Sony A7RV- 61MP or 102MP? Best Guess?

braxus · Mar 7, 2022

I'd be really interested in getting the Sony A7RV if it does indeed go with their 102 MP sensor from 2019. But the latest rumours suggest it may stick with its 61MP sensor that its used in the last 2 A7R cameras- the A7R IV and A7R IVA. I'd rethink getting the Fuji GFX 100S for the time being, if they do go with the larger sensor. It would be great for getting faster action shots that the Fuji doesn't do well in, and still retain the same rez.

So what do you guys think Sony will do? I'd find it strange they'd put a third model out with the same 61MP sensor, and call it a day. Makes me wonder why Sony bothered designing the 102MP sensor, if they never end up using it.

Also what resolution would that 102MP sensor be, if it was in APS-C crop mode? Would it beat 40MP?

DonW · Mar 7, 2022

The bigger question is are there any 35mm format lenses that will be able to take advantage of all those many pixels?

4season · Mar 7, 2022

Unlikely that Sony will showcase a legacy component in a higher-end camera, particularly when they've just announced development of a newer sensor technology:
https://www.dpreview.com/news/22008...-its-new-2-layer-transistor-pixel-design-tech
I imagine that they could continue selling A7R4 using the same sensor while updating other pieces like the Bionz processor, but I'm just speculating - anyone who has real information is likely under NDA and will need to keep quiet!

Broadly speaking, I think a major direction for new cameras is to follow what's already being done with mobile devices, where "impossible" images become routine, and speedier processors and sensors are a big part of making that possible.

grat · Mar 7, 2022

I've got an EOS 90D, which is 32.5 MP and APS-C. If the sensor were expanded to full-frame, it would be approximately 64.5 MP.

It already has issues with the sensor having more detail than a number of older lenses can resolve, and due to pixel site size, suffers from diffraction effects as wide as f/8 on the red channel. It's suspected that Canon is doing some mathematical trickery to reduce this effect, but the pixel density for 102 MP even on full frame, is going to cause issues.

Oren Grad · Mar 7, 2022

The current Sony 26 MP APS-C, 61 MP full-frame, 102 MP small medium format and 150 MP large medium format sensors share the same 3.76 micron pixel architecture.

braxus said:
Makes me wonder why Sony bothered designing the 102MP sensor, if they never end up using it.

It's a medium-format sensor - 33x44 mm - not a full-frame sensor. It's used in the GFX 100/100S. It cannot be used in the A7 body.

sasah zib · Mar 8, 2022

sony stacked sensor [from sony sensors site] [for background]
https://www.sony-semicon.co.jp/e/products/IS/camera/technology.html#stacked_cmos
"Conventional CMOS image sensors mount the pixel section and analog logic circuit on top of the same chip, which require numerous constraints when wishing to mount the large-scale circuits such as measures to counter the circuit scale and chip size, measures to suppress noise caused by the layout of the pixel and circuit sections, and optimizing the characteristics of pixels and circuit transistors.
Sony has succeeded in establishing a structure that layers the pixel section containing formations of back-illuminated structure pixels over the chip affixed with mounted circuits for signal processing, which is in place of supporting substrates used for conventional back-illuminated CMOS image sensors. By this stacked structure, large-scale circuits can now be mounted keeping small chip size. Furthermore, as the pixel section and circuit section are formed as independent chips, a manufacturing process can be adopted, enabling the pixel section to be specialized for higher image quality while the circuit section can be specialized for higher functionality, thus simultaneously achieving higher image quality, superior functionality and a more compact size. In addition, faster signal processing and lower power consumption can also be achieved through the use of leading process for the chip containing the circuits."

braxus · Mar 8, 2022

Oren Grad said:
It's a medium-format sensor - 33x44 mm - not a full-frame sensor. It's used in the GFX 100/100S. It cannot be used in the A7 body.

Not true. Sony designed a full frame 24x36mm 102 megapixel sensor back in 2019. Look up the IMX555CQR chip.

Oren Grad · Mar 8, 2022

braxus said:
Not true. Sony designed a full frame 24x36mm 102 megapixel sensor back in 2019. Look up the IMX555CQR chip.

Thanks, I see now what you're talking about - different sensor from the IMX461 used in the GFX 100 cameras.

I don't have any particular insight into whether they'll use it, so I'll bow out at this point.

grat · Mar 26, 2022

George Mann said:
It's not a question of resolution since film outresolves these sensors

Only if you're shooting CMS 20 II. Most other films are heavily out-resolved by modern sensors. Fuji quoted 100 lp/mm for 400H, and depending on how you argue that, that's only about 18 megapixel. T-Max 100 claims 200 lines/mm, which I assume is roughly the same as 100 lp/mm.

but whether-or-not the sensor will work well with lenses optimized for film.

"optimized for film" lenses may not be able to keep up with the resolution demands of high-density sensors (my EOS 90D has difficulty with some older EF lenses).

kinglang · Jun 21, 2022

Buying GFX100S is the best option at the moment.

Sony A7RV- 61MP or 102MP? Best Guess?

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