Speed Graphic bellows extension enough to support a portrait lens?

hsandler · Jun 7, 2016

I have a Pacemaker 45 speed graphic. The bellows is described as "double extension" (double of what?). It can focus very close with the 135mm Optar I have, but for a head and shoulders portrait, the camera will be too close to the face for a pleasing perspective. For close head and shoulders portrait, I think I would need something like a 300mm lens. In this case, will I have enough bellows extension with this camera to focus at about 6 feet away?

Alan Gales · Jun 7, 2016

If your Speed Graphic has 12" of extension like my Crown Graphic did then the answer is no.

At full bellows extension of 13" on my Tachihara I could focus a 250mm lens down to about 6 feet but it was really stretching the bellows completely all the way out. Not good.

I'd recommend purchasing a dirt cheap monorail to mount the 300mm lens on if you want to do head or head and shoulder shots. A monorail and a Speed or Crown Graphic make a real nice pairing!

Jim Noel · Jun 7, 2016

You need a telephoto lens for this type of image using a Graphic.

gone · Jun 7, 2016

I would just crop to what I wanted. Plenty of real estate on 4x5 film for that.

This is why I always preferred smaller formats for head shots. 120 was OK, but 35mm was perfect. Put a fast 85-135mm lens on and blur the background beautifully.

Doc W · Jun 7, 2016

You could also get a roll film back and turn your Speed Graphic into a 6x7 which will make that 135 a bit more like a portrait lens.

removed account4 · Jun 7, 2016

300mm for head/shoulders on a 4x5 ?
the "rule of thumb" i always heard was the next format's
"normal" lens, so 10" for 4x5, 14" for 5x7, about a 20" for 8x10 ... &c...

if you like that FL ( 300mm ) you might look for a tele optar ( tele raptar )
sometimes they can be found factory mounted in an alphax shutter.

good luck !
john

shutterfinger · Jun 7, 2016

hsandler said:
The bellows is described as "double extension" (double of what?).

Double the bed length.
Your 4x5 Pacemaker Speed Graphic has a 12 3/4 inch bellows extension. http://www.graflex.org/speed-graphic/pacemaker-speed-graphic.html
At 12 3/4 the bellows will be stretched to their limit and a 12 inch (305mm) focal length lens will be focused at 20 to 25 feet. To focus to 10 feet you need approximately another inch of extension. An extension lens board may work without vignetting.
A Graphic Optar is a Wollensak Raptar with a different label. http://www.cameraeccentric.com/html/info/wollensak_5.html ,

hsandler · Jun 7, 2016

Thanks for the replies. So it seems like it could work out by using about a 250mm lens at close to full extension and maybe having to crop a bit. Someone mentioned using a telephoto lens. I take it this means a true telephoto where lens elements are used to put the optical centre out in front of the physical objective lens so that it should be able to focus close using my 12.75 inch bellows extension. What are the downsides to telephoto lenses for large format? Cost? rarity? Performance?

choiliefan · Jun 7, 2016

10" Graflex Optar lenses appear quite frequently on the bay. You should find a decent one for 100 or so.

EdSawyer · Jun 7, 2016

no real downsides to teles for portraits. They can be limiting as far as movements but other than that, nothing really negative. Tele-arton 270mm or 360mm comes to mind, those have the shortest flange-focal distance for their length, also the fastest. Tele-xenar 360 is nice, cheap, light, and relatively fast though it is a tessar design. The Nikkor-T 270 or 360 are the best optically, but a stop slower vs. the Artons. All have nice rendering, I've had them all but have standardized on and kept the Nikkor-Ts.

Alan Gales · Jun 7, 2016

EdSawyer said:
no real downsides to teles for portraits. They can be limiting as far as movements but other than that, nothing really negative. Tele-arton 270mm or 360mm comes to mind, those have the shortest flange-focal distance for their length, also the fastest. Tele-xenar 360 is nice, cheap, light, and relatively fast though it is a tessar design. The Nikkor-T 270 or 360 are the best optically, but a stop slower vs. the Artons. All have nice rendering, I've had them all but have standardized on and kept the Nikkor-Ts.

You are right, Ed. There is nothing wrong with tales for portraits. Like you say, some of them render rather nicely.

The advantage of having more bellows allows you to have more lens choices though. Some like having the choice of modern sharp and contrasty lenses, Ektars, Dagors, Heilars. Petzvals, etc. plus all the soft focus lenses. The problem for me is having the money for all the portrait lenses I would like to have!

BySumbergsStache · Jun 8, 2016

How do you calculate the focus distance of a lens based on focal length and bellow length? I have a 210mm lens and a Crown Graphic with 11.5" bellows.

Alan Gales · Jun 8, 2016

BySumbergsStache said:
How do you calculate the focus distance of a lens based on focal length and bellow length? I have a 210mm lens and a Crown Graphic with 11.5" bellows.

http://www.kennethleegallery.com/html/tech/bellows.php

Be sure to check out the rest of Ken's site for more great tech info and some wonderful photography. Ken is a member and moderator on Large Format Photography Forum. He's also a great guy!

Sirius Glass · Jun 8, 2016

BySumbergsStache said:
How do you calculate the focus distance of a lens based on focal length and bellow length? I have a 210mm lens and a Crown Graphic with 11.5" bellows.

See the articles in www.graflex.org

Speed Graphic bellows extension enough to support a portrait lens?

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