Rollei Digibase CN200 - blue end to 2 rolls.

mr.datsun · Apr 19, 2016

I have had two separate 120 rolls of Rollei CN200 come back from the same lab, but processed one week apart. Both have had 3-4 frames at the beginning of the roll with a strong blue tint. The blue extends to the edges of the film. It starts deep blue at the extreme start of the film and fades out over 4 frames. My frames are 645 ratio.

One of the films had a horizontal blue streak later in the roll.

The films are from different shops. A 120 roll of Kodak processed at the same time as the second film, has no problem.

I can post a photo later when i have access to my lightbox.

railwayman3 · Apr 19, 2016

Sounds like a manufacturing/packing fault. The fact that the Kodak film was good, but the two Rollei films both showed the fault when processed at different times, seems to exclude a lab fault or handling issue on your part. Do you know if the batch numbers of the films were the same ?

richyd · Apr 19, 2016

I think you might find it is light piping that polyester base films are susceptible to. Extra care needs to be taken when loading the film to keep it well shaded from light. The Maco site used to information about this.

mr.datsun · Apr 19, 2016

Thanks for comments

Please see pictures of one film. Is this light-piping or manufacturing fault?

I will check batch number tomorrow.

I loaded indoors away from bright light. Is that good enough?

Why is the blue only at one end?

Why does one film have blue streak across in the middle of film?

I will read Maco site page.

richyd · Apr 21, 2016

Mmmm.. that doesn't look like light piping that I have seen, it seems too broad but looks like light might have leaked in at some stage but hard to say at what point. I would contact Maco with the examples.

Don Promillo · Apr 23, 2016

I have a very similiar problem with my Rollei CN 200 at the moment. My lab says it's light leaks due to camera problems, but they do not look like camera light leaks to me.

The overlap is a known feature of my camera. It tries to save film this way But the aquamarin / red clouds are a bit to "artistic" for my taste.

Nzoomed · Apr 25, 2016

This film has a polyester base and is notorious for light piping near the start of the film.
I experience this even when loading the camera in the dark, so the lab would have exposed the leader to light when unpicking the film.

I have had the same thing with my CR200 reversal film which is on the same polyester base, but will turn yellow instead of blue on the first frame or two.

I usually expect to loose the first one or two frames dues to this with this fiom, but its well worth shooting.
I have a bulk loader and have loaded some CN200 onto my rolls and have added an extra 4 exposures to take this into account.

By the way, i have not processed my first roll yet, but does anyone know why the rollei CN200 is marked as ISO200, when the datasheet for AGFA X400 is actuallyt an ISO 400 film? See datasheet here:

https://www.agfa.com/sp/global/en/binaries/AVIPHOT COLOR X400_tcm611-42589.pdf

Arctic amateur · Apr 26, 2016

My first impulse was to say that light piping was only an issue with 135 film, where the leader is exposed to light when loading. But a loosely rolled 120 film can indeed have light leaks along the sides, between the spool and the backing paper. Usually that only leads to black marks along the edge of the film, but perhaps such light has been piped into the image area.

In addition, the bit of the film that's just under the tape at the start of the film, near where the fogging is greatest, does indeed look like it's been exposed to light. So that's a plausible source of the light that's been piped.

Sorry for your lost images.

Nzoomed · Apr 27, 2016

Its definitely light piping. My reversal film (CR200) will go orange/yellow with light piping and this appears to go blue on the negative film stock which is consistent, as cyan is the negative colour of yellow.

mr.datsun · Apr 29, 2016

I accept that it is light piping, but I loaded my most recent film in very low light – in the corner of an unlit room away from the door. I still got the first 3-4 frames blue. Can't see way to stop it.

Don Promillo · Apr 29, 2016

Yepp, same here. I now loaded the last roll of the batch into my Mamiya instead of the Kiev and waited for the night to load and unload.

The two previous Rollei CN 200 Rolls from the Kiev had both the same blue clouds on them. Let's see how the last roll looks like. I have written an email to the store I bought it from about the issue, if the film is known to be prone to light piping or anything similar, but have not received any answer so far...

mr.datsun · Apr 30, 2016

Don Promillo said:
if the film is known to be prone to light piping or anything similar, but have not received any answer so far...

I've recently seen it mentioned elsewhere as well as here.

railwayman3 · May 2, 2016

mr.datsun said:
I accept that it is light piping, but I loaded my most recent film in very low light – in the corner of an unlit room away from the door. I still got the first 3-4 frames blue. Can't see way to stop it.

I'm still of the opinion that it's a film fault. Light piping can, surely, only occur if light actually reaches some part of the film. With normal correct loading in any camera, whether using the start marks or the numbers, the start of the actual film should protected by being well within the backing paper (otherwise we'd have fogging at the start of every 120 film we use?).

mr.datsun · May 2, 2016

@railwayman3 and @rychid.

OK, I'll send the samples to Maco. Thanks for the advice.

mr.datsun · May 6, 2016

I had to use an online contact form on the maco parent company website (http://www.mahn.net/), but I have heard nothing. Is there a better way to communicate with them?

Don Promillo · May 10, 2016

New roll, different camera, same story...

I am done with Rollei for now. Back to Ilford, Fuji, Fomapan and Kodak.

Nzoomed · May 10, 2016

Don Promillo said:
New roll, different camera, same story...

View attachment 156654

View attachment 156655

I am done with Rollei for now. Back to Ilford, Fuji, Fomapan and Kodak.

Looks like the start of the roll again going by those photos.
If so light piping more than likely.
Looks like it was lab processed. Is this the case? I find the whole film needs to be handled in total darkness, even a little leader exposed is enough to cause light piping with this stuff.

Don Promillo · May 10, 2016

Yes, processed by ORWO in Germany. Usually they do not destroy other C41 or slide film material.

I think it is a combination of film handling, bad luck and a film which has a leaky paper by default.

Nzoomed · May 10, 2016

Don Promillo said:
Yes, processed by ORWO in Germany. Usually they do not destroy other C41 or slide film material.

I think it is a combination of film handling, bad luck and a film which has a leaky paper by default.

Usually film handling, all my stuff has the same problem, and its because with minilabs, they usually expose the end to the light before it goes into the machine.
I think this is highly likely what's happened to your film.

mr.datsun · May 11, 2016

I loaded my last two films in very reduced light. New one back from lab today - same thing. Can anyone recommend a lab in the UK that I can try?

Nzoomed · May 11, 2016

mr.datsun said:
I loaded my last two films in very reduced light. New one back from lab today - same thing. Can anyone recommend a lab in the UK that I can try?

Try and find a professional photographer with a darkroom who can unload the film in a jobo tank in the dark.

I can gurantee that its getting exposed to enough light when the film leader is unpicked.

mr.datsun · May 12, 2016

Nzoomed said:
Try and find a professional photographer with a darkroom who can unload the film in a jobo tank in the dark.

I can gurantee that its getting exposed to enough light when the film leader is unpicked.

Good idea, but I don't anyone who does this stuff.

The blue is always at the start of the film. When would it likely get exposed to light in lab processing? At the end or the beginning of the roll ? Unpacking is the end first.

Don Promillo · May 12, 2016

My solution is not buying this particular film any longer. Unless the shop where I have bought it from can give me an explanation or solution.
But I have not received any email back yet after mailing them the examples.

railwayman3 · May 12, 2016

mr.datsun said:
The blue is always at the start of the film. When would it likely get exposed to light in lab processing? At the end or the beginning of the roll ? Unpacking is the end first.

I just cannot see how the actual emulsion of a 120 film should ever be exposed to light during either correct unloading or unloading of the camera, or in normal lab or home processing. Never happened to me in my whole experience, (except when the backing paper came loose.....again, normal care should avoid this.)

If you get nothing constructive back from the manufacturer, or help from the lab, I'd change to a better known film....Kodak or Fuji color neg have always been reliable, IMHO.

mr.datsun · May 12, 2016

@ Don Promillo. Yes, I see your point about not buying the film. But for one thing I like it (when it works) and for another I'd like to know if it can be solved. Obviously switching is an option and I;ve just ordered to Portra 160 to try.

@railwayman3. I've contacted the lab. Still waiting for the manufacturer.

New observation. The second to last frame of my latest roll has a hard line horizontally across the middle, from the edges inwards, of the blue colouration. I've not seen or noticed this before. My gut feeling is that this mark is not consistent with light piping because it has a hard edge?

Rollei Digibase CN200 - blue end to 2 rolls.

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