soft focus lenses?

[jamie young]

I've recently gotten the bug to try some of the old soft focus lenses, including
the verito. I'm still dealing with lense board stuff and fitting them to various cameras, so I haven't had much time to experiment yet.
So far I've gotten a 18" verito I'm going to try on my deardorff, and a 11x14 korona a friend is lending me.
Also a 8" graf variable, a 7 1/4 verito, and a darlot single lense element. the verito is only soft focus wide open or close to it. Are most of them like that. Are there soft focus lenses that don't lose their effect when you stop down a bit?
Also, I got a "Queen & CO. 6.5 x 8.5 11" F8 rapid rectillinear (made in Philadelphia).
Anyone know about the company and the lense?

Thanks, Jamie

 

[resummerfield]

Every soft focus lens I’ve used gets sharper as you stop down. Some are so soft, like the Imagon, that I need to shop down to f8 or f11 to get the image I want. Every lens has different characteristics, and you will need to learn them well to get the maximum out of the lens.

 

[wfwhitaker]

Some soft focus lenses have an independent softness adjustment. Two which come to mind are the Wollensak Velostigmat (but not all have this feature) and the Cooke portrait lenses. I haven't used either enough to determine if the softness adjustment is truly independent of the aperture. However, remember that depth of field increases as the aperture is closed (higher f/number), so the apparent softness may not be as great at small apertures even though the softness adjustment is at maximum. As has already been suggested, choose a lens, use it and get to know its particular characteristics. Remember that ND filters are an option for lenses like the Dead Link Removed which exhibit their characteristic soft quality at large apertures.

 

[jimgalli]

The answer to your question is yes, they all lose their magic as they are stopped down.

 

[Russ Young]

IMHO the Kodak 12" is the easiest to learn and nicest effects soft focus lens. One just sold on the auction site for under $300. Today there is a Veritar which is a coated post-War version of the Verito... occassionally there is a 12" Hyperion for sale, another lovely lens.

You can make a lovely one with a +3 close-up lens on the back side of a #3 shutter...
.
Again IMHO, none of the post-1960 soft lenses (none even approach equalling the beauty of the diffusion of earlier lenses.

 

[smieglitz]

...Today there is a Veritar which is a coated post-War version of the Verito...

I believe the coated Veritar is a different design than the Verito. I have several Veritos and have had a 10" Veritar in the past, and the effects were very different. The physical size of the lenses also seems different with the Veritos being larger.

I much prefer the diffused look of the Verito.

Joe

 

[Charles Webb]

What Joe said in his post is exactly the same as my experiences with the Verito and Veritar, they are two different lenses. I point out here that that the lenses I have now are totally different from each other, delivering images that cannot be considered similar.


Charlie.................................

 

[chiller]

What Joe said in his post is exactly the same as my experiences with the Verito and Veritar, they are two different lenses. I point out here that that the lenses I have now are totally different from each other, delivering images that cannot be considered similar.


Charlie.................................

Hi Charlie,

I realise it is subjective but could you describe the differences as you see them? I'm considering a SF lens but even though I have a reasonable understanding of the choices available hands on experience cannot be denied.

Steve

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

The Veritar seems mushier overall to me. The Verito is more like having a diffused image over a sharp image. I prefer the Verito as well.

 

[smieglitz]

...
I realise it is subjective but could you describe the differences as you see them?...

The Verito gives a diffused glow that is dreamy, heavenly/angelic, and marvelous. (How's that for subjective?)

Here are a couple Verito pics at about f/4.5:

The Veritar is, as David relates, "mushy". Take a poor quality Gundlach triple convertible, drop it on the floor a couple times and kick it around, and you have the Veritar.

And now from a Veritar:

Joe

 

[JG Motamedi]

I have no argument with Joe, David, or Charlie's observation (echoed by my own) that the Veritar and the Verito behave and look very differently. However Russ is correct, they are the same design; sort of a weird 3/4 periscopic, singlet up front and achromat doublet in the rear.

 

[jimgalli]

Sheesh, I'm glad I don't have a Veritar to sell this week.

