Rollei Digibase C-41

hrst

Member
Joined
May 10, 2007
Messages
1,293
Location
Finland
Format
Multi Format
Yes, I've reused C-41 chemicals for 5 times with no problems in Jobo. Of course, the more you reuse, the higher the chance that the process goes outside the specifications. There are a few things to consider:

- Developer exhaustion (oxidization when it develops the film). This is counteracted by time compensation, but it can never be 100% exact as it depends at least a bit on films used, scene content (densities) etc.
- Developer dilution, if you use prewash and don't drain well enough
- Cross-contaminations. Try to keep things clean, especially the developer.
- Solutions lost in the process. You lose at least 10-20 mL every time in Jobo, so you must have some extra volume to begin with.
- Bleach buffering capacity lost due to too much developer carry-in. Try to drain as much developer as possible from the tank when you are going to reuse.
- Too much bleach carry-over in fixer. You could extend the in-between wash if you are going to reuse.
- etc.

These all apply to any C-41 chemistry from any manufacturer. I don't believe Rollei would make a big difference.

However, I find C-41 quite a robust process and even if you went a bit out of specs, it doesn't usually show up---the results look good. Many commercial labs (not real pro labs) may be more off all the time.
 

kiebee

Member
Joined
Jun 25, 2007
Messages
10
Location
Derbyshire,
Format
35mm
I'm considering buying a Digibase kit; does anybody know what the shelf life is for the chemicals once opened?
 

hrst

Member
Joined
May 10, 2007
Messages
1,293
Location
Finland
Format
Multi Format
If you can displace most of the air from the bottles, probably at least a year or more.

But, the part containing CD-4 may die in even less than 6 months if the bottle is big and cannot be squeezed. This is the case with Fuji Hunt 5 l kit. I have started storing the developer concentrate parts in a fridge, and it seems to extend the shelf life even if I cannot squeeze all the air off. This seems much easier than playing with inert gases.
 
OP
OP

steelneck

Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
173
Format
35mm
kiebee said:
I'm considering buying a Digibase kit; does anybody know what the shelf life is for the chemicals once opened?
Click to expand...

Probably very long since the bottles of concentrate is not full or even sealed at delivery.
 

fotch

Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2005
Messages
4,774
Location
SE WI- USA
Format
Multi Format
steelneck said:
Probably very long since the bottles of concentrate is not full or even sealed at delivery.
Click to expand...

However, they probably had a inert gas injected into the bottle to displace oxygen. Of course, one could also do this after opening the bottles, should help it last longer.
 

pmu

Member
Joined
Apr 18, 2005
Messages
112
Location
home
Format
35mm
Please, enlighten me. I am confused about the shelf life of Rollei digibase DEVELOPER. Maco website states:

"CAPACITY:
The color developer, working solution, example 250ml: One can at least process 5 films in a approach of 250ml. This requires a rapid processing (within 6 hours) ahead. .."

So, working solution last only for few hours and after that it's ruined?

Maco's developing instructions say that "250ml = 3-5 rolls" and in the instructions there is mentioned only this normal non-rotation method (like B&W). I have to say that I have never seen a tank that can develop 120 roll with 250 ml.

So, I have to mix 500ml of developer = about 12 rolls and develop everything within few hours if I want to use normal non-rotating method?

Or is that mentioned developer sorking solution shelf life ("6 hours") BS?

PS: Sorry, I don't know all the right terms.

Confusing.
 

srs5694

Member
Joined
May 18, 2005
Messages
2,718
Location
Woonsocket,
Format
35mm
I can't help you with your main questions; however....

pmu said:
I have to say that I have never seen a tank that can develop 120 roll with 250 ml.
Click to expand...

It's still not quite 250 ml, but check out this 120-format developing tank. I've got a couple of these and they use 260 ml of solution (the figure is stamped on the lid, and you can sort of make it out in the auction's photo); however, they can't use inversion agitation, just rotational agitation via a rotating stick. I find this very difficult to get right, so negatives developed this way often have streaks. If you're used to this type of agitation and want to save a little money on chemicals, one of these tanks might be just the thing. I believe that Jobo-style rotary tanks could also do a roll of 120 in a similar amount of solution, but I don't know the exact figures offhand. I've seen posts from people who use Paterson-style tanks in this way (rolling them on a countertop) to save chemicals, but I've never tried that.
 

fotch

Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2005
Messages
4,774
Location
SE WI- USA
Format
Multi Format
pmu, they are probably talking about 35mm. Working solutions often have very short life. If they 6 hours, I would believe them.
 

fotch

Member
Joined
Mar 16, 2005
Messages
4,774
Location
SE WI- USA
Format
Multi Format

Hey, I have one of those tanks although I never used it. I have used newer (than that one) tanks with rotation, such as the Ansco, and never had streaks.

I would guess maybe you need to rotate a bit more vigorous and alternate directions. If that doesn't help, maybe its due to the low volume?
 
