Retina IIIc - Question about the semi-circle

ggray79 · Apr 25, 2022

Sunny day. 52mm orange filter on step up rings from 29.5mm. f8/125. Silberra S25 in Rodinal for 8 minutes.

Can anyone tell me what the semi-circle is on the first shot and how to avoid it? I know it is not scanning dust because it appeared on another picture as well (not attached here) in a different spot. In both of those shots, the sun was directly overhead.

The filter and step up rings form a bit of a hood, but not a large one. Do you think it just a hood issue?

Thanks!

madNbad · Apr 25, 2022

It may be the reflection of the front of the lens. The filter is fairly large and with the step up ring may have put it just far enough away from the lens to catch a reflection.

Hawkeye · Apr 25, 2022

I can’t diagnose the issue. But it is a wonderful image! Where was it taken?

Nicholas Lindan · Apr 25, 2022

Looks like a drying drip - the negative got splashed with something that mostly dribbled off to the right. The semicircle is the outline of the original drop.

But, it being 'Silbera' it could be a "manufacturing enhancement" (can't say "defect", that's just not PC).

reddesert · Apr 26, 2022

I agree with Nicholas that it looks like a drying mark and not like lens flare.

The common response at Photrio to diagnose problems is to ask for a picture of the negative itself (held up against a light source, like a white screen) in addition to a scan. In particular one question is whether the light lines extending to the right go beyond the edge of the frame.

AgX · Apr 26, 2022

My very first though at looking a the photo was "drying mark", and still is.

ggray79 · Apr 26, 2022

Hawkeye said:
I can’t diagnose the issue. But it is a wonderful image! Where was it taken?

The causeway between Corpus Christi, Texas, and Mustang Island.

ggray79 · Apr 26, 2022

Nicholas Lindan said:
Looks like a drying drip - the negative got splashed with something that mostly dribbled off to the right. The semicircle is the outline of the original drop.

But, it being 'Silbera' it could be a "manufacturing enhancement" (can't say "defect", that's just not PC).

I used a Paterson squeegee and the flaw is very similar to another shot on the same roll, #32 below, where the sun was fairly low, behind me and to the right. This is my first roll of Silberra S25. As new as I am to developing I haven't seen this or any other drying issues (other than removable dust) on any other rolls of various types of non-Silberra film. This would seem to point to a film manufacturing issue or the reflection. Not on any of the other 30 or so shots on this roll, though. Thanks.

ggray79 · Apr 26, 2022

reddesert said:
I agree with Nicholas that it looks like a drying mark and not like lens flare.

The common response at Photrio to diagnose problems is to ask for a picture of the negative itself (held up against a light source, like a white screen) in addition to a scan. In particular one question is whether the light lines extending to the right go beyond the edge of the frame.

The lines do not go beyond the edge of the frame. I taped the negative to a white computer screen but my old Iphone6 just doesn't show the flaw, which can barely be seen with the naked eye. My digital SLR cameras do not focus close enough. How do capture the negative picture - better phone camera?!

ggray79 · Apr 26, 2022

madNbad said:
It may be the reflection of the front of the lens. The filter is fairly large and with the step up ring may have put it just far enough away from the lens to catch a reflection.

The filter and the step up rings are all black, but I guess it could reflect. Shot #32 that I added to a reply below has the same flaw. The sun was low, behind me and to the right, though, which should have helped on any reflection problem. I have a Kodak Series VI adapter ring and filter. It extends almost exactly the same distance from the lens, so I don't think that would do any better for a filter reflection issue. Thanks.

AgX · Apr 26, 2022

I am using a plain laptop, but even there I can see to the right of your "semi-circle" that circle being closed and stretching further in two long, parallel lines. The whole thing looking like a sketch of a matchstick.

I cannot imagine how this could be an exposure.

I can neither explain it as coating defect.

For a drying mark it looks extremely regular, but still this is my explanation.

Further information could be gained from microscopic examination.

ggray79 · Apr 26, 2022

AgX said:
I am using a plain laptop, but even there I can see to the right of your "semi-circle" that circle being closed and stretching further in two long, parallel lines. The whole thing looking like a sketch of a matchstick.

I cannot imagine how this could be an exposure.

I can neither explain it as coating defect.

For a drying mark it looks extremely regular, but still this is my explanation.

Further information could be gained from microscopic examination.

I looked at this scanned image on a much larger screen and I see the lines. So I think your explanation is correct. I used the Ilford wetting agent as the last step before the squeegee and hanging. Without the squeegee I probably would have had one circle at the final, because those lines are so straight it makes me think they are left by the squeegee. Just for the record, is there any way this would have cleared itself up had I not used a squeegee? Thanks.

removedacct1 · Apr 26, 2022

This is a drying mark on the film, from a drop of wetting agent. You may have squeegeed your film, but its pretty obvious this is a water drying mark, so....

gone · Apr 26, 2022

Could be a drying mark, but I've never seen one so round, those are usually irregular. Could be a reflection too. Sun in the frame? Didn't see that in that pic, but I can't tell where the sun is in it.

