Staining...Cause?

ToddB · Aug 17, 2014

Hey guys,

I'm having a little issue with staining on my Black and white prints. I'm using MGIV Ilford Glossy. With Dektol and standard two spot baths for archival. The Fix is freshly mixed. Any guesses why i'm having slight staining?

Todd

darkosaric · Aug 18, 2014

Hi,

how do you wash your prints?

Regards,

Xmas · Aug 18, 2014

acid stop, HCA, and wash all critical to life/stains...

ToddB · Aug 18, 2014

Washing print at 14 min. Then another 15 after Sel toning.

Rudeofus · Aug 18, 2014

Is there any chance you can find out at which stage in the process this stain appears. You can inspect test clips in broad daylight shortly after it hit the stop bath and all the time during the following process steps. Also, what kind of fixer do you use, and for how long?

ToddB · Aug 18, 2014

I use standard Kodak Fix. With two seperate fix baths at 3:00 min per bath, total 0f 6:00 min. I looked at test strips, Nothing. So I'm baffled on what going on. I agitate print as well, with turn over too.

Todd

Rudeofus · Aug 18, 2014

So you say that the stain appeared during or after drying of the paper and was invisible during processing?

pentaxuser · Aug 18, 2014

Is this FB paper and when do the stains appear?(minutes, days, weeks later?). If it is RC paper then fix will not penetrate the surface but if FB then the best way to fix is in 1:3 and for no longer than 60 secs.Two 30 sec baths are ideal. 7 mins will allow a lot of fix to penetrate the fibre and take a lot of washing.

RC needs only a minute max of fix as well.

pentaxuser

Jim Noel · Aug 18, 2014

I believe your wash prior to toning is insufficient. If the prints are not clean spots will appear upon drying , caused by the toner.

Xmas · Aug 18, 2014

What colour is the stain?

You are leaving us a guessing game like only telling that you were toning in post #4...

ToddB · Aug 18, 2014

So you say that the stain appeared during or after drying of the paper and was invisible during processing?

Appears after first fix bath. The color of the stain is kind of a megenta purple/brown. Ilford FB MutlugradeIV

Xmas · Aug 18, 2014

ToddB said:
So you say that the stain appeared during or after drying of the paper and was invisible during processing?
Appears after first fix bath. The color of the stain is kind of a megenta purple/brown. Ilford FB MutlugradeIV

Sorry for cavil comments earlier.
You may have active developer after stop I used to use a water tray then a stop tray after development with two sets of tongs. Leaving it in the water for a while.

Partly to allow putting it back in developer.

Try longer in stop first...

The other option is a PQ developer like Ilfords.

Rudeofus · Aug 18, 2014

ToddB said:
Appears after first fix bath. The color of the stain is kind of a megenta purple/brown. Ilford FB MutlugradeIV

Is this stain present in regions that should be white, or mostly in regions which should be light gray? I'm trying to find out whether you stained the paper or the Silver.

ToddB · Aug 18, 2014

It mainly stains the part of the paper that isn't exposed. I print 10x10 on 11x14 paper leaving slop on the top and bottom. That where it shows up. Not in the image.

Todd

JW PHOTO · Aug 18, 2014

Jim Noel said:
I believe your wash prior to toning is insufficient. If the prints are not clean spots will appear upon drying , caused by the toner.

There was a staining discussion on one of the forums somewhere, but I can't remember where now, that was talking about the stain coming in the toning cycle. Some folks were having good result going directly from the fix into the selenium toner with no wash in between. There was something said about the dilution of the toner, but I can't remember all the details of that either. I do know there was a long wash cycle after going straight from the fix to the toner. Just thought it might be a place to look at for your source of stain and I'll try to find the discussion and report back. JW

jeffreyg · Aug 18, 2014

How are you handling the prints? With your fingers or separate tongs for each chemical? If with fingers you might be contaminating them.

http://www.jeffreyglasser.com/
http://www.sculptureandphotography.com/

MattKing · Aug 18, 2014

Are you using a stop bath, or is it just a water rinse?