OP
OP

steelneck

Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
173
Format
35mm
As i have reported earlier in this thread, i have used 8 weeks old _working solution_ and it has even been stored in half full bottles at room temp. Mr. "kompressor" wrote in this thread that he has developed almost 40 120 films under a period of 12 weeks in the same 1L working solution (page 5 in this thread).
 

hrst

Member
Joined
May 10, 2007
Messages
1,293
Location
Finland
Format
Multi Format
W T F.

Usually 6 WEEKS is promised for working solutions, rather than 6 hours.

I've, however, used working solutions as old as 2-3 months without any problems, and never heard of problems. Mixed developers are quite robust and the instructions about a few weeks are conservative to be on the safe side. Actually, color developers may even last more than a year quite well if stored properly...

How would continuous (replenishing) labs do it at all if it didn't last but just hours? That would cause huge replenishment rates.

As I stated earlier, I would never buy anything from this company. I can see more and more reasons arising for my decision.
 

dbla

Member
Joined
Aug 26, 2010
Messages
19
Format
4x5 Format
Okay sorry to join in so late, I am a little fuzzy on the actual capacity of this developer and the kits available in the US. I am about to embark on a project that will involve shooting hundreds of sheets of C41 and my local lab has just quit processing C41. So my question is, what is the sheet capacity that I can expect to see coming out of the 20-Roll kit? Assuming I am using the 3010 Expert Drum with 10 4x5 sheets loaded am I only going to get 2 runs? 4? Maybe I missed the class in school where they taught 120 roll - sheet film area equivalences but if you can fill me in i'd greatly appreciate it.

-a
 
OP
OP

steelneck

Member
Joined
Nov 16, 2009
Messages
173
Format
35mm
@dbla: One 4x5" sheet is 129 square cm. 120 film is around 80cm long, that is 6x80=480. So if the developer has a capacity of 20 rolls (20x480=9600) it would mean that you can develop over 70 sheets.
 

michaelbsc

Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Messages
2,103
Location
South Caroli
Format
Multi Format
Ok, someone help me figure out something. I have a phototherm rotary processor, and it is designed to do one shot processing. I can easily get two rolls of 120 or two rolls of 35mm in 250ml, but that seems like a real waste of the chemical capacity of the kit.

Is it possible to dilute? It seems to me that diluted developer will wreck the diffusion rates into the gelatin substrate.
 

kompressor

Member
Joined
Feb 8, 2008
Messages
192
Location
Norway
Format
Medium Format

Is there no way to recollect the chemicals after development?
 

michaelbsc

Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Messages
2,103
Location
South Caroli
Format
Multi Format
Collecting fixer is easy since the machine is designed to do that. The other chemicals dump to the waste port, making it harder to do. It may be easier to process by hand than trying to manipulate a hose on the drain.



Dilution rather than recovery is the answer for making it easy. But I think that's probably unworkable.



The machine's design criteria were for small volume but pro lab quality results. One shot use ensures the chems are always fresh. But in this case it works against the hobbyists.
 
Last edited by a moderator:

EdSawyer

Member
Joined
Sep 3, 2008
Messages
1,793
Format
Multi Format
If your phototherm is a Super Sidekick, you can configure any of the chemicals to be output to the "save" port, not just fix. I run C41 in mine, and save the bleach for re-use. The other stuff I use one-shot since it's fairly cheap (Esp. fixer) and not too hard to come by.

A full tank on the super sidekick uses 480ml I believe, and can do 4 rolls of 120 or 4 rolls of 35mm or probably at least 4 sheets (or more?) of 4x5 film. They make a holder for 4x5 though I am not sure if you can cram 8 sheets into it or just 4.

While it's cool that Rollei or whomever is making a c-41 hobby kit, the price-per-roll is cheaper with Kodak chemistry or the 5L Tetenal liquid kit. I can get 44+ rolls of 120 out of 5L of chemistry, using the dev, fix, and stab. as one-shot and saving the bleach for regeneration later.

-Ed
 

michaelbsc

Member
Joined
Dec 18, 2007
Messages
2,103
Location
South Caroli
Format
Multi Format
EdSawyer said:
If your phototherm is a Super Sidekick, you can configure any of the chemicals to be output to the "save" port, not just fix....
Click to expand...

It's an old FP-1, not an SSK. I do have an SSK carcass that I picked up from a Photo Express when it closed down. They weren't using it for a few years, but I'm working to bring it back to life. I think everything on it works, actually. I just have to go through everything and get it put together properly.
 

epatsellis

Member
Joined
Jan 1, 2006
Messages
928
Format
Multi Format
One of the things I love about my Wing-Lynch Pro 6, you can configure any (or all) solutions to reclaim with some simple plumbing. I run both C41 and b&w through mine, recovering bleach and b&w fix. The tanks hold close to 5 liters as well.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Menu
Log in
Register
Cookies are required to use this site. You must accept them to continue using the site. Learn more…