Sworn at while taking photographs

MurrayMinchin · Sep 19, 2024

I tried the bumbling, confused photographer routine a couple weeks ago with a rangefinder camera, and it works!

I strolled through an outdoor farmers market and would look past who I was photographing, lift the camera, take a photo, then immediately look down at the top of the camera and fiddle with the aperture dial with a confused look on my face as I walked past them.

Worked like a charm and could take photos from a couple feet away without them knowing.

grain elevator · Sep 19, 2024

I don't remember being yelled at, but I've received relatively polite gesturing, hostile looks as well as comments questioning my sanity and/or the legality of photographing a container for glass waste (!, although they may have thought I had a long focal length and was photographing something behind or them).

rduraoc · Sep 19, 2024

Alex Benjamin said:
Indeed, the laws regarding right of privacy and right of image are quite restrictive in Canada, France, Germany, and many other countries. This has been discussed in another thread not too long ago.

The US is actually unique in that it puts freedom of speech — category in which falls artistic expression (in our case, street photography) — above right of privacy and right of image. The US constitution is set up that way. Not at all the same with Canada and many European countries, where individual rights puts some restriction on right of speech.

This is why the "cultural embedded expectation" regarding public space is very different whether you're in (or from) the US or elsewhere. Elsewhere, as you mention, one is entitled to expect privacy even in a public space.

Should be specified that the restrictions defined the laws regarding righ of image relate to publishing photos (including posting on the web), not taking the photo (although there are a few exceptions, as in the German law forbidding photographing people if there are in a vulnerable—as in an accident—or humiliating situation).

This website can be used as a good starting point. In most cases taking the photo is legal, the questions come when publishing and, particularly, when having commercial use.

TomR55 · Sep 19, 2024

*****
I have spent many years photographing urban and suburban areas (in the US and a bit in Western Europe); I found that asking permission in certain situations and just refraining from photographing in other situations just part of the job.

Within the last ten years I have noted a marked change in the public attitudes towards photographers in the US. Ten years ago, I stopped photographing near playgrounds, schools (when in session) and other “public” spaces. Within the last two years, I have been warned-off by well-meaning locals and threatened with physical violence on several occasions for photographing on a public street near someone’s front yard. ***** As a result, I have changed the kinds of projects I design and undertake.

{Moderator's note: Portions of post that responded to now deleted portions of posts deleted, along with political commentary}

CMoore · Sep 19, 2024

Twice.
Once by an irate mother. I apologized, fiddled around on the back of me Nikon F2S and told her i deleted the pictures.

Second time was weird.
Was about to take pics at a train station.. Guy at a bench starts yelling at me, saying......No way, oh no you dont, get out of here, etc etc etc.

He comes over to me and gets in my face. slobbering and swearing.
I had both hands on my camera, turned real quick and elbowed him in the chest as hard as i could. That put him on the ground.
His girlfriend came running over.
I told her calmly..... "If he gets up before i leave, i am going to F'ing kill him"
Guess he did not want me taking pictures of the train station.

Trying to figure the math..... Way less than 0.50% of the time.?

darkosaric · Sep 19, 2024

Once I was screamed on while taking a picture of a fountain in Hamburg next to the church (st. Michael church, most famous church in Hamburg, a lot of tourist there) - because there was a dog of the screaming lady beside a fountain. She was screaming not to take photo of her dog. That was very strange indeed.

mshchem · Sep 19, 2024

foc said:
There are always grumpy, inhosipital people on any island, small or big.

Irish people swear a lot but in Ireland, the expression F**k can have different meanings, depending on the context it was used.

"Would you ever go and f**k off" = "Go away and leave me along".

"Go away to f**k ! or f**k off !" = "I don't believe you! or (depending on contex) Just go away".

"You will in your f**k" = "You will not"

A milder form of the word that can be used is Feck.

There are many more, but you get the jist.

The luck you say

Sirius Glass · Sep 19, 2024

I have had a few people tell me not to take a photograph of them and I walk away. I have been told by building security that I cannot take a photograph when I am standing in the street or on the sidewalk when I point out that I am on public property and they have no legal right to stop me. Some of those have become hostile. Depending on my mood I will argue back, tell them to call the police, or walk away, but I always make sure that they see me take photographs anyway.

