Sino Promise the great Yellow Father
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Kodak is still Kodak. Be careful with the yellow. Us old fools know what you mean but wouldn't want for someone to interpret it as a slur.
It is still not clear to me how much influence Sino Promise has in decisions on investment in new products. Does Kodak the manufacturer simply agree to research and make new products if Sino Promise commits the money that Kodak says will be required i.e. as if Sino is the customer whose needs will be met if the price is right or does Kodak have a say in if and where the money will be spent?
Thanks
pentaxuser
Thanks
pentaxuser
Last edited:
MattKing
Moderator
Well, SinoPromise Holdings are involved with two of the remaining lines of Kodak branded products - colour photographic paper, and the photo chemicals used for still films.
They also are the suppliers of Kodak branded programs that relate to photo kiosks and a few other things that support commercial colour photolabs - the still film ones.
Because of a slew of market and market condition challenges, they are struggling with obtaining source components and getting manufactured products - both from their locations in China and their contract providers in the USA and elsewhere - to their markets around the world.
Due to market realities and the previously mentioned challenged, they have also reduced the selection of sizes available in many products - in many cases now available only in commercial quantities. In addition, some low volume sellers like T-Max RS developer are no longer being made.
I'd be surprised if you would see new product this year, although you may see some smaller package sizes again. But I expect that this year and at least next year will be devoted to trying to deal with all the disruption that we have been, and are continuing to experience worldwide.
What products in their range were you thinking of?
MattKing
Moderator
We don't mind wishes or wonderings ....
SP holds some (Kodak) patents now:
"
While there has been extensive research relating to the various dye image forming color couplers and other components of the silver halide emulsion layers, there have been only modest efforts to optimize the interlayers for various properties. Typically, the interlayers contain one or more hydrophilic colloids (such as a gelatin), a hardener, and sometimes a non-volatile coupler solvent such as dibutyl phthalate or diunadecyl phthalate, UV absorbers, and oxidized developing agent scavengers such as ballasted hydroquinone or aminophenols as described for example in U.S. Pat. No. 5,962,210 (Hahm et al.).
Latex polymers have been incorporated into photographic elements for various purposes. For example, they have been incorporated into light sensitive silver halide emulsion layers, topmost non-light sensitive overcoat layers, and in backside (non-imaging) layers, of black-and-white and color photographic elements."
The SP+Kodak deal was more than brand and trademark.
"
While there has been extensive research relating to the various dye image forming color couplers and other components of the silver halide emulsion layers, there have been only modest efforts to optimize the interlayers for various properties. Typically, the interlayers contain one or more hydrophilic colloids (such as a gelatin), a hardener, and sometimes a non-volatile coupler solvent such as dibutyl phthalate or diunadecyl phthalate, UV absorbers, and oxidized developing agent scavengers such as ballasted hydroquinone or aminophenols as described for example in U.S. Pat. No. 5,962,210 (Hahm et al.).
Latex polymers have been incorporated into photographic elements for various purposes. For example, they have been incorporated into light sensitive silver halide emulsion layers, topmost non-light sensitive overcoat layers, and in backside (non-imaging) layers, of black-and-white and color photographic elements."
The SP+Kodak deal was more than brand and trademark.
MattKing
Moderator
I expect that those patents relate to the colour paper manufacturing.
Here it becomes difficult... If a manufacturers owns a patent applicable to different fields of their production and manufacture for one such field is sold, the patent either is licenced as part of the deal, or it is sold as part of the deal with the seller gaining a licence.
Bringing back Ektachrome and TMZ in 2018 was a heroic act! I wish them all the best in 2022.
MattKing
Moderator
Different entities - the film people are Eastman Kodak and Kodak Alaris.
But I'm happy to wish all of them the best.
Does anyone dare to pronounce the 'K' - word ?
Please do not. That puppy is long dead.
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Does anyone dare to pronounce the 'K' - word ?
I hear it brings out half of a popular 60's duo.
they do. specifically for "folded paper" ... note that they are for "elements" so apply broader than 'paper'. SP clearly has ability to coat multilayer complex emulsions; and has done so for years.
I put that info into Photrio only so it would be known that SP had gotten patents in their deal. The patent portfolio of "Kodak" is aging rapidly. Expiring in 7 to 12 years for the "key" patents that I know.
New product suggests that a "new market" can fund research. I don't see it, nor do I see an increase in patents for emulsion/chemical photography. Any new product would seem to rely upon older, known capabilities. Cooking from existing recipe books, using leftovers from the cupboard.
The "new" products are in the scrapbook, small booklet, improved duplicates field. Go to your local drugstore to find that roll of color paper in use.
