Rolleiflex coatings over time

Diffraction · Oct 13, 2021

Hey all,

Since this forum loves Rolleiflexes, I thought I'd chime in with something I'm wondering about!

I really like my Rolleiflex 3.5A (aka MX, aka K4A, probably made around 1951). It has a Zeiss-Opton Tessar T, which I've found to be sharp from f5.6, and I like the contrast and rendering. My one complaint is that it is prone to flaring in brighter circumstances. A lens hood helps but doesn't completely eliminate this, as far as I can tell so far.

Now this is of course something I can manage, and it's not the end of the world. But it did make me wonder whether a more recent Rolleiflex would fare better. As far as I can tell, my 3.5A should already have a single coating, and multi-coating wasn't introduced to the Rolleiflexes until much later, with the 2.8GX. But even among single coatings, perhaps progress was made over the years? Essentially I'd be curious whether e.g. a 3.5F or 2.8F from the 70s, say, is likely to be more flare-resistant than my old 50s one.

Curious to hear any experiences you've had!

Down Under · Oct 14, 2021

Diffraction said:
...it is prone to flaring in brighter circumstances. A lens hood helps but doesn't completely eliminate this, as far as I can tell so far. ... multi-coating wasn't introduced to the Rolleiflexes until much later, with the 2.8GX.

You answered your own question with the comment you made. Per above.

However, AFAIK Rollei TLRs had multi-coating as far back as the late 1950s. Apparently my Rolleiflex Ts (black bodies, so 1960s) and my Rolleicord Vb (mid 60s) all have it. My 3.5E2 dates to 1961, so it too may have it, but I've not been able to confirm this via my collection of Rollei books.

Obviously the older Rolleis (Automats, early 2.8s, 1950s 3.5F) most likely are only front element coated.

As you wrote, a lens good will reduce or even entirely eliminate the flare problem.

Basically, any lens, however coated, usually flares if one aims it directly into the sun. This may be your problem.

The 2,8GX is a fine camera (I've used one) if you can afford it. Alas, I can't. A few months ago a badly worn one came up for sale in Melbourne for AUD$2000+ - I personally would not deal with the shop, but my point is that it's the first I've seen offered for sale here in Australia in a small eternity.

flavio81 · Oct 14, 2021

ozmoose said:
However, AFAIK Rollei TLRs had multi-coating as far back as the late 1950s. Apparently my Rolleiflex Ts (black bodies, so 1960s) and my Rolleicord Vb (mid 60s) all have it.
y.

Manufacturers used double-layer-coating on some high quality lenses at least since the early 60s. Perhaps some triple-coatings too. Minolta was famous for that, they had the "achromatic" coating, which was dual-layer, since early on.

When "multicoating" was all the rage, it used to refer to more than 3 layers.

Note that a lens could be single-coated but with each surface sporting a different color. That's not multicoating.

shutterfinger · Oct 14, 2021

I think research on Schneider and Zeiss lens coatings will come closer to giving you the answer you seek as those are the two lens manufacturers lens used in Rollei cameras. Kodak started soft coating internal elements in the early/mid 1930's.

JensH · Oct 14, 2021

Hi,

if i remember it correctly, Prochnow stated the introduction of multicoating with the "white face" models in the 1970s.

Jens

flavio81 · Oct 14, 2021

Jens Hallfeldt said:
Hi,

if i remember it correctly, Prochnow stated the introduction of multicoating with the "white face" models in the 1970s.

Jens

Oh my god... I sold my white face 4 months ago!!

shutterfinger · Oct 14, 2021

Old Gregg, how fast was that train going when you stepped in front of it?

gone · Oct 14, 2021

Make sure your lens is very clean, as any haze will magnify flare issues like you would not believe. W/ a good hood you shouldn't get flare issues, even w/ an uncoated lens. Mine always had a Y fltr and a hood, so maybe the two combined helped.

Most lenses will flare if direct sun is in the frame, but after a while you know where it will be a problem and change the viewpoint a little. Shooting w/ sun in the frame, subject lighting is probably going to be poor anyway, unless that "look" is what someone's after. I've never managed it, but some photographers have caught the sun just right behind the model, giving a localized flare around the subject's head.

ic-racer · Oct 14, 2021

Dirty lens probably.

Kodachromeguy · Oct 15, 2021

Jens Hallfeldt said:
Hi,

if i remember it correctly, Prochnow stated the introduction of multicoating with the "white face" models in the 1970s.

Jens

Pentax brilliantly advertised the multi-coating on their Takumar lenses in the 1972-1973 era. It was a significant advance, especially for complicated multi-element lenses. But other companies had been already been experimenting with complex coatings for several years. I remember reading that Leitz used the most effective coating on each element as needed, but did not necessarily "multi-coat" every element. But thanks to Pentax's marketing campaign, soon most companies had to claim their lenses were multi-coated as well. Zeiss did this with the name T*, Schneider used "MC" on their large format lenses, and Fuji used "EBC." My Olympus-OM lenses are multi-coated but do not have a designation.

Diffraction · Oct 15, 2021

Thanks all for the info so far! The issues I am seeing are certainly not just visible when pointing directly at the sun. Here are two examples:

Specifically, take a look at the white structure on the first image, and the leaves of the tree on the second. I haven't observed these kinds of artifacts on my newer cameras, which have 70s Minolta and 80s Fujinon lenses, so I thought it might be coating related.

JPD · Oct 15, 2021

I suspect there might be a thin film of evaporated lubricants on the surfaces inside the lens. The Tessar on my Rolleiflex 3,5 B (or MX-EVS, if you prefer) is very sharp and contrasty. The Tessar has only six glass to air surfaces so single coating should be enough and comparable to lenses with more glass to air surfaces with multi coating.

LittleParallelograms · Oct 20, 2021

I'm pretty sure no Rolleicord ever had multi-coated lenses. Schneider made Xenars for large format until at least the late 90s and they were still single-coated even then. The front-element coating color changed to amber in 1974 (white-face era) and stayed that way for all of the Xenars I have seen made afterward. That was not a change to multicoating, just a new formula as far as I can tell.

And I would doubt that any of the Tessars in the Rolleiflex T were also multicoated. Four element lenses can give wonderful color and contrast with only a single coating, in my experience.

Rolleiflex coatings over time

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