Slide Copying Quandary

davetravis · Mar 22, 2007

Well, here I go again...
I need to copy my 6x7 slides before they fade into history.
I must do the copying, and the E-6 myself.
I'm already set up for 120/220 E-6.
The only dupe film I can find is the Kodak Edupe - not available in 120!!!

It seems I have 2 choices:
1. Buy the Pentax 67 bellows and slide copier and take my chances with the lesser contrasty films like Kodak E100G, or Fuji Astia.
2. Buy the Jobo 4x5 processing drum, enlarge the 6x7 onto 4x5 Edupe film in my darkroom, and process.

#2 will be the least expensive, but #1 will allow more copies per batch.

So, has anyone ever tried using Kodak E100G or Fuji Astia as slide copy film?
Thanks.
DT

resummerfield · Mar 22, 2007

I have duped slides, using the dedicated dupe film and also regular film (although not Kodak E100G or Fuji Astia). I recall the regular film being more contrasty, but not so much as to be unusable.

The Pentax bellows would be much faster, and you could fabricate something similar to what Beseler had on their slide dupe units, which was designed to reduce the contrast and allow the use of regular film. It was simply a piece of clear glass placed at a 45 degree angle, with a small light source of the side. You shot through the glass and the light source flashed at the time of exposure to introduce a controlled amount of flare. You could probably get the entire Beseler unit on Ebay cheap.

Or you could try adjusting development, maybe overexpose and under development?

David A. Goldfarb · Mar 22, 2007

I'd dupe to 4x5", unless you need 6x7 for projection. You'll get a higher quality result, if your plan is to be able to print them in the future.

Photo Engineer · Mar 22, 2007

Dave, you may want to make silver separation negatives for durability, or you may want to make dupe negatives. I am duping slides onto 4x5 negatives using a daylight filter pack in my enlarger and a slightly pulled process with Portra NC.

I know you want sildes, but these two options offer higher quality. A dupe slide is never as high quality as dupe negatives or separations. There is too much lost in a pos-pos system.

PE

davetravis · Mar 22, 2007

resummerfield said:
I have duped slides, using the dedicated dupe film and also regular film (although not Kodak E100G or Fuji Astia). I recall the regular film being more contrasty, but not so much as to be unusable.

The Pentax bellows would be much faster, and you could fabricate something similar to what Beseler had on their slide dupe units, which was designed to reduce the contrast and allow the use of regular film. It was simply a piece of clear glass placed at a 45 degree angle, with a small light source of the side. You shot through the glass and the light source flashed at the time of exposure to introduce a controlled amount of flare. You could probably get the entire Beseler unit on Ebay cheap.

Or you could try adjusting development, maybe overexpose and under development?

Do you mean like that Beseler Dual Mode Slide Duplicator?
Or the Pentax slide duper that attached to the bellows?
Did you ever try either?

davetravis · Mar 22, 2007

David A. Goldfarb said:
I'd dupe to 4x5", unless you need 6x7 for projection. You'll get a higher quality result, if your plan is to be able to print them in the future.

What lens do you use for this?
I have the APO Rodagon.

davetravis · Mar 22, 2007

Photo Engineer said:
Dave, you may want to make silver separation negatives for durability, or you may want to make dupe negatives. I am duping slides onto 4x5 negatives using a daylight filter pack in my enlarger and a slightly pulled process with Portra NC.

I know you want sildes, but these two options offer higher quality. A dupe slide is never as high quality as dupe negatives or separations. There is too much lost in a pos-pos system.

PE

What lens do you use for this?
I have the APO Rodagon.
When you say loss, how much with the Edupe, and how will it manifest?

David A. Goldfarb · Mar 22, 2007

I have a 90mm Apo-Rodagon as well--fine lens.

davetravis · Mar 22, 2007

David A. Goldfarb said:
I have a 90mm Apo-Rodagon as well--fine lens.

Thanks David,
I have the Beseler 4x5 enlarger also, and have already tried some Ilfochrome from 4x5.
What film do you copy to?
How long are your exposures?

Photo Engineer · Mar 22, 2007

I have the Beser 4x5 Dicrhro S on an Omega frame, and have a Schneider, a Rodagon and 2 Computars for different sizes.

As for the loss, it occurs in the toe and the shoulder as you are imposing a toe on a toe and a shoulder on a shoulder which causes data loss in highlights and in shadows. This leads to a dupey look.

In a post > neg transformation, both the toe and shoulder are duped onto the straight line of the negative with no appreciable loss. In addition, the masking of the negatives or what you can do with silver internegs, you can prevent color aberration.

PE

davetravis · Mar 22, 2007

Photo Engineer said:
I have the Beser 4x5 Dicrhro S on an Omega frame, and have a Schneider, a Rodagon and 2 Computars for different sizes.

As for the loss, it occurs in the toe and the shoulder as you are imposing a toe on a toe and a shoulder on a shoulder which causes data loss in highlights and in shadows. This leads to a dupey look.

In a post > neg transformation, both the toe and shoulder are duped onto the straight line of the negative with no appreciable loss. In addition, the masking of the negatives or what you can do with silver internegs, you can prevent color aberration.

PE

Thanks PE,
I'll have to noodle on that for a while.

resummerfield · Mar 22, 2007

davetravis said:
Do you mean like that Beseler Dual Mode Slide Duplicator?.....

Yes, that's the one I used. I tried it a few times, with E100, but I did not require critical matching so I didn't take the time to really sort things out. I tried some with and without the device, and I saw only the slightest bit of difference. I think Bowens made a slide duplicator with something like it, too.

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