Sensia 100 differences vs Astia 100F

sharpK25 · Jul 12, 2010

Hi all,
First post on the site. I'm Down to my last K64 roll in the camera and was looking to try Sensia 100. I shot a single roll of Astia 100F and liked the colors except that shadows on a white object were rendered yellowish. Blue skies were realistic but images didn't look as sharp as K64. I don't need "the finest grained film" out there. Grain is the absolute last criteria on my mind. If I want grainless I can always shoot digital. Sharpness, good contrast and realistic/pleasing color rendition is much more important to me than grain-less images.

I'm really going to miss the Kodachrome edge "pop" and 3-D depth. Looking to what comes closest to that sharp edge contrast in K64 and was wondering if Sensia 100 might be better than Astia 100F in that respect.

I shoot commercial aircraft where blue skies turning purple (as some E6 films do) is very distracting. Provia 100F is being touted as the best alternative to K64 for shooting aircraft but from the scans I've seen it looks too "clean" (almost boring like digital). Supposedly it has very high resolution and is contrasty enough but so far I don't see anywhere near the 3-dimensional and sharp look of Kodachrome. The blue skies might tend to a slight cyan/purple so I decided Provia 100F would only be a third choice. The darker/grayer sky blues of the K film were perfect for what I shoot.

If anyone has some Sensia 100 vs Astia 100F images with contrasty edges to compare that would be great also.

many thanks in advance,
-Mario

lxdude · Jul 12, 2010

Welcome, Mario!
I've always preferred Kodachrome, and know what you mean about the sharpness and 3D look.
Interesting what you say about Provia 100. It's competent and clean and smooth and all, but somehow for me a little boring. Sort of like a Toyota Camry, which is the only car I've driven that left me comparing it to a household appliance.
I really like the 400X for what it delivers at that speed, and find it somehow more interesting and that's what I use most for shots of small aircraft in flight.

Iceberg · Jul 13, 2010

Astia 100F is the one that is boring in actual fact. Palette too pastel-ly, grain so non-existent that edge sharpness dissolves.

Sensia 100 is sharper than Astia 100F but is too warm - almost brownish - for my taste.

Provia 100F is the closest approximation to Kodachrome, more so than E100G. Blue in Provia stays blue, do not turn purple. Try pushing the film 1/3-1/2 stop if you like to mimic the denser shadows of K64. You will also get less than a 'clinical look' at that point.

sharpK25 · Jul 14, 2010

Anyone know how good is the edge crispness of the Rollei cr200? Some users here said it resembles Kodachrome in color palette.

Thanks for the suggestion lxdude, all reviews for the 400X say this film is amazing so I'm tempted to try it out sometime (and great analogy lol ) Would like to know how the 400X edge crispness compares to a ISO 100 film.

Iceberg I've heard Provia 100F compares to Kodachrome 25. I can see a vague similarity, but it clearly lacks K25 3d-effect and nice contrast. K25 used to be the film of choice for static transportation shots. Never got to use it unfortunately as i started shooting slides in 2001 right after it was discontinued and scalpers on ebay just wanted too much. If there was ever a slide with the characteristics of K25 in ISO 64 or above, that would be a hit. Nowadays there's too many slide film choices but each have MAJOR weaknesses. E6 films tend to either go too blue/purple or too yellowish, Astia is supposed to be neutral but shades tend to yellowish and edge crispness isn't there.

Anyone tried shooting Velvia 100 at ISO 80 or 64 for realistic colors and less harsh shadows? I was thinking of trying Provia 100F at these speeds so it would come out less bluish/magenta. Would that help to make it look sharper? I'm afraid Provia 100F without the color punch would be too flat and even less 3d than it already is.

Jedidiah Smith · Jul 14, 2010

Will be interesting to see what you go with. Have you tried any Velvia 100F? It's got more of a true color palette than the other Velvias, and although I only ever shot a couple rolls of it, I've even seen examples of it used as a portrait film and the shots looked very nice. At any rate, Velvia, even a toned down version like 100F will give your shot more character and "perceived sharpness" than Provia or (especially) Astia.

On a side note, what do you not like about E100G? Skies are gorgeous with that film to my eye...shooting a lot of aircraft, it would seem to be a decent option to me, but maybe there is something specifically that you don't like about it?
Best of luck in you selection!

sharpK25 · Jul 14, 2010

Kodachrome edges stand out more as if cut by a razor:

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Airborne-Express/NAMC-YS-11A-205/1587147/L/
http://www.airliners.net/photo/Piedmont-Airlines/Boeing-737-301/1231498/L/

Provia 100F has good punchy colors but does not emphasize edges. Scans don't have much 3D depth and look somewhat similar to digital to me.

http://www.airliners.net/photo/Alaska-Airlines/Boeing-737-990/1707471/L/
http://www.airliners.net/photo/American-Airlines/Boeing-737-823/1714201/L/

sharpK25 · Jul 14, 2010

Jedidiah, I did try a test roll of E100GX a few years ago. Colors were rendered perfectly, but the film didn't really look as sharp as the K64 I was shooting. Contrast was also a bit weak. From what I hear E100G is even less sharp. If E100GX was still around I'd shoot a roll and compare it to the Astia 100F.

lxdude · Jul 14, 2010

sharpK25 said:
Would like to know how the 400X edge crispness compares to a ISO 100 film.

Maybe it's the increased grain (still very reasonable), but it looks crisper to me.
I saw something recently (maybe here on APUG) that said that 400X does well pushed one stop, and that E 200 does well pushed up to 2 stops, meaning both are good to ISO 800. I haven't used E 200, but I'm going to try it pushed a stop to compare it to 400X.

perkeleellinen · Jul 14, 2010

400X at ASA800 is very nice.

