Shelf life of phot paper

Larry the sailor · Sep 18, 2016

I picked up a big wad of darkroom equipment from a craigslist ad this afternoon.
I'm happy I got my money's worth out of the enlarger and various equipment and hardware and didn't really consider the value of the paper and film for my part.
The majority of it has been stored in sealed plastic bags of some sort and quite a bit of the paper and film is still under factory seal. BUT- it was stored in a garage.
Included with this deal was boxes and boxes and boxes of assorted photo paper, Kodak, Ilford, Oriental, and a few others, sized form 4X5 to 16X20- graded, MC/VC, RC and fiber. Most of it B&W but some Fuji and other brands of color paper. Didn't see any dates on the B&W paper but the color stuff has "use before" dates back in '89.
Also included was 16 odd boxes of 4X5 film some Fuji Cibachrome but most assorted B&W, 50 and 100 count boxes about 1/2 of it in factory sealed boxes dated to '87-'89

Any chance the B&W paper is still OK? didn't see any dates on it but I'm not gonna be unhappy if it's all trash.
Kind of sad that it's likely trash but those are the breaks

mehguy · Sep 18, 2016

Kodak hasnt made paper in 10 years and considering most of that paper is around 20 years old, its likely very fogged. But it doesnt hurt to try it as it is a large lot of paper. But I can only speak for BW paper, I have no experience in a color darkroom.

I wouldnt throw it out if it turns out to be fogged. It could be saved for a special occasion if you desire such an effect. I personally keep a box of Ilford Multigrade 3 in my paper drawer thats quite fogged just incase if I want to use it for something else.

Edit: Another thing to add, the fiber paper might still be good, try it out and see what you get.

wy2l · Sep 18, 2016

Hmmmm... stored in a garage in Oklahoma.... do the summers get hot in Oklahoma?

Larry the sailor · Sep 18, 2016

I didn't ask if was an air conditioned garage but "hot" is relative...

mooseontheloose · Sep 18, 2016

There are plenty of threads here on APUG on what to do with fogged paper.

Some papers (the Oriental especially, possibly some of your "others") might be good for lith printing. Some people use old papers that would be useless for conventional B&W printing quite successfully with lith. You might be able to salvage paper for other alternative processes, if you are interested in that sort of thing.

kreeger · Sep 18, 2016

Larry,
Color paper, you can likely search the web and find the product handling sheets. in my opinion, is a lost cause 100% of it.

B&W paper. I have printed a lot of my work on old stock paper kept cool or frozen for years before use.
Not all of it survives... but what does work, after time, just becomes very flat, contrast wise at some point and unusable.

Testing BW paper. What I do is mix up fresh chemicals, and process half of an unexposed sheet of paper for 1.5 minutes in my developer by 1/2 dunking it with agitation, then put the whole sheet into stop and fix, and then evaluating the developed 1/2 against the undeveloped 1/2 to look for fog. If it's acceptable, I try printing a negative I have that I have a fine print of. I go and try printing that negative in the same way, but on the outdated paper and see if it's contrast is good -- or gone flat - contrast wise.

Good paper worth saving you can add a Benzotriazole solution to your developer to help the fogging (See Photographer's Formulary for that)

In the end, It may all be a lost cause, and worth what you paid for it but you never know.

Larry the sailor · Sep 18, 2016

I got my money out of the enlarger and hardware stuff. Didn't really figure the paper would be much count but if a person were to buy it at today's prices it would probably be at least a couple thousand dollars worth of paper, maybe more. The small stuff, 11X17 and 8X10, filled the passenger side floor and seat of my Jeep Wrangler
The woman I bought the stuff from was almost as concerned about the paper as she was the rest of the kit. I don't think she realized that paper and film have a shelf life that isn't measure in decades and isn't helped by storing it in a garage.

Rich Ullsmith · Sep 21, 2016

Temperature is not good, but humidity is more an issue. Old graded Oriental has held up well for me.
Quick and easy test, just clip a corner of each and drop it in developer. If you get fogging there, no point in wasting time on the penny test.
Moose said even with the fogging, some of those old papers are great for lith. Whole different test to see if they are lithable.

newcan1 · Sep 23, 2016

I bought a huge amount of graded Kodabrome that was dated 1993, for 10 cents on the dollar. It is quite fogged, but I processed an unexposed sheet then timed how long it took to remove the fog in a dilute ferri bleach. I then made an exposed test strip and bleached after dev/fix, for the same amount of time as the initial test bleaching. I then did the same with a final print. The final print result was almost identical to a print made on fresh paper. So with the extra bleach step, the paper is useable. The one side effect though is that all grades higher than 3 have defaulted to 3.

revdoc · Sep 23, 2016

Not long ago I tested a load of old paper. Various brands, some dated from the 1980s, the rest the 1990s. Only some graded Ilfobrom was still good. The rest was fogged.

To test: tear a sheet in two and throw half into the fixer right away. Develop and fix the other sheet without exposing it. A comparison of the two will show the extent of fogging, if any.

piu58 · Sep 24, 2016

I recommend the use of restrainer. In problematic cases, simply add 10 ml per liter and all is fine. Imge tone gets slighly coller and the devlopping time increases a bit, that's all.

Larry the sailor · Sep 25, 2016

Tried a couple boxes to see what it would do.

Took it out of the box, cut it in half, one piece in fixer the other in developer

Ilford Multigrade stock solution.
Agfa Multicontrast Classic Glossy FB - Turned nearly black in less than a minute
Forte Elegance Polygrade FB Glossy - Turned a medium gray in the same time. Darn shame, I got 3 unopened 100 count boxes of this stuff
Tired a couple sheets of each. same results

Both in the fixer stayed white

Leigh B · Sep 25, 2016

Larry,

Have you considered / tried benzotriazole as an anti-fogging agent? For example:
https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...ry_10_0250_100G_Benzotriazole_Anti_Fog_1.html

It's been around since they invented light.

- Leigh

Larry the sailor · Sep 25, 2016

I learned about it on this very thread .
I'll I'll add some to my order next time I have an order. Freestyle carries it in a liquid and have it in stock.

silveror0 · Sep 26, 2016

Ref: AA's info in The Print regarding restrainers for fogged papers

Potassium Bromide (KBr)
1. Prepare as a 10% solution:

Dissolve 100g KBr in 900cc of water, then add water to make one liter.

2. You might begin with 50cc of 10% KBr per liter of stock developer present in the working solution.

Check on the effect of the bromide and add more as needed for the desired effect.

Note: Bromide sometimes adds a slightly greenish tone to the image, which can be overcome in most cases by selenium toning. With modern papers, bromide produces a warmer image. Paper speed will be reduced, requiring longer exposures – possibly longer emergence time as well, requiring lower than normal development factors (Normal is 6X, Max is 8X).

Benzotriazole
1. Prepare a 1% solution:

Dissolve 10g BTZ in 900cc of water, then add water to make one liter.
[B&H info says use water at 125F or higher due to difficulty in dissolving]

2. You might begin with 25cc of 1% BTZ per liter of stock Dektol. Use only enough to clear paper fog. Adding 50cc causes a noticeable shift toward blue. Adding 100cc will reduce paper speed by roughly 2/3-stop. Image contrast may also be increased somewhat (more so than KBr).

Note: Benzotriazole produces about the same restraining effect as KBr, but also a noticeable shift to a blue tone. Paper speed will be reduced, requiring longer exposures – possibly longer emergence time as well, requiring lower than normal development factors.

Shelf life of phot paper

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