Superia 1600 and X Rays

RattyMouse · Feb 17, 2018

I really really really hate to ask this question because I know that for every other film I shoot, X Rays are not a problem. That said, I've never traveled with Superia 1600 and don't know how well it can handle being scanned by airport carry on X Ray scanners. I expect all my film to be scanned 3-5 times during my upcoming trip and want to know, can Superia 1600 take that many scans and still remain unaffected?

My free time is mostly at night on this trip so I expect to need a lot of high ISO film.

Thanks!

Ces1um · Feb 17, 2018

General rule of thumb is 800 iso and up should not be scanned. Ask for a hand inspection instead. In Canada and the US I know it's a non-issue and they will hand inspect. I leave them in the boxes but they will likely open every box (I had 20 rolls unboxed the last time I flew down to Florida). Likely other countries will do the same but I've read threads where some countries will not do this for you.

skysh4rk · Feb 17, 2018

RattyMouse said:
I really really really hate to ask this question because I know that for every other film I shoot, X Rays are not a problem. That said, I've never traveled with Superia 1600 and don't know how well it can handle being scanned by airport carry on X Ray scanners. I expect all my film to be scanned 3-5 times during my upcoming trip and want to know, can Superia 1600 take that many scans and still remain unaffected?

My free time is mostly at night on this trip so I expect to need a lot of high ISO film.

Thanks!

Have you already bought the Superia 1600?

I find Cinestill 800T to be better suited to night photography as it's tungsten balanced (thus will actually be faster for nighttime shooting, as daylight balanced films require a filter and additional exposure under artificial lighting), while Cinestill's lower ISO is also better for travelling through x-ray scanners.

I've travelled from the UK to southeast Asia and back a few times carrying numerous rolls of Cinestill 800T without any issues.

RattyMouse · Feb 17, 2018

Ces1um said:
General rule of thumb is 800 iso and up should not be scanned. Ask for a hand inspection instead. In Canada and the US I know it's a non-issue and they will hand inspect. I leave them in the boxes but they will likely open every box (I had 20 rolls unboxed the last time I flew down to Florida). Likely other countries will do the same but I've read threads where some countries will not do this for you.

I dont ask for hand inspection. It's way too much hassle. I've had US custom agents dress me down big time for asking that. I'm traveling to places where English isnt spoken.

I've had Ilford Delta 3200 scanned many times without issue and that's an ISO1000 film. I dont know what the real value of Superia 1600 is so I don't know if it's an issue or not.

RattyMouse · Feb 17, 2018

skysh4rk said:
Have you already bought the Superia 1600?

I find Cinestill 800T to be better suited to night photography as it's tungsten balanced (thus will actually be faster for nighttime shooting, as daylight balanced films require a filter and additional exposure under artificial lighting), while Cinestill's lower ISO is also better for travelling through x-ray scanners.

I've travelled from the UK to southeast Asia and back a few times carrying numerous rolls of Cinestill 800T without any issues.

I've got plenty of Superia 1600, but can still buy some of this Cinestill film too. Thanks for the suggestion. How well does it do for long exposures (30 seconds)?

Ces1um · Feb 17, 2018

RattyMouse said:
I dont ask for hand inspection. It's way too much hassle. I've had US custom agents dress me down big time for asking that. I'm traveling to places where English isnt spoken.

I've had Ilford Delta 3200 scanned many times without issue and that's an ISO1000 film. I dont know what the real value of Superia 1600 is so I don't know if it's an issue or not.

Well, the customs agents aren't supposed to do that as it's their own suggested guideline. You can go on twitter to @asktsa and they'll tell you to ask for a hand inspection. That being said, I hate flying to the US because TSA makes travelling unenjoyable. I understand the importance of their job and why it's necessary, but it's not a pleasant experience ever.

Travelling to places where English isn't spoke- yeah, your superia is going to be scanned. Not sure how it will react but again accepted practice is to not have it scanned as it is supposed to damage it. Hopefully it doesn't do anything to it. Maybe it slightly fogs it and you can't notice it too much. It any event it's not ideal. Maybe the cinestill is your better option, or use a 400 speed film with a tripod and get info on their reciprocity data. Or get one heck of a powerful flash?

Whatever you choose to do, good luck! Where is the trip taking you? Any place exotic?

skysh4rk · Feb 17, 2018

RattyMouse said:
I've got plenty of Superia 1600, but can still buy some of this Cinestill film too. Thanks for the suggestion. How well does it do for long exposures (30 seconds)?

The reciprocity characteristics appear to be really good, so be careful not to overexpose it (there's a lot of latitude with this film, so I'm talking serious overexposure). Unlike daylight films, which I find are effectively two stops slower in artificial lighting (on top of reciprocity concerns), Cinestill maintains its speed at night because of its tungsten balance, so it doesn't need anywhere near the long exposure times I often use for Fuji 160NS.

The film's biggest drawback is the halos around reddish colours due to the lack of the anti-halation layer, although this effect can occasionally benefit the image.

A few samples with progressively longer exposure times. The first one is handheld, then the next two are steadied on ledges, while the rest are gorillapod-based photos.

If you grossly overexpose, as I did in the photo below, the highlights start to go yellowy, which I don't like:

RattyMouse · Feb 17, 2018

Ces1um said:
Whatever you choose to do, good luck! Where is the trip taking you? Any place exotic?

Shanghai and either Hong Kong or Kyoto...have not figured out which one to go to yet for the second leg of my trip.

kruiwagen · Feb 19, 2018

Is it a possibility for you to buy the film on location? If you're staying there longer you even might have it developed before going back. Either way, it can at least save you a few X-ray scans.

lantau · Feb 19, 2018

RattyMouse said:
Shanghai and either Hong Kong or Kyoto...have not figured out which one to go to yet for the second leg of my trip.

Last time I left HK in November they did a hand inspection of my film without me actually asking for it. It had all my film in clear ZIP bags, took them out to put them into a separate tray and the women handling the lane immediately suggested it. Without really awaiting my answer the films bypassed the machine and her colleague waited for me at the other end for the inspection... So if you ask them for hand inspection I'm sure they will be very graceful about it.

I posted pictures I took in HK with that film in the last Superia 1600 thread. I like the results very much. You can buy it in HK. The last time I used a shop called Showa. They have two branches, in Mong Kok and Causway Bay, and do really fast C41 development. Quite cheap and they do good scans. You'll get a link (Google Drive) to the scans the same day. Usually within a few hours. Pick up the negatives anytime you want.

The other shops like Dotwell, HKcamera, etc. should have it as well, btw. HK is film paradise. Fuji Chromes, Acros and the high ISO Superias are cheaper than in the competitive German market, everything else a bit more expensive. But not badly so.

removed account4 · Feb 19, 2018

sometimes it is a crap shoot with luggage scanners
whether it is in the belly of hte plane or carry on
some folks claim both ends no problems and hella-trouble
good luck and safe travels!

RattyMouse · Feb 19, 2018

skysh4rk said:
The reciprocity characteristics appear to be really good, so be careful not to overexpose it (there's a lot of latitude with this film, so I'm talking serious overexposure). Unlike daylight films, which I find are effectively two stops slower in artificial lighting (on top of reciprocity concerns), Cinestill maintains its speed at night because of its tungsten balance, so it doesn't need anywhere near the long exposure times I often use for Fuji 160NS.

The film's biggest drawback is the halos around reddish colours due to the lack of the anti-halation layer, although this effect can occasionally benefit the image.

A few samples with progressively longer exposure times. The first one is handheld, then the next two are steadied on ledges, while the rest are gorillapod-based photos.

If you grossly overexpose, as I did in the photo below, the highlights start to go yellowy, which I don't like:

Those are gorgeous shots! I'd be very happy with them.

RattyMouse · Feb 19, 2018

kruiwagen said:
Is it a possibility for you to buy the film on location? If you're staying there longer you even might have it developed before going back. Either way, it can at least save you a few X-ray scans.

That's risky. Even in a place like Japan I could not get film on location as expected. Nowhere could I find 400H one time while in Kyoto. Yodobash, Bic, you name the place, they were all out of that film.

Sadly, each time I go to Japan the film stores get smaller and smaller.

sepiareverb · Feb 19, 2018

Call your hotel and get the name of a manager who will be there when you arrive and Fed Ex the film to them. It will not be x-rayed by Fed Ex if you tell them it is photosensitive material. Fed -Ex it back to yourself or someone here in the US using the labels Fed-Ex will provide.

Or, let the TSA ignore your perfectly legal request and likely have damage.

skysh4rk · Feb 19, 2018

RattyMouse said:
Those are gorgeous shots! I'd be very happy with them.

Thanks.

RattyMouse said:
That's risky. Even in a place like Japan I could not get film on location as expected. Nowhere could I find 400H one time while in Kyoto. Yodobash, Bic, you name the place, they were all out of that film.

Sadly, each time I go to Japan the film stores get smaller and smaller.

Really? That is unfortunate. I bought quite a bit of 160NS and 400H in 120 format in Fukuoka, Kyoto, and Tokyo in two separate trips last year. I didn't try to buy any in Hokkaido though, as I didn't want to risk any availability issues and had stocked up ahead of time. The 160NS, in particular, is quite a bit cheaper in Japan than in the UK, even with the weak pound at present.

That said, I wouldn't risk travelling to Japan without a decent bit of film in tow, as I'm not sure the shops had that much stock beyond the 2–5 boxes I would buy on any one visit.

As for x-ray scanning, one other thing popped into my head. For the way back, I no longer carry my film. I contact my lab and they arrange for DHL to come to my hotel, pick up the film before I check out, and whisk it away to the lab. This has worked great in Japan, as I just leave the film at reception, I go out and sightsee on the penultimate day or last day, and DHL come to do their thing. I usually have my envelopes, labels, etc. ready to go before I even leave for the trip. I also did it in South Korea in December.

This means that the concerns about x-rays are minimised and my carry on is free to hold any new cameras I've purchased...

RattyMouse · Feb 19, 2018

skysh4rk said:
Thanks.

Really? That is unfortunate. I bought quite a bit of 160NS and 400H in 120 format in Fukuoka, Kyoto, and Tokyo in two separate trips last year. I didn't try to buy any in Hokkaido though, as I didn't want to risk any availability issues and had stocked up ahead of time. The 160NS, in particular, is quite a bit cheaper in Japan than in the UK, even with the weak pound at present.

That said, I wouldn't risk travelling to Japan without a decent bit of film in tow, as I'm not sure the shops had that much stock beyond the 2–5 boxes I would buy on any one visit.

As for x-ray scanning, one other thing popped into my head. For the way back, I no longer carry my film. I contact my lab and they arrange for DHL to come to my hotel, pick up the film before I check out, and whisk it away to the lab. This has worked great in Japan, as I just leave the film at reception, I go out and sightsee on the penultimate day or last day, and DHL come to do their thing. I usually have my envelopes, labels, etc. ready to go before I even leave for the trip. I also did it in South Korea in December.

This means that the concerns about x-rays are minimised and my carry on is free to hold any new cameras I've purchased...

I PROMISED my wife no new cameras this trip. I have to keep this promise or else.

I dont worry about film being scanned, except for an ISO1600 film. I've had all kinds of films scanned a dozen times without issue. It just does not affect film at all, even after 12 scans. I've never traveled with Superia 1600 before so I am not sure.

skysh4rk · Feb 19, 2018

RattyMouse said:
I PROMISED my wife no new cameras this trip. I have to keep this promise or else.

I dont worry about film being scanned, except for an ISO1600 film. I've had all kinds of films scanned a dozen times without issue. It just does not affect film at all, even after 12 scans. I've never traveled with Superia 1600 before so I am not sure.

