sync with radio triggers

mweintraub · May 22, 2014

kintatsu said:
As I understand it, the flash synch is limited to whatever your camera can handle. If you're using an RB-67, your lens's fastest should be good, but use it with a focal plane curtain shutter, and you're likely to be limited to 1/30-1/250.

I've had great luck with the ones like I listed previously. Several folks make them, and they're cheap enough on Amazon. You can even get a set with 1 TX and 3 RX. They work with PC synch cables, so they're not brand specific.

I do, however, like the Cactus ones you listed as a possible upgrade for my digital work. I'm planning on getting the 568EX2, so they might be worth an extended look! Thanks for the link!

Correct. Low battery levels affect the sync speeds for wireless triggers so if it can sync up to 1/1000s when full, I would think that when battery levels are low, it will still be successful at syncing at 1/500s easily.

I've been having issues with my studio strobes (Fotodiox) where it is too fast or something because when I try to sync very fast (1/200s +) the result is underexposure. So I believe flashes/strobe duration do have a part in it.

I, too, think the V6 would be a great addition to my digital and 35mm shooting.

kintatsu · May 22, 2014

mweintraub said:
Correct. Low battery levels affect the sync speeds for wireless triggers so if it can sync up to 1/1000s when full, I would think that when battery levels are low, it will still be successful at syncing at 1/500s easily.

I've been having issues with my studio strobes (Fotodiox) where it is too fast or something because when I try to sync very fast (1/200s +) the result is underexposure. So I believe flashes/strobe duration do have a part in it.

I, too, think the V6 would be a great addition to my digital and 35mm shooting.

It's not just the flash duration or battery. With a focal plane curtain shutter, only part of the image is illuminated as the shutter travels across the image plane. With a leaf or diaphragm shutter, the whole image is exposed to the flash, which triggers when the shutter is generally fully open.

If you're using a focal plane shutter, the results of shooting faster than synch are dark bands at one end or side of the image where the flash was not exposed. The faster the shutter, the larger the band. Based on your 1/200 showing underexposed, I would guess a flash synch of 1/30 on a focal plane shutter. The RB-67 uses the leaf shutter, so synch is possible at all speeds the lens can accommodate.

mweintraub · May 22, 2014

kintatsu said:
It's not just the flash duration or battery. With a focal plane curtain shutter, only part of the image is illuminated as the shutter travels across the image plane. With a leaf or diaphragm shutter, the whole image is exposed to the flash, which triggers when the shutter is generally fully open.

If you're using a focal plane shutter, the results of shooting faster than synch are dark bands at one end or side of the image where the flash was not exposed. The faster the shutter, the larger the band. Based on your 1/200 showing underexposed, I would guess a flash synch of 1/30 on a focal plane shutter. The RB-67 uses the leaf shutter, so synch is possible at all speeds the lens can accommodate.

Correct. Focal plane shutters usually have a max sync speed of 1/250s. I was testing my theory on a Nikon D700 which has has it's top speed at 1/250s. Also, my testing involved a Mamiya RZ67 with leaf lenses. In another thread here, I've posted some samples of my findings. But I think I might need to make a thread in the lighting section rather than the Medium Format one.

None the less, I think that flash duration has something to do with underexposure because if it's short and isn't at full power while the shutter is open, then wouldn't the light hitting the film/sensor not be at metered?

baachitraka · May 23, 2014

But some cheap triggers do not sync @1/500 with leaf shutters. Tested my Yongnuo rf-603 with my Rolleicord and you see the shutter not opening completely.

* rf-603 may need a mod to work with older cameras.

mweintraub · May 23, 2014

Yeah, the RF-60x series aren't rated that high.

My CTR-301Ps are rated for 1/500s. Also, I seem to be getting fast sync speeds with portable speedlights, just had issues with the Fotodiox strobes. I need to get my hands on other ones to try.

omaha · May 23, 2014

A few months ago, I bit the bullet and bought a set of PocketWizard PlusX triggers. Not cheap, but ultimately a small price to pay for the peace of mind that comes from knowing you have one less thing to be worried about.

kintatsu · May 23, 2014

baachitraka said:
But some cheap triggers do not sync @1/500 with leaf shutters. Tested my Yongnuo rf-603 with my Rolleicord and you see the shutter not opening completely.

* rf-603 may need a mod to work with older cameras.

