Stealing

Vonder · Sep 18, 2009

Most of the time, cameras and lenses that you find online are priced around what they are worth - or absurdly high. Obviously, nobody pays $1200 for a *mint condition* Nikon EM these days.

But what if you had the opportunity to make a steal? Say a garage sale, with a lens sitting there for $20 that you know goes for $350 on eBay.

Do you tell them? Do you take advantage?

Lightproof · Sep 18, 2009

If people want to get rid of old stuff and are too lazy for checking the value first, why should I bother?

Sirius Glass · Sep 18, 2009

It is not stealing.

There are some times when one should consider telling the seller that the price is too low. This is situational and everyone must decide on a case by case basis. There are no rules that work for everyone.

Steve

Dave in Kansas · Sep 18, 2009

This seems like a good example of an "analog" decision. It's not always a simple yes/no "digital" answer. Some people just want to get rid of things and maybe they don't want to spend the effort to sell it for the maximum price it is worth.

There are times when I'd probably tell someone the item was worth more than their selling price. I also need to admit that more than once in my life I came across something that I thought was such a great deal and bought it, only to learn later that it wasn't a good deal after all. That's always a real let down.

Dave

Aurum · Sep 18, 2009

I've seen camera set ups in charity shops (Thrift stores) that are either way overpriced or way underpriced.

I've been in one where a pro collector / seller who to be fair struck me as an upright sort of chap was sorting through kit and saying that he would pay double sticker price, because that was proper value for what he was looking at. Win-Win all round, and Karma kept sweet

brian steinberger · Sep 18, 2009

My good friend a few months back picked up a Hasselblad SWC at a yard sale for $500. I couldn't believe that the individual didn't know what he had, I mean who owns a Hasselblad that isn't into photography. Turns out he used it in his work years ago and he just kept it, but didn't know the value apparently.

I don't believe its "stealing." You give them what they ask. I think that if they wanted to get full value for items they could do more research.

PhotoJim · Sep 18, 2009

Stealing is the wrong word for this, but it is certainly an interesting ethical question. Stealing implies physically taking something from somebody without consent. This is a situation where the person voluntarily agrees to sell at a certain price, but the price is below market value.

Since market value is pretty subjective, I think the cases where it is truly unethical are pretty uncommon. Sale price is partially dependent on seller motivation and need for capital, and willingness to do research. Also, at a garage sale no one can honestly expect to be making "fair market value" since garage sales are designed to be expedient means of selling surplus belongings. One sells things such a way to send them to a new home and get a few bucks for the trouble. If a person really expected to get fair market price for something, they would use eBay or some other method instead of a garage sale... but it's a lot more bother, of course, which eats up some of the marginal return one gets from the better selling method.

If I saw something grossly mispriced, e.g. a pretty, clean 105/1.8 AI-S Nikkor for $10, yes, I probably would say something to the seller. However, if I saw such a lens for $200 I would think that price to be fair enough for the seller. Besides, used goods are always a risk. We've all made poor purchases of used goods.

dpurdy · Sep 18, 2009

I think of this question a lot. You go to a garage sale and a little old lady has a pristine Rollei wide for 50 dollars. Or it is unmarked and you ask how much and she says she is not sure. Do you say well it is probably worth at least 25 dollars. Or do you say well you could probably get 4000 for it on ebay. I think I give her a price that is as much as I could pay... like 200 dollars. woooooo hooooo. Nah I would tell her the truth.
Dennis

sun of sand · Sep 18, 2009

this is what I do
it makes me feel better like i gave em a second chance at least

Just $X for this?
Yep!
Ok

Just $X for this?
Hmmmm ..how much is it worth?
I might tell them or I might only give them a better offer

I found a Diana camera MIB $5
Seller caught on and asked how much it was worth
On ebay? Ebay its worth more. It was a prize toy originally and not worth anything but now a bit of a camera collectors item
I'll give you $20 for it
Give me $15

I felt fine. Wasn't going on ebay and her door wasn't an artists/collectors hot spot
fair price

Recently told a guy the value of a camera worth at least 150 was selling for $15
he sent me a small finders fee for helping him out
yeah, I accepted it. It was great.

Bought my -described as older- 4x5 Tachihara, 90mm 4.5, 150mm, type 55, 545I, case, 13 holders = $500
Didn't even know the value of the stuff when I bought it but knew $500 was more than fair and my one chance to buy into LF given my cheapness
I did say
just $500? ..I don't even want to know how much it was new. Probably could have got another 1-2 hundred out of me if took that opportunity.
He said he had other things going/needed the money something or other and I just paid and was very grateful
They were nice people and seemed pleased it was going to someone who'd use it/a newbie rookie

Turned out the Tachihara in quite excellent shape was worth that price alone on ebay.

I'll pay Fair price NOT Market price and maybe only what they ask.

That $20 for $350 lens
I'd give em $50 probably. I don't buy things to sell on ebay so
probably a bit low. If I KNEW it was 350 and not just worth quite a bit more/subject to..
maybe $100

Auctions/dedicated meet types "fleas" "fair" are another matter.

Mike1234 · Sep 18, 2009

I always tell the truth and never take advantage. But I'm an idiot... and broke.

