Shanghai GP3 120 film It's back?

John Wiegerink · Nov 25, 2017

trendland said:
I love every new stuff in bw but it has to be real new. The period of old Agfa films in new packaging seams to come to its final end.
The chineese probably know this - soon they increased pricing.
But in gerneral it is an issue of market rules - the more films , the more manufacturers the better to us.
Some may say : The demand from film is much to smal to many of different manufacturers.
I have to state : " Let's wait and we will see if it is true "

with regards

If you have read all of the above you will then see that the Shanghai GP3 120 film isn't new, but just a restart after a factory move. Since there are only a few dealers with it on eBay I'm sure they are just trying to "cash in" on it's new re-release. You know, testing the waters. Throw about five or six more sellers on eBay and you'll see a big price war. As has been said by Kevin above you can buy it for about $2.56 a roll from a certain seller and Taobao a Chinese eBay style site That tells me the prices on eBay will come down in the future, but there are always some dummy's out there that think just because it's on eBay Auction it's a good deal. NOT!.

trendland · Nov 25, 2017

Well - John I have an idea you can allways find such guys on ebay (to both sides).
Just remember ebay offers from expired films in color (date 1984) and such demand from others who bit on (allways stored in the dark) films.So it is a way they find together

.
By the time - last I found on Ebay (years ago) 20xpacks Ektachrome 120. Expired 2001 - 2003 (obviously good storage condition) last week I got one back again from
comercial developement : No shifts.
Don't ask me what I paid on eBay I remember $80,- may be to 4 packs (20x120) and after this I bought in addition some EPY and paid again.
Real cheap.Since some years you will often find high priced expired scratch.
Best time to by films 2003 - 2006.
with regards

Cholentpot · Nov 25, 2017

trendland said:
My hope to smaller cheap pricing is not as great that yours.
But in general (because of additional alternates) this will help Ilford to increase their pricing not so much in the future.
The all the time statements : The production of film is much more expensive today because of much smaller volume is nonsence.
Because the most issue on higher pricing
with films are the profits of film dealers (sometimes) So we can see a very nice example with Shanghai films now.
Of course the smaller volume makes films not cheaper.But some pricing increases + 400%, + 350%, + 600% so the manfacturers get the smalest part of that money.
A monopol structure we notice with Fuji E6 for example is poison to all.
Welcome Shanghai films !
You are right - we can get it cheaper in future.But don't be to much optimistic for final pricing.

with regards

Their chief market is still China. You think they'll be selling their film in China at American prices? No way Jose. We know how this'll work. Some enlightened free market individual will buy the stuff in bulk from the factory after giving the night foreman 10% and a fat hog and then post it on Ali for nice and cheap. As long as Mr. Foreman gets his fat hen the supplies won't dry up and Mr. Foreman will write off the stuff that falls off the rickshaw as waste or something. This is capitalism in a socialist world. My Great-Grandfather did this with chocolate and sugar in the grand old days of Communism.

John Wiegerink · Nov 25, 2017

Cholentpot said:
Their chief market is still China. You think they'll be selling their film in China at American prices? No way Jose. We know how this'll work. Some enlightened free market individual will buy the stuff in bulk from the factory after giving the night foreman 10% and a fat hog and then post it on Ali for nice and cheap. As long as Mr. Foreman gets his fat hen the supplies won't dry up and Mr. Foreman will write off the stuff that falls off the rickshaw as waste or something. This is capitalism in a socialist world. My Great-Grandfather did this with chocolate and sugar in the grand old days of Communism.

Exactly! A very wise old man told me something once and I'll never for get it. He said Communism and Socialism are two very good if not excellent forms of Government/economics, but what ruins both is individual greed. And what ruins
Socialism and Communism makes Capitalism thrive. Yup, personal or individual greed! So, I think you are right and it won't be long and the prices will start dropping. It would still be good stuff at $3.00 a roll. but closer to $2.50 sounds better yet. We'll see?

Cholentpot · Nov 25, 2017

John Wiegerink said:
Exactly! A very wise old man told me something once and I'll never for get it. He said Communism and Socialism are two very good if not excellent forms of Government/economics, but what ruins both is individual greed. And what ruins
Socialism and Communism makes Capitalism thrive. Yup, personal or individual greed! So, I think you are right and it won't be long and the prices will start dropping. It would still be good stuff at $3.00 a roll. but closer to $2.50 sounds better yet. We'll see?

Things that work in theory may not work at all.

I, for one will welcome the $2.50 rolls of imprinted shoddy blackmarket film.

RattyMouse · Nov 26, 2017

Cholentpot said:
Things that work in theory may not work at all.

I, for one will welcome the $2.50 rolls of imprinted shoddy blackmarket film.

Beats $5 rolls of imprinted shoddy domestic film!

John Wiegerink · Nov 26, 2017

RattyMouse said:
Beats $5 rolls of imprinted shoddy domestic film!

Well, we'll have to wait and see on that. I'm sure the Chinese would have figured out what the problem was and corrected it in less than a third of the time this Western Company has. Of course you probably wouldn't get replacement rolls from Chine, but what good are replacement rolls when you are setting there looking at letters and numbers on your Aunt Jane's forehead. Oh, and that picture of Aunt Jane was the last and only one you took just before she died. If that problem film were all I could get I'd switch to digital. Thank God it's not. Long live GP3!

AgX · Nov 26, 2017

Cholentpot said:
Their chief market is still China. You think they'll be selling their film in China at American prices? No way Jose. We know how this'll work. Some enlightened free market individual will buy the stuff in bulk from the factory after giving the night foreman 10% and a fat hog and then post it on Ali for nice and cheap. As long as Mr. Foreman gets his fat hen the supplies won't dry up and Mr. Foreman will write off the stuff that falls off the rickshaw as waste or something. This is capitalism in a socialist world. My Great-Grandfather did this with chocolate and sugar in the grand old days of Communism.

This has nothing to do with communism, nor with capitalism or foremen. In both systems it was usual for manufacturers themselves to sell their stuff to different markets at different prices. In some cases they did a rebranding too.
We got countless cases of this in the photographicf industry alone, in the past and now.

Cholentpot · Nov 26, 2017

AgX said:
This has nothing to do with communism, nor with capitalism or foremen. In both systems it was usual for manufacturers themselves to sell their stuff to different markets at different prices. In some cases they did a rebranding too.
We got countless cases of this in the photographicf industry alone, in the past and now.

Point me to the nearest black market here in the Great Lake states! I need a kilo of sugar, a left boot, three spoons and a vacuum tube for my shortwave. I have a half bag of ball-bearings, a 8x8 sheet of leather and a gallbladder from my neighbors goat.

John Wiegerink said:
Well, we'll have to wait and see on that. I'm sure the Chinese would have figured out what the problem was and corrected it in less than a third of the time this Western Company has. Of course you probably wouldn't get replacement rolls from Chine, but what good are replacement rolls when you are setting there looking at letters and numbers on your Aunt Jane's forehead. Oh, and that picture of Aunt Jane was the last and only one you took just before she died. If that problem film were all I could get I'd switch to digital. Thank God it's not. Long live GP3!

You know why this is? There's no BBB in Sino, you know what the BBB is? 'Product sucks, no more buying from you. Bye.' Or...We're the only ones allowed to make this stuff and the Government will keep the equipment out of anyone else's hands by force if necessary so enjoy the numbers on Cousin Fred's left eyeball.'

RattyMouse said:
Beats $5 rolls of imprinted shoddy domestic film!

They use the same backing paper as Kodak-san?

AgX · Nov 26, 2017

Cholentpot said:
Point me to the nearest black market here in the Great Lake states!

Our whole capitalist society is a black market where people are doing business without paying taxes.

But I did not refer to black market in my post above, but to the fact that there need not be a black market, but manufacturers producing themselves for different markets and themselves offering same goods for different markets at different prices.

Cholentpot · Nov 26, 2017

AgX said:
Our whole capitalist society is a black market where people are doing business without paying taxes.

But I did not refer to black market in my post above, but to the fact that there need not be a black market, but manufacturers producing themselves for different markets and themselves offering same goods for different markets at different prices.

Oh yes. This is called...Free Markets!

Doing business in a way that cannot be taxed? That's the free market speaking.

braxus · Jan 28, 2018

Is it true this film is basically Plus X made in a Chinese Factory? I have read Shanghai films are Kodak films or Kodak formulas made in China. And someone said this film is the same as Plus X from Kodak. Anyone confirm? And have the backing paper issues and film curl been rectified? The only thing is if this is indeed Plus X, then why rate it at 100 instead of 125? And some say GP3 works better at 80 even.

Lachlan Young · Jan 28, 2018

braxus said:
Is it true this film is basically Plus X made in a Chinese Factory? I have read Shanghai films are Kodak films or Kodak formulas made in China. And someone said this film is the same as Plus X from Kodak. Anyone confirm? And have the backing paper issues and film curl been rectified? The only thing is if this is indeed Plus X, then why rate it at 100 instead of 125? And some say GP3 works better at 80 even.

I think you are getting confused with some of the rumours/ stories/ suppositions about Kodak and the 'Lucky' brand films. I also suspect that people are comparing Shanghai film to Plus-X because that is their sociocultural reference point for 100-ish speed non-tabular grain B&W films. Without a spectral sensitisation graph & a characteristic curve, it's very difficult to say what the heritage of Shanghai film actually is, though there's a very long list of 100 speed BW films it could share commonalities with.

