Rollei Retro 400S and EOS Elan (IR fogging)?

Buzz-01 · Mar 30, 2021

Hi!

Just purchased two rolls of Rollei Retro 400S and an IR720 filter to try some IR photography. Never done it before so I'm all new to this game.
I've read about the focus shift for IR and rating the film around ISO12-25-50 or so when using the filter (I'll probably bracket every shot on the first roll) so I think I've got that covered.

Now I can choose between either one of my Olympus OM cameras, or my Canon EOS100 / Elan. Both my Zuiko and my Canon lenses have the IR focus scale and my IR filter will fit both (with a step-up ring which I also have) .
So I can pick whatever I want.
I'd prefer the EOS for this as it has slower shutter speeds (omitting a cable release and counting), but it uses an IR LED in its frame counter, which will fog any true IR film.
But since the IR sensitivity of Retro 400S is so low, I wonder if it would be an issue in my case? I could simply try, but as I only have two rolls, I'd rather not waste one roll on this.
Anyone with experience? Thanks in advance!

Buzz-01 · Jun 7, 2021

Just an update from my end, as this might help others in the future.
I ended up shooting the RR400S in my OM-1, just to be on the safe side.
Obviously that went well and I found an EI between 12 and 25 to be the sweet spot for the scenes I shot in combination with my gear.

However, I just recently found a link to photonotes.org, which appears to no longer exist.
Luckily the wayback machine was of help, revealing the following information:

Notes on infrared (IR) photography and Canon EOS film cameras.
...
Fogging problems affect only high-speed infrared film.

Okay. Before I get any further, however, I should mention that I’m primarily dealing with Kodak HIE infrared film in this document. I haven’t done much experimenting with other brands (Konica, Ilford, MACO, Afga) myself, but from what I’ve heard from other people into infrared photography, only Kodak HIE (black and white print) and EIR (colour slide) films are affected by this problem. And of these two, HIE is far more affected than EIR because HIE lacks an anti-halation layer.

But if you’re interested in other types of film you’re probably best off checking yourself.

So there probably will be no issues at all when shooting Rollei Retro 400S or Rollei Infrared in the EOS100.
Might give it a try in the future, although the very slow paced workflow suits my OM-1 much better I think.

Buzz-01 · Jun 29, 2022

Finally got around to testing this myself. Thought I'd post an update here for anyone who might have the same question and stumbles upon this topic in the future.
And I now can confirm, it's safe to shoot Rollei Retro 400S (or anything similar) in a Canon EOS body with infrared frame counter. The film shows no signs of fogging whatsoever, the film rebate is perfectly clear.

Marcelo Paniagua · Jun 29, 2022

Thanks for sharing Buzz. Hoping you share your images.

Marcelo

pentaxuser · Jun 29, 2022

Useful to know your findings, Buzz-01. My impression is that these days there are no films that are defined as truly IR since Kodak stopped producing HIE

pentaxuser

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 29, 2022

There are no truly IR films. The IR films today fall in the class, hypersensitive panchromatic. Some are more hypersensitive than others, such as Rollei IR.

Paul Howell · Jun 29, 2022

I think the last true IR was made by Konica, I recall seeing some fresh for sale around 2004 or so. I don't know when Kodak stopped production. The newer films that mimic IR can be shot a standard AF lens without the IR focus adjustment on the barrel.

Andrew O'Neill · Jun 29, 2022

Paul Howell said:
I think the last true IR was made by Konica, I recall seeing some fresh for sale around 2004 or so. I don't know when Kodak stopped production. The newer films that mimic IR can be shot a standard AF lens without the IR focus adjustment on the barrel.

It wasn't a "true" infrared. I shot heaps of it in Japan in the 90's. It only went to 750nm (same as Ilford SFX). True infrared film will allow the use of an opaque IR filter, like the 87C. The current Rollei IR goes just past 800nm, making it king of the hill...but you cannot use an 87C with it. Luckily, I still have about 25 sheets left of Efke IR 8x10 which is a true infrared... and about 25 sheets of 4x5 IR film.

abruzzi · Jun 30, 2022

Paul Howell said:
I don't know when Kodak stopped production.

The rolls of HIE in my freezer expired in 2008 and I believe (though not certain) that it was the last run of the film, so I'd assume a production in ~2006?

Buzz-01 · Jul 1, 2022

Marcelo Paniagua said:
Thanks for sharing Buzz. Hoping you share your images.

Marcelo

I haven't made any wet prints of this roll yet, but here's a scan of one of the negatives:

EOS 100 - EF 28-105mm f/3.5-4.5 USM + Zomei IR720 filter @ 35mm - f/11 - 1/3sec (~ISO12)

pentaxuser said:
Useful to know your findings, Buzz-01. My impression is that these days there are no films that are defined as truly IR since Kodak stopped producing HIE

pentaxuser

Andrew O'Neill said:
There are no truly IR films. The IR films today fall in the class, hypersensitive panchromatic. Some are more hypersensitive than others, such as Rollei IR.

That's probably true. I wasn't really into black and white photography back in the day when HIE was still available fresh so it's difficult to make a comparison myself.
These days the several Rollei films, Adox HR-50 (both are some sort of Agfa Aviphot if I'm correct) and Ilford's SFX are as close as I can get, but with very nice results.

Paul Howell said:
I think the last true IR was made by Konica, I recall seeing some fresh for sale around 2004 or so. I don't know when Kodak stopped production. The newer films that mimic IR can be shot a standard AF lens without the IR focus adjustment on the barrel.

abruzzi said:
The rolls of HIE in my freezer expired in 2008 and I believe (though not certain) that it was the last run of the film, so I'd assume a production in ~2006?

According to Wikipedia, Kodak announced the discontinuation of HIE in 2007.

Andrew O'Neill · Jul 1, 2022

I have a box of 4x5 HIE expired in 1967. I had two, but used one up. After all these years, still performing well, with only about a stop of base fog. That was a true IR film, with sensitivity just past 900nm. Wood Effect was easily obtained with just a #25 filter.

Andrew O'Neill · Jul 2, 2022

...and I should add that I was a lad of four in 1967, so no, I didn't buy it then LOL! I was too much into Batman on the telly in those days!

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