selling a 1928 Speed Graphic w/ Zeiss - many questions!

[hokeypix]

Hi all. Newbie here. I picked up a Speed Graphic camera in my travels and wish to sell it, but I want to make sure I do it right. I'll admit up front I know very little about the mechanics of vintage cameras so even though it LOOKS to be in very good condition, I'm not sure what I'm looking at.

From the research I did online I believe it's a "pre-anniversary" model (is that from 1928?), and what I also found interesting is that it has a Zeiss lens. The leatherette piece covering the back has come off (and can be re-glued) but other than that I can see no immediate issues.

I'll post some photos, and would love any input from the experts out there on its value, the best place to sell it to get the best price (I assume ebay, though I could also sell it privately), and what I ought to check as far as condition. Are people comfortable buying these "as is" and knowing they may need to do some repairs? (assuming the photos are thorough). Obviously I can't test it out.

Also, what might this bring? It seems that $300 - 450 seems average on ebay, but I wonder if the Zeiss lens adds to the value? Thanks so much.

 

[PBrooks]

I'm sorry but that camera need major work. With the lens I would say 50-75 maybe a little more for parts.

 

[hokeypix]

Can you please be more specific? What "work" does it need?

 

[PBrooks]

Well, first all the rust. Second, the bed rail looks warped. It may not be but looks that way in the pics. People normally buy these for a working focal plane shutter. Does it work, I am just guessing here but the inner workings are probably as rusted as the handle loops. I does look like a good candidate for a restoration and some people love to do that.

 

[Venchka]

In 2006 I paid $100 for a fully functional 1953 Pacemaker Speed Graphic, original Kodak Ektar lens, holders, flash from the original purchaser.

I think $50 for your camera would be high. It's easy to change lenses. This lens may or may not be original. Where did you get your price estimate? What you have is an old beater camera. Does it even work? Have you used it to make a photograph?

After further thought, if the shutter works and the lens is in decent condition, it may be worth more by itself.

 

[Dave Pritchard]

You can always put it up for auction and see what it brings. You will, perhaps, be asked some questions. Like:

Does the focal plane shutter works? Are the speeds accurate?
Does the the shutter behind the lens work?
Are there light leaks in the bellows?

eB*y: Buying is easy. Selling is work.

 

[hokeypix]

This is 2009, not 2006. The camera is from 1928, not 1953. The lens is by Zeiss, not Kodak. I don't see how one can make across-the-board comparisons when discussing two such different models, years and selling markets. The estimates I quoted came - as I had already stated - from recent completed auctions on ebay (with non-Zeiss lenses).

I believe I asked in my first question what sort of steps one can take to check condition for a potential buyer. What I have learned so far from sharing on this board is that, based on a couple of photos, my camera is a "beater," good only for parts, and probably doesn't even work.

 

[domaz]

The lens alone is worth $50 or more. The focal plane shutter is the real key- if that doesn't work you would be better off selling the lens and camera alone.

 

[Dave Pritchard]

...
I believe I asked in my first question what sort of steps one can take to check condition for a potential buyer.
...

If we stick to the practical stuff, you will need to learn to operate the slightly goofy mechanism of the focal plane shutter. First, turn the knob on the right side, near the bottom. The number in the window should change from 0 to 6. Try to set it to 6. Wind the upper knob (the one with wings) counter-clockwise, against spring pressure. The letter in the window below it should change from 0 to T, then A, B, C, D; every time it clicks. Pull the lever underneath back. You should hear the focal plane shutter move briskly as you operate the lever.

I have a pre-Anniversary Speed Graphic here which does not work. I took it apart to find that the focal plane shutter had been cut out entirely. The winding lever moved very freely. The other two I have do work, but sound rough on operation. I have not taken them apart yet.

 

[mopar_guy]

The most desirable Speed Graphics as USER cameras are the Pacemaker Speed Graphics with Graflok Back. Next are Anniversary Speed Graphics. Any Pre-Anniversary Speed Graphic is considered to be more of a collector camera rather than a user. There are still a lot of these Pre Anniversary cameras around, so yours is really not that rare. If you happen across a Military model, it would be more valuable.

Another point that has not been mentioned is that 3 1/4 x 4 1/4 cameras are considered to be less valuable than 4x5. If you happen across a 5x7 Speed Graphic, It could be somewhat more valuable. I would agree that the auction value of this camera as around $50-75.