John Wiegerink · Jan 28, 2018

The backing paper offset issue was resolved in the Shanghai GP3 120 film before the plant shutdown and move. So, this new Shanghai GP3 is suppose to be the same as the film made just before the move and a very good film at that. The only difference now is the price. Yup, they decided or somebody decided it would be nice to charge more per roll. Certainly not my idea of grabbing a large share of the 100 speed film market, but hey, I'm not running their show. Don't get me wrong, I really like the film, but at the new going price I'll stick with Ilford instead. One of the main reasons I liked and used the film in the first place was it's price. Now with the cost very near and in some cases even more than Ilford FP4+ it ain't worth it. JohnW

trendland · Jan 28, 2018

Lachlan Young said:
I think you are getting confused with some of the rumours/ stories/ suppositions about Kodak and the 'Lucky' brand films. I also suspect that people are comparing Shanghai film to Plus-X because that is their sociocultural reference point for 100-ish speed non-tabular grain B&W films. Without a spectral sensitisation graph & a characteristic curve, it's very difficult to say what the heritage of Shanghai film actually is, though there's a very long list of 100 speed BW films it could share commonalities with.

Well I didn't think so because of old Kodak licenced production.
Today the chinese may Do what they want

with regards

Cholentpot · Jan 28, 2018

John Wiegerink said:
The backing paper offset issue was resolved in the Shanghai GP3 120 film before the plant shutdown and move. So, this new Shanghai GP3 is suppose to be the same as the film made just before the move and a very good film at that. The only difference now is the price. Yup, they decided or somebody decided it would be nice to charge more per roll. Certainly not my idea of grabbing a large share of the 100 speed film market, but hey, I'm not running their show. Don't get me wrong, I really like the film, but at the new going price I'll stick with Ilford instead. One of the main reasons I liked and used the film in the first place was it's price. Now with the cost very near and in some cases even more than Ilford FP4+ it ain't worth it. JohnW

Just wait it out.

One of the foremen will make an after hours run and throw up bricks on Ebay for $20 and the factory will follow when they sell out. I really only shot this stuff because it was dirt cheap.

John Wiegerink · Jan 28, 2018

Cholentpot said:
Just wait it out.

One of the foremen will make an after hours run and throw up bricks on Ebay for $20 and the factory will follow when they sell out. I really only shot this stuff because it was dirt cheap.

That's exactly what I'm doing. JohnW

Cholentpot · Jan 28, 2018

John Wiegerink said:
That's exactly what I'm doing. JohnW

Do you remember the old price point? I think it was about $20 US for a brick of 10. My TLRs and folders have not got much use as my stock has been drying up.

John Wiegerink · Jan 28, 2018

Cholentpot said:
Do you remember the old price point? I think it was about $20 US for a brick of 10. My TLRs and folders have not got much use as my stock has been drying up.

That's about right. I bought some at around $1.88 a roll and as cheap as $1.50 a roll. Now it's close to $6.00 a roll and that's totally unacceptable according to my wallet. It's ilford for me until the GP3 price settles down. JohnW

Cholentpot · Jan 28, 2018

John Wiegerink said:
That's about right. I bought some at around $1.88 a roll and as cheap as $1.50 a roll. Now it's close to $6.00 a roll and that's totally unacceptable according to my wallet. It's ilford for me until the GP3 price settles down. JohnW

Why buy Chinese knock off for that price when Tmax is about the same price? Someone is being stupid.

philosli · Jan 29, 2018

I just ordered a few rolls from Taobao dated late 19’ about $2.70 per roll. Shipping to the US is another $1.5 for 5 rolls.

I don’t know how long it will take to arrive here. If there is no backing paper issue as reported before, this price is very attractive.

John Wiegerink · Jan 29, 2018

Cholentpot said:
Why buy Chinese knock off for that price when Tmax is about the same price? Someone is being stupid.

Yes, I agree 100%. If it had some unreal quality no other film had it would be different, but it doesn't. JohnW

mard0 · Jan 29, 2018

Cholentpot said:
Why buy Chinese knock off for that price when Tmax is about the same price? Someone is being stupid.

Because it's not cheaper than Tmax, at least not in europe. Tmax is roughly 5.50 euro a roll without shipment, a 10 pack of GP3 with shipment cost roughly 42 euro.

Peter Schrager · Jan 29, 2018

philosli said:
I just ordered a few rolls from Taobao dated late 19’ about $2.70 per roll. Shipping to the US is another $1.5 for 5 rolls.

I don’t know how long it will take to arrive here. If there is no backing paper issue as reported before, this price is very attractive.

Post some results please

Kenny Harrelson · Apr 20, 2018

I just picked up a brick of 10 rolls of this FP3 stuff off eBay, for $10.88. That's just a little over $1 American per roll! I've never found fresh film for a cheaper price.

Shanghai GP3 120 film It's back?

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