Sally Mann

removedacct1 · Jun 4, 2015

Children play at being adults. It's not new and it's nothing scandalous. It's only a "problem" in the minds of some adults. And yes, it was just a candy cigarette.

You know, I had toy guns when I was a child, and all that was was role play silliness. Reading too much into it is just going to ruin your day and sully your thinking.

blansky · Jun 4, 2015

cliveh said:
Why do you need to meet her? Or know about her? Look at the images.

Well don't hide. Tell us what you think.

Lee Rust · Jun 5, 2015

When you get a little further you'll read that she would definitely do it all over again. That whole affair was difficult for the family and for her but she'd do it again.

Yes, I eventually reached the paragraph where she asserts that she would do it all again. However, I got the impression that while Sally might be confident that she would MAKE the photos again, she would have serious reservations about PUBLISHING them again. I took nude bathtub and summer afternoon sprinkler pictures of my own kids during those same years, but would never have printed them in a book.

Then I read the chapters that describe her mother's family history!

warden · Jun 5, 2015

Lee Rust said:
Then I read the chapters that describe her mother's family history!

What a great memoir, huh? So many great stories. In one of the reviews of the book it was said that stories happen to those that can tell them, and that's certainly true of Mann, who is a gifted writer.

You would think that after all this time people would want to talk about her other excellent bodies of work, but that project from the '80s sticks like glue. Now that's a good reason to not publish the pictures of the kids: it tends to hijack and diminish the rest of your career.

blansky · Jun 5, 2015

jawarden said:
What a great memoir, huh? So many great stories. In one of the reviews of the book it was said that stories happen to those that can tell them, and that's certainly true of Mann, who is a gifted writer.

You would think that after all this time people would want to talk about her other excellent bodies of work, but that project from the '80s sticks like glue. Now that's a good reason to not publish the pictures of the kids: it tends to hijack and diminish the rest of your career.

While I agree, but we are usually defined by what made us famous.

Captain Kirk, Spock, In Cold Blood, Farrah Faucett poster, Magnum PI, Gilligan, the Captain, etc etc etc

Just listed iconic things/people that jumped to my mind that made someone a household name and who were never able to really escape from it. Tons of examples but these just hit me.

And unless we do something else that surpasses that, we are forever bound to it. Rightly or wrongly, for better or worse.

MattKing · Jun 5, 2015

blansky said:
While I agree, but we are usually defined by what made us famous.

Captain Kirk, Spock, In Cold Blood, Farrah Faucett poster, Magnum PI, Gilligan, the Captain, etc etc etc

Just listed iconic things/people that jumped to my mind that made someone a household name and who were never able to really escape from it. Tons of examples but these just hit me.

And unless we do something else that surpasses that, we are forever bound to it. Rightly or wrongly, for better or worse.

But what about Maynard G. Krebs?

Or should I be posting this in the nostalgia thread?

blansky · Jun 5, 2015

MattKing said:
But what about Maynard G. Krebs?

Or should I be posting this in the nostalgia thread?

Wow, that does go back.

cliveh · Jun 5, 2015

blansky said:
Well don't hide. Tell us what you think.

Im not hiding and see my original post. But you haven't answered my question - Why do you need to meet her? Or know about her, to comment on the images?

pdeeh · Jun 5, 2015

Perhaps you should write a stern letter to the Daily Telegraph about her, clive.

Or the Daily Mail ... probably better suited, come to think about it.

cliveh · Jun 5, 2015

pdeeh said:
Perhaps you should write a stern letter to the Daily Telegraph about her, clive.

Or the Daily Mail ... probably better suited, come to think about it.

Like Mr angry from Cornwall?

blansky · Jun 5, 2015

cliveh said:
I’m not hiding and see my original post. But you haven't answered my question - Why do you need to meet her? Or know about her, to comment on the images?

I don't need to meet her. And I comment on her images. But to know her intent, I'd probably need to talk to her.

But I don't have any problem with them. So her motives aren't a real concern to me.

And you're inferring you have issues with them. So what is your opinion of them.

SuzanneR · Jun 5, 2015

cliveh said:
I cant help thinking that anyone who photographs their own children half naked and wearing make-up + doing adult activities like smoking is a totally irresponsible and does not have any place in showing these images as photographic art.

It's pretty clearly a candy cigarette in that picture, so she doesn't show her kids smoking. That picture reminds me how I used to "pretend to smoke" as a kid while really just enjoying some candy. When her children are nude in her pictures, they generally are just nude, and those pictures strike me as classically beautiful figures in nature. When she employs props in her pictures, the children tend not to be nude, but she might show, say, her two daughters dressing up, something a lot of young girls will play at, and she crafted beautiful large format pictures of typical childhood play. Her view of childhood is filtered through an adult sensibility, to be sure, but I'm not sure she was necessarily an irresponsible parent with her kids, and I certainly think her work is art.

Of course, not every viewer is going to like her pictures, to be sure, but too much of the criticism is aimed at her parenting, not her photographs.