It seems that Kodak branded color (colour) papers aren't available anywhere, at least not that I can find in US, EU, UK. Not sure if this is true in Australia, China, India...??
I know SinoPromise has been making color chemistry for years, confectioning papers etc. Before the sale of the color negative paper and chemistry DID SINOPROMISE MAKE COLOR NEGATIVE PAPER????
If Carestream Colorado was the single source for Kodak branded Color negative papers we could be in for a long wait.
If SinoPromise is making paper and chemistry they may be concentrating on China????
Curiouser and curiouser ??
I know SinoPromise has been making color chemistry for years, confectioning papers etc. Before the sale of the color negative paper and chemistry DID SINOPROMISE MAKE COLOR NEGATIVE PAPER????
If Carestream Colorado was the single source for Kodak branded Color negative papers we could be in for a long wait.
If SinoPromise is making paper and chemistry they may be concentrating on China????
Curiouser and curiouser ??
There is listed by the manufacturer only one paper anyway...
KODAK PROFESSIONAL SUPRA ENDURA VC Digital Paper
from SP web: http://www.sinopromise.com.cn/bizSino2.php Their paper products.
old news, last Sept 2021: "
In a letter subsequently sent out to its silver halide photo retailer customers, Sean Souri, general manager of Southpoint, said these changes were set to impact the ‘entire silver halide industry’. https://www.southpointphoto.com/
Fujifim US has confirmed it is aware of the circulation of the Sino Promise letter to US dealers and its potential impact: ‘We are getting inquiries from virtually all lab customers…It could not have come at a worse time,’ a leading Fujifilm US executive revealed." .. "Sino Promise acquired the Kodak Alaris paper slitting plant in Xiamen, China, in 2015 and the Kodak Alaris photochemical plant in Wuxi, China in 20126. Last year it acquired the Kodak Alaris colour negative paper, photochemicals, display substrates (Duratrans, etc) and printing software businesses. As all manufacturing capacity had already been sold off by Kodak Alaris (much of it to Sino Promise itself), the acquisition was effectively a payment for the licence to sell paper and chemistry products under the Kodak brand."
old news, last Sept 2021: "
In a letter subsequently sent out to its silver halide photo retailer customers, Sean Souri, general manager of Southpoint, said these changes were set to impact the ‘entire silver halide industry’. https://www.southpointphoto.com/
Fujifim US has confirmed it is aware of the circulation of the Sino Promise letter to US dealers and its potential impact: ‘We are getting inquiries from virtually all lab customers…It could not have come at a worse time,’ a leading Fujifilm US executive revealed." .. "Sino Promise acquired the Kodak Alaris paper slitting plant in Xiamen, China, in 2015 and the Kodak Alaris photochemical plant in Wuxi, China in 20126. Last year it acquired the Kodak Alaris colour negative paper, photochemicals, display substrates (Duratrans, etc) and printing software businesses. As all manufacturing capacity had already been sold off by Kodak Alaris (much of it to Sino Promise itself), the acquisition was effectively a payment for the licence to sell paper and chemistry products under the Kodak brand."
Supra is an obsolete offering in the USA. I can find a few SKUs of Kodak color paper at VanBar in Australia, looks like a consumer grade, could be old, all the color chemistry is back ordered. Looks like Kodak paper and color chemistry is just not available, at least I can't find it anywhere. I made some color prints today, same Fujifilm Crystal Archive paper I've used since EK stopped cutting sheets. Hopefully things will improve for SinoPromise, their color chemistry works great.
Best Regards Mike
Best Regards Mike
Does anyone dare to pronounce the 'K' - word ?
We already have new posts on a thread related to the K-word.
MattKing
Moderator
There does seem to be new production, Made in China, Sino-Promise labelled HC-110 appearing in Taiwan and Singapore.
See this thread: https://www.photrio.com/forum/threa...ottle-2022-sino-promise-made-in-china.192670/
I haven't heard anything recently from my Sino Promise contact, but my other contacts have made reference to them continuing production in the future - Covid permitting.
See this thread: https://www.photrio.com/forum/threa...ottle-2022-sino-promise-made-in-china.192670/
I haven't heard anything recently from my Sino Promise contact, but my other contacts have made reference to them continuing production in the future - Covid permitting.
Okay, so maybe some green shoots appearing. I heard that there was some dispute over license fees between Kodak and Sino Promise. It would be nice to hear from Sino or Kodak what's actually happening... Whatever the case is, it's had a big impact on film processing costs. And reduced my stock pile of Kodak Endura.
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