Retina IIIs Tele-Xenar 135mm f/4 - Help??

Hello,

I'm not an active member in the RF forum. However I'm hoping some of you nice folks will help me identify and approximate the current market value of a lens I found while going through my photo gear.

This is a Retina IIIs mount, I think, because it has the rangefinder coupler. It has the satin chrome focus/aperture base with the black barrel and the writing on the side of the upper barrel. The serial number indicates a manufacturing date of 1968 and it does not have the "Retina" designation... so maybe this is for one of the later Instamatic Reflex models? It has the original screw-on hood and fitted case. The lens seems to be in mint condition without any marks at all (finish as new) and the coated glass is absolutely perfect. The focus is smooth as silk throughout its range and the aperture works perfectly. The case shows minor wear. I can't post pics because it's dark now but, it if will help, I'll post pics Wednesday.

Thank you in advance!!

Mike

Check what the close focus distance is. I believe that most were about 11 feet or so, making it a bit impractical for family photos.

Also, the design is a Tessar derivative, rather than based on the Carl Zeiss Sonnar, which most other lens makers copied. Add in the fact that it was a bit slow at f/4.0. By 1968, many lens makers were shifting to f/2.8 Sonnar derivatives.

Lenses for the Retina IIIS were interchangeable with the Retina Reflex S, III and IV, as well as the Retina Instamatic model. I think the 200mm lens for the Reflex cameras won't work with the Retina IIIS.

Sorry this was so lengthy. Value is always difficult to estimate, but I would guess it to be $50-$75, give or take $25.

Yes, minimum focus distance is just a hair under 4 meters (the feet aren't marked that close).

So I don't have a valuable little gem I can sell for a small fortune... a bit disappointing... but I do appreciate the information.

I have one of these (and another broken one) which I use on my Retina Reflexx III. It's a nice lens (other than for close focusing) but I would agree with the value already stated based on what I paid for mine.


Steve.

I agree with what elekm said...

They are very common and most (unless they've been dropped or severely abused) do look and work like mint little jewels.
A reflection of their build quality...

Unfortunately not worth much if sold.

yes, I have one too for use on my 111S, but never use it. Trying to compose within just the small centre area of the viewfinder is not great. My 111S normally has a 28mm on it. The 135mm is common on Ebay and I agree with the price estimation - might even be a bit on the high side.

If its '68 its certainly a very late lens. the 111S was '59-60 only

mr rusty said:

If its '68 its certainly a very late lens. the 111S was '59-60 only

Click to expand...

The black & silver ones are "rarer", though I auctioned one once and it didn't get significantly more than the more usual all-silver ones.
In any case, the majority of the production was for the reflexes. A relatively small number of IIIS' were built.
IIRC, 1968 was when the line ended with the Reflex IV (and Instamatic?).

I've used this lens in the past and have found it to be a nice lens. However, the 11-foot minimum focus distance is discouraging. I've often wondered why Schneider, a respected lens maker, didn't redesign this to give it a shorter minimum focus distance.

elekm said:

I've used this lens in the past and have found it to be a nice lens. However, the 11-foot minimum focus distance is discouraging. I've often wondered why Schneider, a respected lens maker, didn't redesign this to give it a shorter minimum focus distance.

Click to expand...

It was a limitation inherent in the lens mount, nothing to do with Schneider...
Rodenstock (and Voigtländer and others) made lenses for that and similar mounts with the same focusing limitation.

The small diameter behind-the-lens Compur shutter used in the interchangeable lens Retinas (and Bessamatics and a number of other German cameras of the time), set some narrow constraints on the size of the rear element(s) (hence, lens speed) and closest focusing distance, without vignetting becoming unbearable.

The 200mm lenses made for that (those - identical except for some tiny flanges put in to make each "unique") mounts focused to 8 metres and the 350mm (IIRC) focused to about 30 meters!

Probably modern internal focusing lens designs could get around that problem, but adopting that lens mount then contributed greatly to sinking a large part of the German photo industry.
(By the time Voigtländer had designed a focal plane shutter SLR, it had already gone bankrupt. Rollei picked up the pieces and mostly made a mess of the design...)

Thanks everyone. Reading through each post, one mentioning the black barrel being worth a tad more, does a $95 "asking price" sound fair? I guess that gives me a few dollars negotiating room.

Can anyone suggest websites that will provide enough detail so I don't sound like a complete idiot in describing this lens and what cameras it works with? I need a site designed for idiots, BTW.