Old-N-Feeble · Jun 5, 2015

SuzanneR said:
It's pretty clearly a candy cigarette in that picture, so she doesn't show her kids smoking. That picture reminds me how I used to "pretend to smoke" as a kid while really just enjoying some candy. When her children are nude in her pictures, they generally are just nude, and those pictures strike me as classically beautiful figures in nature. When she employs props in her pictures, the children tend not to be nude, but she might show, say, her two daughters dressing up, something a lot of young girls will play at, and she crafted beautiful large format pictures of typical childhood play. Her view of childhood is filtered through an adult sensibility, to be sure, but I'm not sure she was necessarily an irresponsible parent with her kids, and I certainly think her work is art.

Of course, not every viewer is going to like her pictures, to be sure, but too much of the criticism is aimed at her parenting, not her photographs.

I agree... but sick minds alter the truth. I'm certain that Sally Mann didn't expect such perversion of her images. It's really quite sad, if you think about it. To be honest, I doubt such societal innocence ever really existed. What we lack these days is extremely harsh punishment of horrible transgressions. People who hurt children should be 'removed' from the gene pool.

Richard S. (rich815) · Jun 5, 2015

(Delete)

Changed my mind. I don't want to wade into this.

Bill Burk · Jun 6, 2015

I read all I could of "Hold Still" online, my local bookstore didn't have anything by her so I couldn't read it all.

But this passage struck me:

There is nothing better than the thrill of holding a great negative, wet with fixer, up to the light.
And, here's the important thing: it doesn't even have to be a great negative.
You get the same thrill with any negative;
with art, as someone once said, most of what you have to do is show up.

RalphLambrecht · Jun 24, 2015

DREW WILEY said:
I watched most of the Rose interview, at least until he drifted off into the predictable irrelevant film vs digi questions. She's a brilliant photographer and printmaker, and apparently has some digs with elbow room, but over the years I can't help but shake my head and say to
myself concerning people who do this kind of work with their kids, "what the hell were they thinking?" There are sickos and pyschos everywhere these days, urban and rural, and the idea of plastering one's kids into public view in this manner seems extremely irresponsible, "free spirit" artist or not.

what a nonsense.How can you blame her for the sickos?Her work of her kids is absolutely brilliant!

doughowk · Jun 25, 2015

Her book is excellent. Along with the Charley Rose interview, it helps to understand where she is coming from in her photography. I may not appreciate some of her subject matter (ie, What Remains), or some of her printing techniques (mixture of DE, varnish & silver emulsion); but one can appreciate her as a Southern writer/photographer.
I was disappointed with the Teri Gross interview of her on NPR.

Xmas · Jun 25, 2015

SuzanneR said:
It's pretty clearly a candy cigarette in that picture, so she doesn't show her kids smoking. That picture reminds me how I used to "pretend to smoke" as a kid while really just enjoying some candy. When her children are nude in her pictures, they generally are just nude, and those pictures strike me as classically beautiful figures in nature. When she employs props in her pictures, the children tend not to be nude, but she might show, say, her two daughters dressing up, something a lot of young girls will play at, and she crafted beautiful large format pictures of typical childhood play. Her view of childhood is filtered through an adult sensibility, to be sure, but I'm not sure she was necessarily an irresponsible parent with her kids, and I certainly think her work is art.

Of course, not every viewer is going to like her pictures, to be sure, but too much of the criticism is aimed at her parenting, not her photographs.

I don't see any reason for criticism, as a parent, and I do like the photos and technical skill.
Be useful if you locked the thread.

warden · Jun 25, 2015

doughowk said:
I was disappointed with the Teri Gross interview of her on NPR.

I agree. Gross wasted time belaboring the controversy about the photographs of her kids, when there was a wealth of more interesting stuff to talk about from the book.

removedacct1 · Jun 25, 2015

jawarden said:
I agree. Gross wasted time belaboring the controversy about the photographs of her kids, when there was a wealth of more interesting stuff to talk about from the book.

And Sally was obviously getting annoyed to have to linger on certain topics as Terry went on and on about the controversial photos of Sally's kids. One star, Terry. One of your weakest interviews.

Bill Burk · Jun 25, 2015

doughowk said:
Her book is excellent. ... it helps to understand where she is coming from in her photography.... but one can appreciate her as a Southern writer/photographer.
...

"Hold Still" is excellent. She also provides words of encouragement that I can appreciate as I think about my own photography.

Peter Schrager · Jun 25, 2015

Terry Gross is Gross. Whenever she's on I immediately shut it off. Egos abound with that woman.
best, peter

doughowk · Jun 26, 2015

To see what someone reads is instructive as to understanding who they are:
Sally Mann's reading list

Richard Man · Jul 4, 2015

Whenever Terri Gross comes on, I crank it up louder.

Bill Burk · Jul 4, 2015

Danielkgreen said:
Mann graduated from The Putney School in 1969... She took up photography at Putney, where, she claims, her motive was to be alone in the darkroom with her boyfriend.... Her father encouraged her interest in photography...

p.435 Hold Still ..."When my father casually handed me his travel-scarred Leica in January 1969, I knew almost nothing about photography"....

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