As for sharpness, contrasty edges, crispness, however defined; perhaps Sensia 200 or 400 may be worth a stab. They've got a nice bit of grain and I've found them to have a nice look. Probably nothing like Kodachrome, but then, nothing else is Kodachrome.

Jedidiah Smith · Jul 14, 2010

OK, I see what you're looking for now. Definitely give that Velvia 100F a try - even just one roll - and see if it has more of the contrast and sharpness you're looking for. The colors won't go all wonky in the skies on you (well, at least not like the original Velvia). You may even try rating 1/2 the roll at about ISO 80 and see if that gives you the deeper shadows and more Kodachrome style look.

I think Astia and Provia are too "smooth" for what you're after. And by the way, I did always find it interesting how a Kodachrome slide looked almost like the emulsion was laid down in "3D" on the back of the slide...much different looking than any E6 emulsion. If you turn it about 30 degrees and look at it with the light bouncing off it, you know what I'm talking about. Not sure if any "smooth" E6 emulsion is going to do that for you or not.

lxdude · Jul 14, 2010

As I understand it, one reason for the edge sharpness of Kodachrome is that the layers are significantly thinner than other emulsions. So, the edge transitions are literally sharper.

sharpK25 · Jul 15, 2010

I was thinking of trying Sensia 100 @ ISO 125. Might make it more bluish to counter the ugly yellowish/brownish look, also increase contrast. Hopefully there's no loss in sharpness by doing this!!! But there could be...

Then Velvia 100 or F at 80 or 64. I read Velvia F is less warm and doesn't look as nice as Velvia 100. In this case I hope the slides won't come out too overexposed. Most Velvia shooters are nature shooters who want the crazy saturation, so I haven't found any examples of how it could look at ISO 64 or 80. People used to shoot aircraft with old Velvia rated at 40 or even 32. Might have to waste a roll & development costs just to see if this works for Velvia 100.

400X would definitely save the day in awful weather or if it's bright and a huge cloud parks itself to block the sun on the subject. Shots like that are ruined on slower films.

ps: yes I've noticed that 'carving' on the other side of K slides, didn't know if that was unique to them.

sharpK25 · Jul 15, 2010

Btw, interesting to note how the Fuji site pushes Sensia 100 as being sharper than Provia 100F yet their corresponding data sheets say otherwise:

Sensia 100
Chart Contrast 1.6 : 1 ............ 55 lines/mm
Chart Contrast 1000 : 1 .......... 135 lines/mm

Provia 100F
Chart Contrast 1.6 : 1 ................... 60 lines/mm
Chart Contrast 1000 : 1 ................. 140 lines/mm

Velvia is even higher 80 and 160 lines/mm

andrewkirkby · Jul 15, 2010

I am really beginning to love Provia 100F. It is a great film and will be my main film for use once i run out of Kodachrome. E100VS is another one i love.

My advice would be to shoot any of these films at ASA 125 (120 on my Gossen Digipro F)
This brings out the colour just that little bit more.

Read Galen Rowell's book "Mountain Light" if you want to read about rating film differently. This got me into shooting films 1/3 of a stop underexposed. It is generally always better. I prefer Velvia (50) rated at box speed though as it tends to have higher contrast and the shadows go black a bit easier.

I always shoot Kodachrome 64 at 80 and my freshest K25 at 32. The colour is just that little bit richer and the feel is more true to the look that Kodachrome should have.

Test a couple of rolls, setting the meter at 1/3 stop intervals and write this down, do a tally of what works best in which conditions and then use that as your guide.

Jedidiah Smith · Jul 15, 2010

Andrew is correct, and I feel stupid now. That's what I meant to suggest, under-exposing by a little, so rate the Velvia 100 @ 125 or so. In my post above I said "80" which would be the WRONG way! Doh!

Steve Roberts · Jul 15, 2010

I like the colour rendition of Sensia 100 and I have to say that I've never been aware of the yellow/brownish appearance that has been mentioned. As ever with anything you don't process yourself, you're in the hands of others and I wonder whether the processing could be the cause of this. I'm in the UK and buy my Sensia process-paid, so it goes to the designated FujiFilm lab in Leeds, which (one would hope) would be the best place for it!
Best wishes,
Steve

lilserenity · Jul 15, 2010

Kodak Elitechrome 100, smidge warmer than E100G (probably like the old E100GX), 35mm only mind but a really fantastic slide film.

There is also Elitechrome 100 Extra Colour but that's more like E100VS, great film but not like Kodachrome.

There is also Elitechrome 200. I love Elitechrome, great stuff.

Iceberg · Jul 15, 2010

The scans of Provia 100F provided by the OP hardly does the film justice. K25 is sharper than Provia 100F, but Provia 100F is hardly not sharp!

Three pictures to back up my claims:
Dead Link Removed
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More images Dead Link Removed.

Iceberg · Jul 15, 2010

Lilserenity, that is simply a wonderful capture. I've always looked down upon Elitechrome, perhaps I should give the film a revisit. How are you finding it with people and portraits?

lilserenity said:
Kodak Elitechrome 100, smidge warmer than E100G (probably like the old E100GX), 35mm only mind but a really fantastic slide film.

There is also Elitechrome 100 Extra Colour but that's more like E100VS, great film but not like Kodachrome.

There is also Elitechrome 200. I love Elitechrome, great stuff.

Iceberg · Jul 15, 2010

In the interest of fair play, here is a Kodachrome 25 Dead Link Removed. Not as sharp as some provided by the OP, but I was working under less-than-ideal conditions.

Sensia 100 differences vs Astia 100F

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