BAC1967 · Sep 20, 2024

I’ve never encountered hostility but a few guys on one if our crews at work had a scary encounter. They were working in a rough neighborhood in Los Angeles when they saw some young men trying to break into cars across the street. They started taking pictures with their phones. The young men saw this, came over and pulled a gun on them. They exchanged a few cuss words but luckily nobody was hurt.

Agulliver · Sep 20, 2024

These experiences are all in the UK where we have the right to take photos in public spaces and of anything that can be reasonably seen from a public place.

One night about five years ago I had been photographing a gig and had some film left, so a few blocks from the venue I set the camera down on a brick wall to take some long exposures of the traffic passing by....a local youth assumed I was photographing him and said he'd kill me if I was taking his photo. What a pleasant fellow.

More recently I was having fun with my Lomography Konstruktor and happened to walk though the local shopping mall, which is what we used to call an Arndale Centre. Legally it is public streets. I set the camera up to take a general wide-ish shot and an over-zealous security guard accosted me, deliberately bumping the camera so the photo was ruined. He tried to tell me that using a camera was forbidden "by the rules"....so I calmly asked him which rules, and he couldn't answer that. I then pointed out people taking selfies with phones, photographing the new food hall with their phones and asked why I couldn't do the same "with this" and he muttered some expletives but left me alone.

I used to get very dirty looks if I took anything bigger than a pocket compact camera to the beach. It's funny how things change. Back in the day nobody batted an eyelid at a medium format camera or 35mm SLR at the beach. Then suddenly anyone with a "proper" camera at the beach was assumed to be up to no good. Now things have turned back towards the right direction.

There are also some great experiences. One time in Camden I came across a young punk couple who were dressed in their best punk gear, while I had a little Agfa Super Silette. I asked if I could take a photo and they posed for multiple shots and took interest in the camera.

I've never had any issues with police in the UK either. I think they now know the limits of their powers, which are basically nil in this regard. It is always security guards. Though it's worth noting that some places that appear to be public are privately owned and it is then legally up to the owners if they wish to permit photography. In most cases I cannot fathom why they wouldn't. I do know of one person who deliberately goes to such places to take photos and if he's challenged, he points it out to everyone he knows. 99% of the time we want to make a building or square/plaza look good, or at least interesting.

loccdor · Sep 20, 2024

When I lived in a rougher part of a city, there was a homeless guy who was always around the same street corner. Whenever he saw you, he would start hurling swears, insults, racial slurs at you until you were out of earshot. Occasionally he would follow you around. No camera was required to get this behavior out of him. Usually you just had to look at him, but sometimes not even that.

But he still wasn't as creepy as the guy who would walk up and down the same sidewalk day after day breathing and cackling like a demon while saying "I'm gonna kill her" over and over again. Everyone crossed the street when they saw him coming.

For five years while commuting to college on mass transit these people were a daily presence. On the one had it was good for me to see "how bad things can get" but I'm glad I moved somewhere safer.

wiltw · Sep 20, 2024

jeffreyg said:
Once very many years ago on a country road in France I passed a colorful “gypsy” wagon being pulled by a couple of ponies. I pulled up ahead and got out to take just a snapshot to show our then young children. As they approached the driver covered his face and ended up bumping a car that had also stopped. While they were yelling at each other, his teenaged son ran over and grabbed my car outside mirror. While my wife was yelling at him, his father secured the wagon, ran over and jumped on the hood of our car banging on the windshield with his fist. I showed him some money and slightly lowered my window. He got off and I threw the money out. I popped the clutch and took off and joked with my wife that I thought he put a curse on us. Shortly later while riding behind a school bus it flipped up a stone and shattered our windshield. To make matters worse it started raining. We did manage to get a new one put in after getting drenched. That night we had trouble finding a hotel but managed to get a room in what was as best a dump We weren’t sure when the sheets were last washed so we slept in our clothes. There was no food available but we happened to have an apple that we split for dinner. The next day we stayed at a top notch hotel in the town of Brive . We told the people there of our experience and they said be careful of the “nomads” they can cut your throat

Did you toilet also stop up when you got home?

Andrew O'Neill · Sep 20, 2024

Once, while photographing in the mountains in Japan, a monkey up in a tree, cursed me for being there and threw bits of twigs down on me. Sorry. That's all I've got.

jeffreyg · Sep 20, 2024

Wiltw. Fortunately our toilets were fine but on our next trip to France a few years later I got a case of food poisoning and randomly had my carry on camera bag weighed which was overweight resulting in an extra fee. I wasn’t sure that was related to my previous experience.