If a stop bath, which one?

If a water rinse, is it a running water rinse?

If you are going straight into fixer from the developer, or you just have a tray of water in between, I am not surprised you are having problems.

Rudeofus · Aug 19, 2014

ToddB said:
It mainly stains the part of the paper that isn't exposed. I print 10x10 on 11x14 paper leaving slop on the top and bottom. That where it shows up. Not in the image.

Reading through your postings again, you don't seem to use a stop bath. The white parts of your paper are soaked with fresh developer, and Dektol is loaded with Carbonate. If the paper enters the fixer, the pH of the developer carried over will overwhelm the acidity of the fixer, resulting in an alkaline mix of strong fixer and carried over developer. As a result, you may get weak development of unexposed sections, and this may well be the stain you see.

Please confirm that you use a stop bath, or at least a water rinse with running water between developer and fixer, and if you don't, start using one.

Simon R Galley · Aug 19, 2014

Dear ToddB,

Firstly, sorry to be a bit late in, and sorry you have had a problem.

Our tech service have confirmed that 14mins is less than 25% of the recommended washing for MGFB, unless you are using the ILFORD wash method you should wash for one hour, minimum, secondly, and a few people have waded in on this, we recommend the use a stop bath.

And finally, when you progress to use the new ILFORD FB CLASSIC ( the replacement for MGFB ) the wash times are reduced, 30 minutes is fine, 40 minutes ultra, ultra safe.

Simon ILFORD Photo / HARMAN technology Limited :

Mainecoonmaniac · Aug 19, 2014

Being more of the artist type, when I work in the darkroom, I tend to be sloppy. I tended to use my fingers to transfer prints from one tray to another. I found stains on my FB prints. I quit that and started to be very methodical and started using tongs and try not to cross contaminate the trays and I get less staining.

ToddB · Aug 19, 2014

Thanks guys.. I'll stop by my local camera joint and get some stop bath. How many minutes in it? I should mention that this is my first buy for this paper. So I treated like I did with Arista EDU paper. But I can certainly make an adjustment to my process. Oh.. BTW.. I use tongs for each bath. I'm very careful about cross contamination. So, Should continue doing the two seprate fix baths @ 3:00 min in each if I'm going to add in Stop station? Hi Simon, Thanks for chiming in. I absolutly love this paper.

Mainecoonmaniac · Aug 19, 2014

ToddB said:
Should continue doing the two seprate fix baths @ 3:00 min in each if I'm going to add in Stop station? Hi Simon, Thanks for chiming in. I absolutly love this paper.

I use Arista EDU also and two fixing baths. I do a short 1 minute fix the first time, put the print in a holding bath and at the end of the print session, I use the second fresher fix. I then wash in my prints in a tray siphon for about 5-10 minutes then soak in a working solution of hypo clear for about 10 minutes. Then I wash for about 1/2 hour. This is for Arista VC FB paper. Since I live in California in a midst of a drought, I have to be careful about water usage. But I've been processing my FB prints this way for decades and it works well. You sound like a neater darkroom work than me

ToddB · Aug 19, 2014

Thanks Maine.. This Ilford reacts slightly different. But I love the Arista paper too. As I mentioned.. I have no problem making an adjustment to my process between papers. Just want a near perfect print.

Todd

Mainecoonmaniac · Aug 19, 2014

Hi Todd,

This is my processed that works for me. Let's see if other more experienced APUGers do the same or something improved.

Best,
Don

Dali · Aug 19, 2014

ToddB said:
Thanks guys.. I'll stop by my local camera joint and get some stop bath. How many minutes in it? I should mention that this is my first buy for this paper. So I treated like I did with Arista EDU paper. But I can certainly make an adjustment to my process. Oh.. BTW.. I use tongs for each bath. I'm very careful about cross contamination. So, Should continue doing the two seprate fix baths @ 3:00 min in each if I'm going to add in Stop station? Hi Simon, Thanks for chiming in. I absolutly love this paper.

I use diluted white vinegar as stop bath. 30 seconds are more than enough.

Staining...Cause?

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