Ektagraphic · Sep 18, 2009

I don't think it is stealing. If a guy wants $2 for a $200 camera at a yardsale it was his choice to sell it for that. I don't want to come off rude but I don't know. I guess it would depend on the kind of person that he/she is.

nyoung · Sep 18, 2009

Its not stealing, just business most of the time. Personally, I make decisions on a case by case basis. I once ran into a rare 500mm F5 nikkor mirror lens at a yead sale asking $200 - KEH asks $1,000 for them if they have them. Talking to the seller, I found out he was a retired pro wildlife shooter so I figured he knew what he was doing and paid him the $200. In another case, a student brought me her grandmother's minty Leica III kit with 50, 90, and 135 mm lenses to see if it was good enough for her to use in the class. I was tempted to make her an offer but I sent the camera home with a note to grandma about what it should be worth and where she could likely get the best price for it if she wanted to sell it.

fschifano · Sep 18, 2009

Wolfeye said:
Do you tell them? Do you take advantage?

No, I don't tell them. Yes, I will grab it and not regret it for a second. There's a saying, "Let the buyer beware." Well, the same is true for the seller, let the seller beware. That's capitalism, and we're in it. Once in a while, you get a break.

removed account4 · Sep 18, 2009

i have been in that situation before
at a store, ebay and at a yardsale.
i usually ask if it is priced correctly and
if they say YES, i buy it.

resummerfield · Sep 18, 2009

fschifano said:
.......Once in a while, you get a break.

In this land of over-priced items, we need all the breaks we can get!

PeteZ8 · Sep 18, 2009

Lightproof said:
If people want to get rid of old stuff and are too lazy for checking the value first, why should I bother?

+1. If they can figure out how to list an item on Ebay/Craigslist, they already have both the tools and skills needed to price an item. If they are too lazy to do so, not my problem.

PeteZ8 · Sep 18, 2009

Sirius Glass said:
It is not stealing.

There are some times when one should consider telling the seller that the price is too low. This is situational and everyone must decide on a case by case basis. There are no rules that work for everyone.

Steve

This may be the only time I ever agree with you, write this down on your calander.

I know in my post above I said "no regrets" but there are, obviously, times when judgement comes into play. The widow who recently lost his/her SO and needs to offload their things to pay bills, etc.

JBrunner · Sep 18, 2009

You have the knowledge of something and they don't. That is the way the world works. If they asked you to value it, and you lied, that would be different. Commerce is predicated on the concept that something is more valuable to one person than another. Every time you get a great deal like this and stutter, remember that you are screwed to the wall everyday by folks who make a career out of it, and would like to do it harder and longer to you if they could, and all you are doing is getting a great deal on something from somebody that doesn't value what you do.

A widow selling of a husbands gear, well she will get my honest help and advice. A guy in a McMansion with a bunch of toys, not so much.

AutumnJazz · Sep 18, 2009

For me, it depends. Is it a charity shop or someone who looks like they need the money, or someone too lazy to spend 10 minutes on google?

MattKing · Sep 18, 2009

If you are in a store, and see something that clearly has the wrong price tag on it, what would you do?

If you know that the price tag is in error, you might get yourself in trouble if you try to get the cashier to charge you that price.

Matt

Perry Way · Sep 18, 2009

Mike1234 said:
I always tell the truth and never take advantage. But I'm an idiot... and broke.

Nice guys finish last

Perry Way · Sep 18, 2009

MattKing said:
If you are in a store, and see something that clearly has the wrong price tag on it, what would you do?

If you know that the price tag is in error, you might get yourself in trouble if you try to get the cashier to charge you that price.

Matt

Really? How so? I don't understand how transference of guilt is logical.

MattKing · Sep 18, 2009

1SharpMonkey said:
Really? How so? I don't understand how transference of guilt is logical.

Because it is essentially the same as changing the tag yourself, and then trying to rely on it.

If you knowingly present an item with an incorrect price tag to a cashier, it is probably criminal fraud.

You have to know that the tag is incorrect. That is fundamentally different then believing that the store isn't charging as much as they should for the item.

Matt

2F/2F · Sep 19, 2009

If they actually ask me what it is worth, and they seem like a decent person who may just be clueless, I say something at least resembling the truth. I might downplay it by saying it will likely need service (which is almost always true), or by saying that film equipment sells for just a fraction of what it used to. Otherwise, I accept it as good fortune and scoop it up. I did not feel bad about paying $750 for my Rolleiwide. A relative steal, for sure, considering that it is like mint.

People do not often ask me what something is worth, unless I seem to give off the message that it is overpriced.

Roger Thoms · Sep 19, 2009

I don't like many of the changes that are happen to analog photography since the introduction of digital. The one thing that I am really enjoying it some of the fantastic deals there are right now on analog equipment. Yes there are certainly over priced item, but there are absolutely killer deals out there too.

I bought a Toyo 45C with a Nikkor 210mm lens for $200, it included the Toyo case, dark cloth, two lens boards, owners manual, a couple of film holders, and a Linhof cable release. Everything was in mint condition. The seller had checked prices online and knew she had priced the camera very low. She appreciated that I acknowledged that the price was very good and that I paid the asking price to the set up. She also mentioned that she had received several low ball offers including one for $50 which made her angry. End result we were both happy.

So if you come across a killer deal I'd be grateful and thank the seller.

Roger

Stealing

Vonder

Lightproof

Sirius Glass

Dave in Kansas

Aurum

brian steinberger

PhotoJim

dpurdy

sun of sand

Mike1234

Ektagraphic

nyoung

fschifano

removed account4

resummerfield

PeteZ8

PeteZ8

JBrunner

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AutumnJazz

MattKing

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Perry Way

Perry Way

MattKing

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2F/2F

Roger Thoms

Stealing

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