BrianShaw · Sep 20, 2024

Andrew O'Neill said:
Once, while photographing in the mountains in Japan, a monkey up in a tree, cursed me for being there and threw bits of twigs down on me. Sorry. That's all I've got.

If all the monkey threw were twigs then you are quite fortunate…

NiallerM · Sep 20, 2024

Agulliver said:
These experiences are all in the UK where we have the right to take photos in public spaces and of anything that can be reasonably seen from a public place.

One night about five years ago I had been photographing a gig and had some film left, so a few blocks from the venue I set the camera down on a brick wall to take some long exposures of the traffic passing by....a local youth assumed I was photographing him and said he'd kill me if I was taking his photo. What a pleasant fellow.

More recently I was having fun with my Lomography Konstruktor and happened to walk though the local shopping mall, which is what we used to call an Arndale Centre. Legally it is public streets. I set the camera up to take a general wide-ish shot and an over-zealous security guard accosted me, deliberately bumping the camera so the photo was ruined. He tried to tell me that using a camera was forbidden "by the rules"....so I calmly asked him which rules, and he couldn't answer that. I then pointed out people taking selfies with phones, photographing the new food hall with their phones and asked why I couldn't do the same "with this" and he muttered some expletives but left me alone.

I used to get very dirty looks if I took anything bigger than a pocket compact camera to the beach. It's funny how things change. Back in the day nobody batted an eyelid at a medium format camera or 35mm SLR at the beach. Then suddenly anyone with a "proper" camera at the beach was assumed to be up to no good. Now things have turned back towards the right direction.

There are also some great experiences. One time in Camden I came across a young punk couple who were dressed in their best punk gear, while I had a little Agfa Super Silette. I asked if I could take a photo and they posed for multiple shots and took interest in the camera.

I've never had any issues with police in the UK either. I think they now know the limits of their powers, which are basically nil in this regard. It is always security guards. Though it's worth noting that some places that appear to be public are privately owned and it is then legally up to the owners if they wish to permit photography. In most cases I cannot fathom why they wouldn't. I do know of one person who deliberately goes to such places to take photos and if he's challenged, he points it out to everyone he knows. 99% of the time we want to make a building or square/plaza look good, or at least interesting.

Ah. You've touched on the other side of things there. A couple of years ago, on alighting the Metro in a square in the city centre, I found myself in the middle of a huge Pride festival. I had my TLR with me and my Pentax in my back pack. People were begging to be photographed. I kept telling them it was on film so I couldn't mail them on - and also that I had only B&W stock with me, but they wanted to be snapped. I got some really good photos that day - including one of a young woman I would like to photograph again. There was something almost painfully wistful about her beauty.

Sirius Glass · Sep 20, 2024

Andrew O'Neill said:
Once, while photographing in the mountains in Japan, a monkey up in a tree, cursed me for being there and threw bits of twigs down on me. Sorry. That's all I've got.

Did you photograph the monkey to show it who was in charge?

NiallerM · Sep 20, 2024

I was having a cigarette outside my then office in Brussels one day when I noticed the security guards rushing out to stop someone taking a photo of a sculpture positioned outside the building. It was owned by the bank, but was in the centre of the pavement. It was ludicrous. The guy could have, had he wished, retreated a distance and shot for cropping. He could have been invisible while taking the photo if he had even a moderate tele-photo.

One issue I had recently was taking my Fujifilm XT-5 into Lord's Cricket Ground. It's a famous ground. The famous ground. My bag was searched and the security guy said "No professional cameras allowed." I had the conditions of entry, which allowed gear up to a 200mm lens and I showed him that the longest lens I had was 200mm. He tapped the brand into his phone and the first bloody word he saw was "prosumer". He let me in reluctantly, when I said that I wasn't a professional. I breathed a sigh off relief once inside. The lens is 300mm when crop factor is taken into account. Fair enough, though. They have professionals in there who have worked hard to get their good positions. In turn, I won't publish what I took.

Milpool · Sep 20, 2024

Andrew O'Neill said:
Once, while photographing in the mountains in Japan, a monkey up in a tree, cursed me for being there and threw bits of twigs down on me. Sorry. That's all I've got.