Oh, but what's a trip to Japan without a new camera?

日本にはいいカメラがとてもたくさんありますから、新しいカメラを買わないのは私に難しいです。

RattyMouse · Feb 19, 2018

skysh4rk said:
Oh, but what's a trip to Japan without a new camera?

日本にはいいカメラがとてもたくさんありますから、新しいカメラを買わないのは私に難しいです。

Back when I lived in Asia I had tons of stuff to shoot. Now that I'm in the US, I hardly shoot at all anymore. You can imagine how well that does to control the urge to buy new cameras.

I'm pretty excited to be heading back to Asia for a 3 week trip. I need to get my shutter finger in shape.

mooseontheloose · Feb 19, 2018

I find in Japan they will always hand inspect film with no hassles, if you decide to come back here on your trip.

RattyMouse · Feb 20, 2018

mooseontheloose said:
I find in Japan they will always hand inspect film with no hassles, if you decide to come back here on your trip.

My experience too. The Osaka airport is quite nice. I need the Superia 1600 for my time in China, since I'll be working days there. At night is when I have my free time. My trip to Japan is all vacation!!

jim10219 · Feb 20, 2018

If you need to, I might consider mailing the film to you ahead of time, and then after you shoot it, mailing it back. That would avoid the whole airport. That's what a lot of people do with golf clubs or anything else that is too big to fit on the plane. It's quite common. Just get your hotel arrangements set up ahead of time, and double check with the hotel that they will allow such service (as they may have to hold onto it for a day or so waiting for you to arrive.

sepiareverb · Feb 20, 2018

jim10219 said:
If you need to, I might consider mailing the film to you ahead of time, and then after you shoot it, mailing it back. That would avoid the whole airport. That's what a lot of people do with golf clubs or anything else that is too big to fit on the plane. It's quite common. Just get your hotel arrangements set up ahead of time, and double check with the hotel that they will allow such service (as they may have to hold onto it for a day or so waiting for you to arrive.

Yep. Common sense approach.

mooseontheloose · Feb 22, 2018

jim10219 said:
If you need to, I might consider mailing the film to you ahead of time, and then after you shoot it, mailing it back. That would avoid the whole airport. That's what a lot of people do with golf clubs or anything else that is too big to fit on the plane. It's quite common. Just get your hotel arrangements set up ahead of time, and double check with the hotel that they will allow such service (as they may have to hold onto it for a day or so waiting for you to arrive.

Those packages get scanned too. In the past ten years I've moved countries three times (3 different continents), plus travelled to countless others, and every time I've sent something through cargo or in the mail (or UPS/FedEx) I've been informed that the films would be scanned, nothing goes through without being scanned. I'm assuming the scanners are no worse than carry-on baggage scanners since I've never had any damage done to any of my film. So either way it's not something you can avoid unless you buy (and process) in country. I haven't heard of any issues with this film, so personally I would go the regular route and bring my films with me and get hand checks when I can. But that's just me, everyone's comfort level with this is different.

Agulliver · Jun 8, 2018

Coming to this late but I've travelled several times with Superia 1600 (and Delta 3200) and never had any issues.I know for sure one roll of Delta 3200 went through no fewer than 7 x-ray inspections and was fine when exposed and pushed to 6400. Multiple rolls of Superia 1600 have gone through two inspections.

Officially they will tell you that the hand baggage x-ray machines are safe for films 800ISO and slower. Practical experience is that faster film is also safe, though you'd have no legal right to recompense if the x-rays did cause some fogging.

The USA is probably the only country where you have the right to request a hand inspection of film, but you can try elsewhere. Just be aware that other countries don't afford you any rights with regard to hand inspections.

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 8, 2018

I used to ask for film to be hand inspected. They would wipe it with some stuff. Pretty quick. It's less hassle these days to just run them through the carry-on scanner. I've run HIE, 3200 Delta, Rollei IR several times with no issues.

Superia 1600 and X Rays

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