What is your flash synch set to? There are a couple sync modes. M which delays shutter opening for about 1/4 seconds to allow your flash to reach full output, and X, which is instantaneous. If you're using electronic flash you have to be in X mode, otherwise the shutter will allow no light from the flash into the camera. Looking at the manual for the Rolleicords began offering the X sync selector around 1955.

kintatsu · May 23, 2014

omaha said:
A few months ago, I bit the bullet and bought a set of PocketWizard PlusX triggers. Not cheap, but ultimately a small price to pay for the peace of mind that comes from knowing you have one less thing to be worried about.

Without a doubt! If I were pro, I would probably go with these. I've seen them in action and they are nice!

kintatsu · May 23, 2014

mweintraub said:
... flash duration has something to do with underexposure because if it's short and isn't at full power while the shutter is open, then wouldn't the light hitting the film/sensor not be at metered?

I replied first to someone else about sync modes. Your statement is why older cameras were M mode sync, generally. If the mode is set to M, then electronic flash won't expose correctly, as it triggers the flash prior to the shutter even opening.

When metering flash, the shutter speed should be included in the calculation. Some meters allow you to set the shutter speed and then they provide the reading. With my Gossen, changing the shutter speed sometimes changes the aperture reading on the meter.

mweintraub · May 23, 2014

The RF-603s are known for being slow, so I can't blame the camera setup.

Yeah, I'd love the PW Xs too, because I can then get a plug in module for my light meter. So, if the V6s were actually more expensive, I'd really consider the PWs even more.

What model Gossen, I'd like to review that manual.

kintatsu · May 23, 2014

mweintraub said:
The RF-603s are known for being slow, so I can't blame the camera setup.

Yeah, I'd love the PW Xs too, because I can then get a plug in module for my light meter. So, if the V6s were actually more expensive, I'd really consider the PWs even more.

What model Gossen, I'd like to review that manual.

The Starlite 2. It does spot, reflected, incident, flash, zone system, and other stuff. I like that I can get the luminance values either from the exposure formula, or from a quick calculation based on the illuminance. The exposure formula is definitely quicker!

mweintraub · May 23, 2014

kintatsu said:
The Starlite 2. It does spot, reflected, incident, flash, zone system, and other stuff. I like that I can get the luminance values either from the exposure formula, or from a quick calculation based on the illuminance. The exposure formula is definitely quicker!

*Searches for this flash... sees price... just blinks*. haha

So, what exactly am I looking for when looking for the feature to compensate based on shutter speeds?

kintatsu · May 23, 2014

mweintraub said:
*Searches for this flash... sees price... just blinks*. haha
So, what exactly am I looking for when looking for the feature to compensate based on shutter speeds?

The price was steep. I thought maybe too steep, but where I'm trying to get everything right now, it was an important step for me. Given that I was blessed with a rare bit of extra to splurge, it was the right time! My photography has improved, because my results are repeatable now, and my visualizing things can be more accurately made concrete.

On page 23 and 24 of the manual it explains it a bit. Basically read your scene without a flash, and enter that time into your meter when you switch to flash mode. Once you meter the flash, your exposure will be what you want. It'll even give you an indication of the exposure on the non-flashed part of the scene with a solid tick by the f-stop for incident exposure and a flashing tick for the flash exposure to get your ratios. You can also work the other way. Get your flash reading, then set that f/stop into the reflected metering, and take a reading. That will give you the correct exposure for both.

Just reading the flash may not be enough for some tricky lighting situations. I often run into those when I'm shooting my wife and her friends with the digital, and not so much with film.

baachitraka · May 23, 2014

My camera was set to X. @1/500 they are slow.

kintatsu · May 24, 2014

baachitraka said:
My camera was set to X. @1/500 they are slow.

I haven't shot that fast, so I can't really say. I would think it wouldn't be a problem, but I use different ones. My fastest speed 1/400 and they work good for what I do with them.

benjiboy · May 24, 2014

I use Phottix Ares radio triggers they are suitable for all my manual none T.T.L. flash guns and studio flashes,reasonably priced and both the transmitter and receivers are powered by standard A.A batteries not hard to find Lithium button batteries, have a range of 200 meters and work well for me both indoors and outside. I prefer to use a fully manual flash system and a hand held flash meter so I can calculate the contrast ratios between the lights and check the balance between the ambient daylight (if any) and flash.

sync with radio triggers

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