That monkey was a real jerk! (sorry, I was just imagining what Norm Macdonald would have said)

DREW WILEY · Sep 20, 2024

I've had much worse things happen. Won't go into details. Even in seemingly innocuous landscape settings, someone might be engaged in some illegal activity they want hidden, or perhaps they're just an ornery armed nutcase. Either way, promptly get out of there.

cliveh · Sep 20, 2024

jeffreyg said:
Once very many years ago on a country road in France I passed a colorful “gypsy” wagon being pulled by a couple of ponies. I pulled up ahead and got out to take just a snapshot to show our then young children. As they approached the driver covered his face and ended up bumping a car that had also stopped. While they were yelling at each other, his teenaged son ran over and grabbed my car outside mirror. While my wife was yelling at him, his father secured the wagon, ran over and jumped on the hood of our car banging on the windshield with his fist. I showed him some money and slightly lowered my window. He got off and I threw the money out. I popped the clutch and took off and joked with my wife that I thought he put a curse on us. Shortly later while riding behind a school bus it flipped up a stone and shattered our windshield. To make matters worse it started raining. We did manage to get a new one put in after getting drenched. That night we had trouble finding a hotel but managed to get a room in what was as best a dump We weren’t sure when the sheets were last washed so we slept in our clothes. There was no food available but we happened to have an apple that we split for dinner. The next day we stayed at a top notch hotel in the town of Brive . We told the people there of our experience and they said be careful of the “nomads” they can cut your throat

That is also horrendous, but why did you give the guy money? I can't imagine someone from the UK doing that.

Agulliver · Sep 20, 2024

NiallerM said:
Ah. You've touched on the other side of things there. A couple of years ago, on alighting the Metro in a square in the city centre, I found myself in the middle of a huge Pride festival. I had my TLR with me and my Pentax in my back pack. People were begging to be photographed. I kept telling them it was on film so I couldn't mail them on - and also that I had only B&W stock with me, but they wanted to be snapped. I got some really good photos that day - including one of a young woman I would like to photograph again. There was something almost painfully wistful about her beauty.

I lent a friend a humble Halina 35X for Pride in London this year, and even with B&W film and practically zero experience of shooting film she got some cracking shots....partly because she was part of the march so right in with the parade. And it's lead her to take the decision to buy a 35mm camera.

I shot Pride in Luton on colour film this year and ended up having the organisation use some of my photos in their social media. Again, everyone was very friendly and wanted to be photographed especially the musical acts. I tend to find at events of any kind, the best thing is to actually mingle with people and enjoy the event, get chatting...then they want you to take their photos.

Same thing with a camper van festival I was asked to photograph by the organisers. They also hired a pro photographer. He hovered on the edges of the events, and used a fill in flash in the dark under coloured lights. I mingled, drank alcohol, chatted, and did not once fire even the on-board flash. I used digital and film. And people actively encouraged me to photograph them close up dancing, drinking, horsing around. The owner of the mobile bar used a couple of my digital shots to promote his business.

SO yes, people can be welcoming and nice. Increasingly I am finding that having a film camera generates curiosity and that people want to be photographed on film. THat's a b

pentaxuser · Sep 20, 2024

Andrew O'Neill said:
Once, while photographing in the mountains in Japan, a monkey up in a tree, cursed me for being there and threw bits of twigs down on me. Sorry. That's all I've got.

I believe he later attended an anger management course and now regrets his behaviour

pentaxuser

MattKing · Sep 20, 2024

We have noted and received some comments about moderation decisions in this thread.
If people wish to discuss the political and societal and historical factors that are involved in the balancing of:
1) legal rights to photograph something;
2) legal rights to privacy and ownership of one's own image; and
3) the legal rights involved when commercializing an image,
particularly in reference to realities that were in place a quarter of a millennium ago,
Photrio isn't the the best place to do so.
And certainly not if that discussion is to be imbued with different political outlooks.
Some of those related issues probably belong on Photrio - for example information about what to watch out for respecting the local legal issues if people travel and wish to photograph things and people on the way. Mainly though, those limited discussions belong outside this thread.

jeffreyg · Sep 20, 2024

cliveh said:
That is also horrendous, but why did you give the guy money? I can't imagine someone from the UK doing that.

His son was hanging on to the rear view mirror and he was on the hood of the car. I showed him some bills but actually threw some coins. I had tried to creep forward but that didn’t work. When they got off to gather the coins I took off.

Sworn at while taking photographs

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