Selenium and warm tone

ldh · Dec 14, 2004

Dobry rano,
I have a selection of my work (from Siberia) that I am beginning to print this winter...I will be conducting tests soon to choose an appropriate paper for this work...I would like a decidedly warm tone, but not to the point of looking sepia or brown. I would also like to selenium tone the prints but I've had difficulty in the past with warm tone papers really going crazy with selenium and changing color completely or becoming just too brown. I dont have much experience with warmtone papers so any suggestions heading in to my trials would be (as usual) much appreciated...oh I should say that I would prefer a glossy surface but wouldnt reject the possibility of going with a matte surface...any experience with the new Oriental Warmtone?...

zatim ahoj...

bozgoren · Dec 14, 2004

I suggest Forte Polywarmtone PW14 paper with Ansco 130 developer 1:1, TF3 fixer and Kodak Selenium Toner 1:19 for 7 minutes all with distilled water. Air dried face down on screens. This is what I have been using for the last 3 years and I am very pleased with the tone I get. Season greetings. Bulent

titrisol · Dec 14, 2004

Give AGFA MCC a try
It is neutral but reacts to a nice reddish-gray in selenium

Wally H · Dec 14, 2004

Another technique for achieving a warm tone that is slight is to use a two step bleach process (such as Kodak's Sepia system) but do not bleach out the print... only bleach out until the detail in the hightlights or lightes area is gone the continue on as normal. I use this technique to give me a bit of warmth in the light areas, but not to affect (at least viisually) the blaks and darkest tones... messing about with how fare you bleach will give one different results... (I use a normal paper in most cases for this, Ilford's MG FB 1.K ... I've tried the process on the warmtone Ilford papers but it goes too warm / sepia for my purpose)...

SamG · Dec 14, 2004

My favorite warm paper is Ilford Warmtone. I also use glossy. With selenium toning, I tend to use a rather concentrated solution KRST mixed about 1:4, also kept on the warm side (about 80+degreen F). The blacks and grays deepen, then the darker tones start taking on a reddish brown, then the print eventually turns a warm brown. I usually like the effect of split toning. I try to pull the print when the blacks and dark grays turn the reddish brown. The mid and light tone retain their properties. Even at the concentration I am using, the transition of colors may take 5 min or so, allowing the print to be pulled at any point. I think it is a great looking paper even untoned.
Sam

Deckled Edge · Dec 15, 2004

titrisol said:
Give AGFA MCC a try
It is neutral but reacts to a nice reddish-gray in selenium

I too have used this combination very successfully, but it may be more than ldh wants, according to his post. It can go to the red, if you let it.

I often will tone for only 2-1/2 minutes in 1:9 KRST. This gives INCOMPLETE Selenium protection, but it's better that none for those who don't want a noticeable color shift.

ldh, if warm is what you want, without brown or sepia, try to get it with your developer, not your paper. That way you can use your usual paper and vary the tone with developer, selenium toning for permanence, without color shift.

j.green · Dec 16, 2004

Another fiber paper that reacts with a warm brownish tone in selenium is Emaks K888. It reacts fast in selenium so the time in toner is usually just 1-3 minutes, toner diluted 1+9. If you give it just a minute it will give you a slight hint of purpurish but longer time will warm it up.

titrisol · Dec 16, 2004

I prefer to let it tone for 10 miniutes or so in Paterson Selenium 1+4
I think it's toned to completion, or very close since the highlights get some color shift.

Deckled Edge said:
I too have used this combination very successfully, but it may be more than ldh wants, according to his post. It can go to the red, if you let it.

I often will tone for only 2-1/2 minutes in 1:9 KRST. This gives INCOMPLETE Selenium protection, but it's better that none for those who don't want a noticeable color shift.

ldh, if warm is what you want, without brown or sepia, try to get it with your developer, not your paper. That way you can use your usual paper and vary the tone with developer, selenium toning for permanence, without color shift.

Kate Mocak · Dec 16, 2004

My favourite warmtone paper is Fomatone MG Classic (comes with various surfaces: glossy, matt, chamois) developed in either Fomatone H or Fomatone PW. If you tone it in selenium, work with a very diluted solution (e.g. 1:19) and don't let it unattended - it does turn chocolate brown if you don't take it out soon enough. 5 minutes worked well for me (it took 30 minutes to become very warm, reddish brown).

For toning I can also recommend thiocarbamide where you can control the 'color' by mixing different ratios of thiocarbamide and sodium hydroxide. I usually tone Fomabrom papers. (I can send you a formula if you like.)

Mark Noble · Dec 16, 2004

You might try Berggger prestige in selenium - it will become quite warm surprised me, nice tone -- been playing with a few papers since Mother discontinued Polymax in larger size

Deckled Edge · Dec 16, 2004

Mark Noble said:
You might try Berggger prestige in selenium - it will become quite warm surprised me, nice tone -- been playing with a few papers since Mother discontinued Polymax in larger size

Which larger sizes? I have been printing on 11x14 and have an order in for 16x20, which I cut for 7x17 contact prints.

In several publications, Mother recommends KRST at fairly high dilutions, which I have never tried. Ansel said "1:9" so that's what I've done, but Mother says 1:40 is an option. See below.

Mark Noble · Dec 17, 2004

40" rolls and even 20X24

Maine-iac · Dec 20, 2004

ldh said:
Dobry rano,
I have a selection of my work (from Siberia) that I am beginning to print this winter...I will be conducting tests soon to choose an appropriate paper for this work...I would like a decidedly warm tone, but not to the point of looking sepia or brown. I would also like to selenium tone the prints but I've had difficulty in the past with warm tone papers really going crazy with selenium and changing color completely or becoming just too brown. I dont have much experience with warmtone papers so any suggestions heading in to my trials would be (as usual) much appreciated...oh I should say that I would prefer a glossy surface but wouldnt reject the possibility of going with a matte surface...any experience with the new Oriental Warmtone?...

zatim ahoj...

Do you really want the selenium-toned look, or are you primarily interested in the selenium for archival processes. That will make a difference in the paper you choose. If you only want a very dilute selenium solution (roughly 1:64 in Permawash or other washing aid) of the purposes of archival preservation, then perhaps one of the warmtone papers like Ilford or Forte would suit. If you really want the selenium to change the print color, then I'd go with Agfa MCC in whatever dilution of selenium works best for you.

Larry

Neal · Dec 20, 2004

Dear Zatim,

If you want to avoid color change, consider using a product called "Sistan" from Agfa for increasing archival permanence.

Neal Wydra

Selenium and warm tone

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