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Resources for Understanding Film Curves?

applesanity

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After reading the thread about how (there was a url link here which no longer exists) - and reading many other threads - I'm finding a serious gap in my knowledge of film photography - understanding film curves and what they mean with regards to understanding how it behaves, whether exposed normally, pushed or pulled, or how to develop it. Words like "dmax," "toe," "s-curve," are all Greek to me.

You see, this stuff wasn't taught to me when I learned photography. I asked the professors if they knew the stuff - of course they did - but having been out of everyday use and discussion for so long, memories and tricks get rusty.

I shoot Plus-X in 120 format with a #8 yellow filter, rate at EI 125, and develop in Rodinal 1+25 for 6 minutes, 15 seconds at 20 degrees Celsius with 2 slow inversions every 30 seconds. I reached this formula through trial and error. I assume that if I were to understand all those charts and graphs on the PX125 technical specifications, I'd be wasting less film and shooting more. Would there be a way to predict how my prints would look if I rated Plus-X at EI 64?



I'm not asking for a member to write me a complete rundown of understanding film curves (although that would be appreciated!), but maybe point me towards some recommended websites or books. Thanks.

Film in photography is becoming the Damascus steel of swordsmithing, or swordsmithing in general. I pursue it as a hobby but I get the feeling that my opportunities and options for learning have become severely restricted in relation to photographers as late as a decade ago.
 
Thank you AgX

John Powers
 
Great question applesanity, great resource AgX.
 
Thanks for posting this question applesanity. Having read the same thread about modern film and had some similar questions, great to know I'm not the only one scratching my head!!

AgX: Thanks for the link - my printer's whirring away as I type!

Cheers,

Jim.
 
AgX

EXCELLENT !

Get a pencil, ruler, and a pad of paper ! For non-analylical intuitives like me, drawing it until the lights go on is pretty helpful.

ALSO, The New Zone System Manual by Minor White, Richard Zakia, and Peter Lorenz.

Zakia's section is great short course of how each step in the photographic process works, and HOW they go together. It is INTENDED for photographers !

from his bio at Focal Press

"Richard D. Zakia, Ed.D., Professor Emeritus at Rochester Institute of Technology, has taught in many areas of photography including graphic design and multimedia design. During his 34 years at R.I.T., Dr. Zakia served as the chair of the Fine Art Photography Department and Graduate Program in Imaging Arts, and for a six-year period was a photographic engineer in development and research at Kodak. He is the recipient of the Eisenhart Outstanding Teaching Award and the author/co-author of 12 books on photography, including The Focal Encyclopedia of Photography."
 
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I just want to add that the last time I looked at that pdf there were some figures wrong.
I once posted a correction here at Apug, but can't find my posting...


I looked again at that pdf:

Appendix A, question 100:

The first and last results of the right table are wrong.
 
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Maybe if I say this quietly, folks won't panic.

If a photographer learns the stuff on the Kodak page AgX linked for us,
you'll understand what your film and process is doing, and you will be able to give your imagination the tools to make exactly the kind of pictures you want to make.

In the process, you will free yourself from all the legend and rubbish that is laying around the web parading as fact.

We didn't have to learn this stuff on our own in the old days, and whenever you can, you should sit down with old shooters and talk about your work. But without contact with pre-digital, pre-internet photographers, you are on your own, and this small amount of technology is really necessary for today's photographers.

.
 

Good book. Getting it in Europe will cost you about $50, unfortunately.

If you are ready for more, check out:

'Photographic Sensitometry' by Todd and Zakia
 
That book by Todd & Zakia is to my mind rather a book for a student photo engineering (a seemingly obsolete education).
 
A fine thing about Zakia is that he knows whether he is talking to photographers or engineers, and speaks accordingly. There is a difference between PLAYING a piano, or BUILDING one.
 
Todd and Zakia are extremely knowledgable on the subject - and it's been many years since I tried to read it. But I find that Eggleston does a great job with balancing the theory with the practice from a photographer's point of view.
 
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