BTW for the more adventurous out there, If you have a boring old 20" RR lens, try removing the front light and replacing it with a +1 or +2 diopter. You'll end up with a 12" ish Verito like lens. Nice and fuzzy and about f6 IIRC. I did it with a Beck 13" and got a very nice soft 7" fuzzy wuzzy.

There, wiped out Veritar's and Verito's in the same thread!

 

[ineffablething]

Try finding a Wollensak Versar. They don't get the good press of the Verito or Veritar, but they produce wonderful images. Here's a snapshot I made of an old gf whilst hiking.

 

[removed account4]

i dunno, i like the veritar and have gotten some nice portraits out of it.
the lighting has to be a little on the high key side, but the verito can be really dim to work and work well.

strange how they are the same, but different -- must be the "wollycoat" ...

 

[jd callow]

love the shoes!

The lens seems pretty cool as well.

 

[removed account4]

love the shoes!

The lens seems pretty cool as well.

jd -

they are hiking afterall together with chuck taylor

 

[Ole]

... they are the same design; sort of a weird 3/4 periscopic, singlet up front and achromat doublet in the rear.

That's interesting. I think that's how the Rodenstock Hemi-Anastigmat is put together too, but that's a sharp lens, not soft focus...

 

[Russ Young]

Wow Guys-

Thanks for all of the images you posted- most interesting.

You might want to check out www.cameraeccentric.com/html/info/wollensakm/p2.html
which is a ca. 1950 booklet on the Veritar. It has a lens diagram as well as other very useful information.

In general, as time passed, not only did lenses become coated but they were re-designed (read: new glasses, minor changes in curvature) to be "more firm" to accommodate the prevailing aesthetic trends. Part of the Verito-Veritar redesign was changing the maximum aperture from f/4 to f/6, making the lens unable to give the same degree of diffusion.

Imagons suffered the same fate and were "firmed up" at least four times during their production life. A 1932 Imagon has almost nothing in common (as far as the image is concerned) with a 1970 Imagon even though the basic design is the same.

Another ignominious revamp was the legendary Pinkham & Smith Semi-Achromatic which was used by more major Pictorialists than any other lens; Alvin Langdon Coburn had 8 Semi-Achromatics. By the time Smith and Wolfe designed the Visual Quality most of the 'magic' had been taken out of it. I'm not aware of a single major Pictorialist who used a Visual Quality and only a handful who used the Synthetic.

I'd enjoy any input you might have.

Thanks,
Russ

 

[smieglitz]

If it ain't broke, don't fix it seems applicable to the redesigns. Thanks for the additional info Russ.

Joe

 

[Dave Wooten]

Try finding a Wollensak Versar. They don't get the good press of the Verito or Veritar, but they produce wonderful images. Here's a snapshot I made of an old gf whilst hiking.

She doesnt look that old!

I have a 14 x 17 f/6 wolly versar....will get to try it soon....I like that swirly background you have in this portrait.. was this wide open?

 

[jonw]

I find the Dallmeyer D Patent series of lens can produce a nice bokeh...diffused look....Here is an example of Purple Sage taken by a 5D at f11 with the rear diffuser ring. http://www.photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=4915601
I now have a group of them to experient with....3D, 4D, & 5D

 

[Robert Oliver]

my new dallmeyer 12" adon telephoto zoom does some pretty cool stuff wide open when zoomed past 12". get's sharper as you stop down of course. Looks pretty sharp on the GG when stopped down or not zoomed. Haven't tested those yet. Not zoomed I have plenty of bellows on the speed graphic. I can shoot full head portraits with lots of room to spare. Zoomed I hit the end of the bellows at head and shoulders.

Dead Link Removed

 

[Robert Oliver]

I might add the adon is a nightmare to focus when zoomed. First lens I've worked with that is easier to focus at f8 than at f4.5. (zoomed only)

 

[jimgalli]

Bravo Robert! You've captured her bubbly personality perfectly.

 

[Larry H-L]

I have a 10" Veritar, would describe it as "swirly." On a 4x5 one doesn't see much of the effect. On a 5x7, the outer third of the image circle gets a sense of whispy motion. It is low in contrast, needs N+. I also have a 6" Yamasaki, gives an effect much like the Verito, with diffused glow.