 

[PBrooks]

Hokeypix, I meant no disrespect in any of my post. I was just responding so that you would not be shocked if you put it on the auction. It might be of use to check out graflex.org for more information.

 

[Barry S]

Speed Graphics vary quite a bit in value depending on the model, age, condition and accessories. A recent comparable pre-anniversary (with Zeiss lens) went for $56 on ebay (auction #320445141337). You might get a bit more, but maybe you'd be happier keeping it and using it.

 

[k_jupiter]

First off, it is a 3.25x 4.25 camera. It has a lot less value than a 4x5. That is a nice lens on it but uncoated.

50 to 75 bucks. Makes a nice mantle piece.

tim in san jose

 

[mikebarger]

Will that lens cover 4x5?

Mike

 

[Steve Smith]

Will that lens cover 4x5?

I have one which does with just a bit of movement. In theory and according to the specifications, it shouldn't and was usually supplied with european 6x12cm plate cameras (which is where mine came from).

I think it is more of a sharpness in the corners issue rather than light fall off though.


Steve.

 

[Ian Grant]

As Steve says the lens covers 5x4 but sharpness is poor at the edges and corners until f16 and at it's best at f22, which Zeiss stated was the optimum aperture. There's no discernible light fall off at the corners and the lens (if in good condition) is capable of surprisingly high quality if used carefully.

The shutter on that model is very easy to repair (I over-hauled & repaired one last year) and there's even patterns etc for making new curtains available online.

The shutter itself is worth at least $50 as they are very robust & easy to get repaired, more reliable than Copal's, $300 is perhaps a bit optimistic but if it's all functioning then it's possible you could get in excess of $200.

In the UK that lens alone is often listed at $1800-$200 by one Ebay store, not sure if they ever sell though

Ian

 

[Fotoguy20d]

In the UK that lens alone is often listed at $1800-$200 by one Ebay store, not sure if they ever sell though

I'd be pretty sure they don't. I sold a pair of these lens elements via ebay to someone in the UK for around $20 earlier this year (and that seems to be the typical amount). But, as was pointed out, the shutter, in good condition would probably fetch $30-50.

Dan

 

[Ian Grant]

Dan, I certainly wouldn't pay $180+ for a pre War 135mm Tessar, but they are regularly listed by more than one Ebay store for £120+ in the UK and I'd guess there's the occasional gullible buyer, one seller regularly has 90mm f6.8 Anguloms for £230-£260 (very approx $360-$400). If people see enough lenses like these listed they might assume that's fair prices when in fact reputable UK dealers sell Tessar's and Angulon's for well under half those prices.

One seller had 7 90mm Angulon's in that price range a couple of months ago.

Ian

 

[hokeypix]

Thanks for the info, Dave. I followed your instructions and it did all that you suggested, quite smoothly. I could hear the shutter open at different speeds. Now that it's set on 6, how do I set it back, btw? Are there any other tests I ought to do? Btw, it also came with three extra backs - two look fairly modern, and one antique.

 

[mhcfires]

I have a 3x4 Speed almost identical to yours. I paid $45 for it. The FP shutter was a bit sticky, I cleaned it up and lubed it, it seems to be working ok now. I actually have three Speeds, all pre-Anniversary. They all work, I have a lot of fun shooting them. I paid $70 for my 4x5, $90 for the 2x3. You should get some 3x4 film from Freestyle and have a go at it. BTW, my 3x4 has the same CZJ Tessar lens.

 

[hokeypix]

So is is a 3x4, then? If I were still shooting, I'd keep it, but I stopped shooting a while ago (my work is in a show that just opened at the Brooklyn Museum..) : )

I just opened the bellows up all the way and straightened out the bed until it clicked down (hadn't done that before - oops). I'm just surprised that a nice large format camera from 1928 would sell for so little. I mean, I paid five dollars for it, but I didn't assume that's what it sells for on the open market.

 

[mikebarger]

Supply and demand....sounds like there are a lot of them available, plus the small film size doesn't help.

Mike

 

[k_jupiter]

Let me repeat, that is one heck of a nice lens for B&W. I have one on a 1926 Zeiss Trona and it is sharp as a tack, even at f8-f11. @f16-f22, you will have problems telling it from any other really good lens.

But it is 3x4 and that will keep the market value down.

Shoot it, it's a nice format.

tim in san jose