Are you hanging the film to dry? Seems unlikely that a drying mark would leave such a large, almost perfectly roundish drying mark if it was hung to dry.

MattKing · Apr 26, 2022

My general advice is: never used a squeegee.
If, however, you are knowledgeable and experienced and you have a very good squeegee and maintain it carefully there are some situations where it is okay to use them.
You may be using too much wetting agent, or you may need to use distilled water with the wetting agent, because the result of using wetting agent should be that the fluid sheets off when you hang the film to dry.

pbromaghin · Apr 26, 2022

MattKing said:
My general advice is: never used a squeegee.
If, however, you are knowledgeable and experienced and you have a very good squeegee and maintain it carefully there are some situations where it is okay to use them.
You may be using too much wetting agent, or you may need to use distilled water with the wetting agent, because the result of using wetting agent should be that the fluid sheets off when you hang the film to dry.

With distilled water final rinse there should be nothing to leave behind, so do you really need a wetting agent?

BrianShaw · Apr 26, 2022

I use city sink water and photo-flow (diluted per instructions or a bit less), hang immediately, and dab off the drips at the hanger and film tail. No spots.

MattKing · Apr 26, 2022

pbromaghin said:
With distilled water final rinse there should be nothing to leave behind, so do you really need a wetting agent?

It is still out in the air, with any dust that might be there.
And without a surfactant added, the distilled water is more likely to bead up than sheet off, leading to the possibility of uneven drying.

__Brian · Apr 29, 2022

It's not just a circle- looking carefully it starts off as a circle and turns into a pair of lines extending out towards the edge of the frame. It looks like the squeegie dragged liquid off to the bottom of the strip, and then the edges dried.

My best guess without holding the negatives. I would think looking at the negative at an angle will reveal details.

hashtagquack · Apr 29, 2022

Agree that its a water drying mark. If you're lucky its on the film side and can still be wiped off. If not then its on the emulsion side and as far as I know there's not much that can be done about it. Usually happens if you let a drop sit on the film as it dries.

gone · Apr 29, 2022

I experienced drying issues for the first time when I moved from Florida to Arizona. This dry air caused me a lot of issues until I fixed it. You may not need to do all of this, but it's working.

Use a coffee filter to filter any powdered chemicals, and use distilled water on the final rinse (w/ a very small amount of wetting agent). Run the shower w/ the door closed until the humidity has fogged the mirror, then pop in quickly to hang the negs. When they're about 2/3 dry, open the door.

That's about it. Small variations to this scheme gave me issues. The squeegee is a bad idea but the negs do come out of the tank dripping wet. So I take the end of the strip when it comes out of the final rinse and flick the excess water off.

pbromaghin · Apr 29, 2022

MattKing said:
It is still out in the air, with any dust that might be there.
And without a surfactant added, the distilled water is more likely to bead up than sheet off, leading to the possibility of uneven drying.

Thank you, makes sense.

ggray79 · Apr 30, 2022

BrianShaw said:
I use city sink water and photo-flow (diluted per instructions or a bit less), hang immediately, and dab off the drips at the hanger and film tail. No spots.

momus said:
Could be a drying mark, but I've never seen one so round, those are usually irregular. Could be a reflection too. Sun in the frame? Didn't see that in that pic, but I can't tell where the sun is in it.

Are you hanging the film to dry? Seems unlikely that a drying mark would leave such a large, almost perfectly roundish drying mark if it was hung to dry.

I am hanging the film immediately after the squeegee. Several posts here have convinced me that the problem above is caused by the squeegee, so it is history!

ggray79 · Apr 30, 2022

BrianShaw said:
I use city sink water and photo-flow (diluted per instructions or a bit less), hang immediately, and dab off the drips at the hanger and film tail. No spots.

Forgive me if I am double-replying, but I don't see my earlier attempt. What do you use to dab drips? Some here have suggested a chamois or a special sponge. If you have a favorite please id the type, brand, etc. Thanks!

BrianShaw · Apr 30, 2022

ggray79 said:
Forgive me if I am double-replying, but I don't see my earlier attempt. What do you use to dab drips? Some here have suggested a chamois or a special sponge. If you have a favorite please id the type, brand, etc. Thanks!

Just a little bit or paper towel

Retina IIIc - Question about the semi-circle

ggray79

Attachments

madNbad

Hawkeye

Nicholas Lindan

Advertiser

reddesert

AgX

ggray79

ggray79

Attachments

ggray79

ggray79

AgX

ggray79

removedacct1

gone

MattKing

Moderator

pbromaghin

BrianShaw

MattKing

Moderator

__Brian

hashtagquack

gone

pbromaghin

ggray79

ggray79

BrianShaw

Retina IIIc - Question about the semi-circle

Attachments

Advertiser

Attachments

Moderator

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency