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SP-445 Developing system Rev 4

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Deleted member 88956

Never actually looked for it until today coming across a poll for SP-645 potential demand.

Looking for feedback on use and "return on investment".

Due to limited space until my new large studio end of the house gets finished am not really able to process sheet film. This seems like a solution, perhaps for a long future ahead.

Also, have noticed they are now selling film holders in Rev.4 Any comparison experiences to Rev 3 holders would also be appreciated. Have a chance to buy Rev.3 ones, but perhaps not worth it?
 

Two23

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I've had mine for nearly two years. Very easy to use, doesn't damage negs, compact. I like mine a lot.


Kent in SD
 

Alan9940

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I've had mine since the Kickstarter fulfillment and have v1, v3, and v4 holders. Never had any of the issues that folks reported with the v1 holders, but I do like the latest version the best. I have had the occasional neg damage from the "clips" that hold the film, mine does leak a bit even after the "squeeze play", and I don't find the holders that easy to load properly in the dark (probably just me.) All in all, it's a workable solution; though IMO there are better products available that unfortunately require more chemistry (not something I've ever worried about.)
 
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Deleted member 88956

I've had mine since the Kickstarter fulfillment and have v1, v3, and v4 holders. Never had any of the issues that folks reported with the v1 holders, but I do like the latest version the best. I have had the occasional neg damage from the "clips" that hold the film, mine does leak a bit even after the "squeeze play", and I don't find the holders that easy to load properly in the dark (probably just me.) All in all, it's a workable solution; though IMO there are better products available that unfortunately require more chemistry (not something I've ever worried about.)
Which ones would you recommend over SP-445 for daylight processing? And what kind of issues are you having with film loading? Lining the sheet up at first or finishing off so it's in correct position before tank is closed?
 

wyofilm

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I can recommend the SP-445. I have used one for 18 mo/2years. I rely on a changing bag for all my film manipulations, including loading the SP-445 holders. In the bag it can be fiddly wilt bulkier items. No other 4x5 system is more convenient in a dark bag.

The tanks leak during inversion if you don't do one simple step. Once film is loaded, liquid is added, loosen the 'vent' cap and gently squeeze the tank until the fluid lever nears the top, then while keeping pressure tighten the vent cap. Otherwise, the unit is straight forward and is thrifty on developer.
 
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Deleted member 88956

I can recommend the SP-445. I have used one for 18 mo/2years. I rely on a changing bag for all my film manipulations, including loading the SP-445 holders. In the bag it can be fiddly wilt bulkier items. No other 4x5 system is more convenient in a dark bag.

The tanks leak during inversion if you don't do one simple step. Once film is loaded, liquid is added, loosen the 'vent' cap and gently squeeze the tank until the fluid lever nears the top, then while keeping pressure tighten the vent cap. Otherwise, the unit is straight forward and is thrifty on developer.
Sounds good I have a changing tent so I suppose that should work out fine. Have seen the squeeze play on YT already, so that part is no problem.
 

BrianShaw

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Ditto what wyofilm says, except I can rarely get mine to not leak a bit. Since I can relate to that, I just accept it.
 

Donald Qualls

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Which ones would you recommend over SP-445 for daylight processing? And what kind of issues are you having with film loading? Lining the sheet up at first or finishing off so it's in correct position before tank is closed?

If you want ease of loading, can accept that inversion isn't the only way to agitate, and don't mind needing a LOT of solution to cover your film (but you can process up to a dozen sheets in the same volume -- ideal for replenishment) the Yankee Agitank is still available new, and it's cheap. They're about $35 new, but you can usually find them on eBay for under $20 (make sure the film loading gate piece is present, it's a big help in getting the film in the same position on both edges), sold by folks who didn't like them. It adjusts for (once-)common film sizes from 2x3 up to 4x5 (doesn't need an additional film holder set for 9x12, for instance), fills about as fast as the SP-445 (even with almost 4x the solution), drains just a little slower than it fills (and can splash a bit when draining). Agitation is by sliding sharply, end to end, or by rocking in the same direction (the feet are designed to allow about 15 degrees of tilt either way, which produces nice, even negatives in my experience); I prefer rocking, but Kodak has recommended sliding for similar tanks in the past. The inside parts are so smooth, I think you'd have to work to scratch a negative in this thing.

Downsides: it's made of bakelite (yes, even in 2020) so it's a little brittle; drop a piece from the counter to a hard floor, it may break (but it's so cheap, you can just buy another one -- whole set costs less than a film holder for SP-445), it's easy to misload the film, with edges in different slots (i.e. top edge in slot 3, bottom in slot 2 or 4), easily worked around by leaving an empty slot between loaded ones if you're processing up to 6 sheets, and the top doesn't latch in place in any way -- in fact, if you overfill the tank a little, the pressure underneath can actually lift the lid a little bit (though not enough to cause fogging, in my experience); you also need to hold the lid in place when you drain the tank, else it'll at least threaten to take a tumble (a rubber band or two around the tank will help here). Also, if you overfill for 4x5, there's no airspace left, resulting in little enough liquid movement during agitation to reduce the contrast of your negatives slightly. Takes 1630 ml (=55 US fluid ounces) for 4x5, not 1830 as I tried to give it. If overfilled, it can also slop solution onto your counter top (if you develop in a proper darkroom sink, that's no problem, of course). Probably not economically ideal if you're using low dilution one-shot developers (Xtol or D-76 1+1, for instance, or HC-110 Dilution B), though if you're processing a dozen sheets, it's not much worse than single-loaded 120 for volume efficiency.

Since I've been replenishing Xtol for a few months now, I don't mind needing a lot of tank solution to process a few sheets -- I only "use up" the same 70 ml per four sheets of 4x5 that I would in an SP-445 or SP-8x10. And if I have a bunch to process, there's no arguing with being able to do a dozen sheets in the same 20+ minutes, dry to hanging, that I'd need for one. I haven't attempted to load the tank with damp carriers (and I can think of several reasons not to try) but the slots in the negative carriers are wide enough and smooth enough that I wouldn't expect big problems loading stiff 4x5 film even if the tank hasn't had time to fully dry (very different from Paterson type reels for 120 or 35mm).
 

Alan9940

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Which ones would you recommend over SP-445 for daylight processing? And what kind of issues are you having with film loading? Lining the sheet up at first or finishing off so it's in correct position before tank is closed?

Depends on what you're looking for, of course. The stainless steel B&W King tank (eBay) holds 10 sheets of film and provides an ideal solution (IMO) for temperature control through the use of a water bath. I've just recently started using the QL45-JP reel from 20th Century Camera that holds 6 sheets of film and fits into a Paterson tank. This reel is super easy to load and, so far, has provided very even development with inversion agitation (don't use the little stick thing.)

The main issue I have with loading the SP-445 holders is ensuring that the film slips properly under all clips on both sides. I've tried feeding with my thumbs (not something I would prefer due to fingerprints), I've tried laying the holder down and feeding the film like I would a film holder, and one or two other things. I'm sure it's just me, but I always seem to miss at least one of the clips. Once I think the sheet is in, I have to feel around the perimeter to make sure the film isn't sitting on top of a clip; again, fingerprints.

Each of us needs to discover what works best for him/her. The SP-445 may be a perfect fit for you.
 

Cholentpot

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I got mine right out the gate.

I tired taco method and it worked well but I decided to get the SP-445 as soon as my Yankee came in and I saw it need something like two liters I'm too cheap for that.

It's worked great so far, granted I've only used it with X-ray film so I can see what I'm doing when I load it.
 

jamesaz

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Ditto what wyofilm says, except I can rarely get mine to not leak a bit. Since I can relate to that, I just accept it.
I’ve had good luck avoiding leakage by additionally removing the o ring when not in use and occasionally putting some petroleum jelly on it.
 

grat

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I started the question on the 6 slot version, so obviously, given a choice, I'd rather use the Stearman Press tank than the Paterson with the 20th century camera reel (not that either is particularly more difficult, I just admire the efficiency of the SP-445). It does dribble a bit. As for loading, I find if I load the negative with a glove on, and flex it slightly on the long axis, I can pop it into the holder (v4) easily. Since I use the same technique loading film into film holders (only to get the leading edges lined up properly), it's more "natural".

As I like the grafmatic, which holds 6 sheets, the idea of the SP-645 appeals.
 

Donald Qualls

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the Yankee Agitank will hold two Grafmatic loads. And yes, it takes a lot of developer, but if you replenish, or can arrange to process a dozen at a time, it's not inefficient.
 
OP
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Deleted member 88956

For the time being I have bought the SP-445 today at a price that was competitive with ordering new from the maker, considering US to EU shipment, customs due etc. Essentially got it for what it delivers within US. Having now watched pretty much all the YT has on it, reading all the feedback here, I'm fairly confident it will serve my needs. Not sure about the reported small leaks with all the assurances there are none when done right. Perhaps a slightly thicker O-ring will fix it, if I end up having similar problems, or they will be negligible enough not to bother. But I do like how it all goes together.

I'll add that Yankee solution was looking promising until I looked up the cost and for it is here in EU it appears to be scarce and quite expensive for what it is. Still a cheaper overall option to SP-445, but at about 30% discount over SP-445 I was not so sure.
 
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BrianShaw

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Not sure about the reported small leaks with all the assurances there are none when done right. Perhaps a slightly thicker O-ring will fix it, if I end up having similar problems, or they will be negligible enough not to bother.
I see the leak mostly from the vent cap. It’s not much but enough for me to forgo inversion in favor of a rocking-sloshing agitation. Maybe I have. As bad cap? It really is a nice system. Enjoy!
 

Donald Qualls

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I'll add that Yankee solution was looking promising until I looked up the cost and for it is here in EU it appears to be scarce and quite expensive for what it is. Still a cheaper overall option to SP-445, but at about 30% discount over SP-445 I was not so sure.

If you're having to order from a US supplier and pay international shipping, import tax, and VAT on top of the price -- or add another level or two of middleman markup -- the Yankee isn't the bargain it is here. I surely wouldn't have been prone to pay $80 for it, hence would never have found out how well it works (even though it looks like it shouldn't). They probably wouldn't still be making them after more than fifty years (with most of the sizes it accommodates virtually obsolete) if they didn't work well enough to generate some repeat business or recommendations.

The SP-445 ought to work pretty well, and is economical on chemistry (more important for one-shot users than if you're running replenished). Even if it drips a bit, I've never managed to have stainless tanks not leak a little, and a Paterson usually will (by the time I've gone through devl, stop and fix, it's a miracle if I don't have some solution on my counter).
 

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BrianShaw

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Hi Tim. I watched a different video of yours again last night and was marveling at how you flipped the tank without any drips. I think I may be squeezing the tank too low? Also, I’ve been using 450ml instead of 475... could that be a problem? Will fill with water and experiment. But no matter... I’ve had great success with it so far. :smile:
 
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tim48v

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Regarding the squeeze: I reach down from the top (hand between the two caps) and squeeze about 1.5" below the lid. Just enough to see the liquid rise, then tighten the caps.
Using 450 ml won't matter. It shouldn't leak, have you shifted the O-ring?
 
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Deleted member 88956

Any devote of SP-445 from Kentucky? Get one here

s-l1600.jpg
 
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