else confirmed what I said about ruined carry-on film at one particular airport, so it does happen.

I'll bet damage occurs even more than reported because it can be minimal depending on what was shot and who looks at the final photos. After I shot some of the film I put through the CT to test it, the damage varied slightly between rolls. A casual user may never notice a band of increased density running through their negatives or a lighter band through their prints.

One funny aside; I put my video camera, while it was secretly recording, on the conveyor belt of an x-ray machine at a checkpoint. Nothing else was going through at the time and I got a great shot of it heading into the machine, through the curtain, into the blackness, one sprinkle of static, then out the curtain where a little Palestinian boy was at eye level watching it go down the conveyor toward him. Fun stuff!

grnbrg · Dec 24, 2006

Film scanning in airports

One more thing to worry about; if you use sheet film and the box has been opened, the inspectors may insist on opening the box (or let you run it through the machine.) In that case you have a choice. But if you're not paying close attention while watching your equipment, gathering your other valuables, and putting your shoes back on, they may open the boxes before they consult with you (as happened to me.)

Michael Kadillak · Dec 24, 2006

P C Headland said:
Well, hundreds of thousands of travellers would disagree with you.

I've travelled quite a bit, round Europe and Australasia, and NEVER had a problem with fogged or damaged film that was scanned with HAND BAGGAGE scanners.

When in Europe, and taking weekly or twice weekly return flights (every flight in NL is international !), I always carried my Minox 35GT (plastic/macrolon) loaded with ISO400 film. Sometimes the film would pass 20 or more times through the scanners. Never saw any problems. Prior to returning to New Zealand, we travelled through France and Italy then on to Singapore and onwards to New Zealand. In this case, I was shooting TriX (120) at EI1000 for developing in Diafine. In spite of several trips through the hand baggage scanners, there was absolutely no evidence of fogging.

Don't forget, that in Europe, Australasia and many other places in the world scanning of hand luggage, at least for international flights, has been routine. Photographers in these places weren't experiencing (verifiable) problems.

Having said all that, I am glad your trip was successful

Once it happns to you I can promise you that you will not be as optimistic. Security in the polarized world we now live in is a highly dynamic event and it is constantly changing without any warning. Fewer and fewer peole even saying the word "film" at check points does not help. The age old addage "An once if prevention is worth a pound of cure" is true. Take this variable out of the equation since you probably have considerable costs in the trip and it is simply not worth the risks.

Whatever works

gr82bart · Dec 25, 2006

I don't know about your LF sheet film guys, but on international trips, I try to buy and process most of my film when I get to my destination. I have a catalog of film shops and film labs in the major cities that I go to, that will sell/process my E-6 120mm rolls. I generally call ahead too to be sure. A couple times I have prepaid processing and shipping, left my film there for processing and had the lab send it to me via DHL afterwards. So far no issues.

In general, though, I have had no issues flying with film or my camera gear.

Regards, Art.

lightranger · Jan 4, 2007

As far as I know Fed ex is the only one that does not x-ray packages. I couldn't find out if they do for oversea shipments. On my last trip I used my old lead film bag, because they would not hand check my ready load film packs. I thought the lead bag would stop the machine, but it went right through. It must be that the x-ray strength went right through the bag. It makes my curious to know what the machine sees with a lead bag. Kodak says all film will see an increase in fog after four times being x-rayed. So if you buy your film by mail order it has been x-rayed at least once, but most likely twice with the shipment to the distributor. Things to think about. I wasn't aware of CT scanners for hand bags, so that put a new scare in me. I prefer to Fed Ex when I can. I usually call the hotel that I will be staying in and tell them about my film shipment coming in before my arrival. It has worked well every time I have done it. For me film is best.

Petzi · Jan 4, 2007

StephenS said:
I still buy my film in the U.S. and take it with my carry on stuff, so the expense is only for the return. Hopefully, I'll still be able to do it that way for a bit.

It does not matter whether you expose the film in the x-ray device before you expose it in the camera, or afterwards.

Uncle Bill · Jan 4, 2007

After reading all this I am wondering if air travel is worth it any more.

Bill

Petzi · Jan 4, 2007

Uncle Bill said:
After reading all this I am wondering if air travel is worth it any more.

Bill

It isn't. I haven't done it since Spring 2001. If you fly to the USA, you will be humiliated at the border. There are great photo opportunities that you can reach by car. Discover your own place.

I do not worry much about X-rays though, only once was I forced to put my film through the hand baggage scanner, that was in Budapest. In every other place, manual control was OK.

Vaughn · Jan 5, 2007

lightranger...

When they come across a lead-lined bag in check-in baggage, they just turn up the juice until they can see through it. One hates to imagine what is going on inside the lead bag at that point.

Vaughn

lightranger · Jan 5, 2007

Vaughn,
That's what I was thinking also. The last two times I tried to have may ready load film hand checked, it failed the chemical wipe down test. So I was forced at the last moment to put it throught the scanner. I wish I could confirm if they can actually increase the x-ray strenght on the carry on bagage scanner if you use a lead bag. The days of ever putting film in the check in baggage is long gone.

Thanks again for Fed Ex after a long trip

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