Repairing Leica Summarit 50mm 1.5

Mozg31337 · Jul 27, 2017

Hello guys/girls,

A friend of mine has an old Leica Summarit 50mm 1.5 lens, which hasn't been used for ages. He is offering me to buy it at a good price. However, the front glass seems to be a little foggy with some light scratches / cleaning marks. I am wondering if it is possible to service the lens and remove/clean/polish the fog or simply replace the front element of the lens? Is it even possible doable? If so, what kind of price am I looking to pay for it and what is the best service place in UK?

Many thanks Thanks

Marcelo Paniagua · Jul 27, 2017

Normally, a lens CLA is around $100-150. Probably less, depend on work to be done and technician. Some months ago, I had 2 Summitars and one rigid Summicron with diaphragm blade either loose or scrambled. Technician quote $240 to fix the 3 of them, along with a proper CLA (lens cleaning, focus relube, etc.)

Fog can be removed by yourself (done so for a collapsible Summicron, Elmar 90, etc.), but I will recommend you send it to a technician unless you are confident on your handyman skills. I've screwed a few lenses myself so talking on experience myself.

By the way, the technician I'm talking about is Youxin Ye, but there are others (like DAG) that will handled that with no problem.

Best regards

Marcelo

Mozg31337 · Jul 27, 2017

thanks. Do you know if they would be able to polish scratches on the from element, or will it remove the coating layer and pretty much destroy the front element?

Marcelo Paniagua · Jul 27, 2017

Not sure about that. Is it really that scratched? Small cleaning marks will no affect the performance (probably will lower contrast and will create some flare).

Regards.

Marcelo

John Koehrer · Jul 27, 2017

Most technicians won't be able to remove scratches in the glass. Some haze too.

summicron1 · Jul 27, 2017

try shooting with it first. It may surprise you -- a little haze, and even a few scratches, really have no impact.

shutterfinger · Jul 27, 2017

Take the edge of a fingernail and drag it across the "scratch". If you can detect it with your fingernail then it may cause flare in some lighting situations, if you cannot feel it but can see it then it won't have any effect on the image. Light scratches on the rear element will likely not cause any deterioration in the image where a scratch that you can feel will.

In the early days of photography chips in the lens were covered with India ink or flat black paint to prevent flare.

Tape a single hair over a lens front so that only the hair is over the lens element. Go make a series of photos in various light then process the film and examine it under high magnification. I doubt you will be able to tell where the hair is except for very bright scenes.

Lens polishing is expensive and will remove the coatings.

Ko.Fe. · Jul 27, 2017

This lens is from era then Leitz used glass which is described as chalk soft. Trying to clean it and not taking it as the factor will ruin the lens.
Those are prone to fungus as well. It is useless to talk what could be done and what is impossible until properly taken images or video is provided. Google "lens, flash light test" and take images with mobile phone or video by the phone. Post it here, by quoting me, this will let me know what you have it.
I used to have lens like this. It was clean and clear, only one or two spots of fungus I have to kill.
Making new lens element for this lens is next to impossible. Where are some recoating services. One user at RFF recently reported to get it done for another Leitz lens in Japan.

Print from negative taken with this lens:

Scan of old Kodak 50D film negative taken with this lens:

I quit on this lens quick. Too heavy for me.

E. von Hoegh · Jul 28, 2017

Mozg31337 said:
Hello guys/girls,

A friend of mine has an old Leica Summarit 50mm 1.5 lens, which hasn't been used for ages. He is offering me to buy it at a good price. However, the front glass seems to be a little foggy with some light scratches / cleaning marks. I am wondering if it is possible to service the lens and remove/clean/polish the fog or simply replace the front element of the lens? Is it even possible doable? If so, what kind of price am I looking to pay for it and what is the best service place in UK?

Many thanks Thanks

If your lens is scratched badly enough, it will require repolishing and recoating which can be done but is not cheap. Minor scratches, a couple, will not have much effect especially if you use an efficient lens shade. A seemingly small amount of haze will have a far greater effect, few seem to realise this.
The Summarit is most definitely not a modern lens, I've had two of them, both in excellent condition. They're a bit soft at f:1.5, they get better at small apertures, but neither of mine ever got really sharp all over as a Summicron would be at all apertures, or a Summitar from f:4~ on. The Summarit is also prone to flare at large apertures. In my opinion, it's not a lens worth spending much money on unless you are a collector. I like my Summitar much better, the difference in speed is only 2/3 of a stop. Unfortunately good (unscratched) Summitars are hard to find, too.

monst · Jul 28, 2017

The Old Summarit f1.5 probably does not have a coating. I would try it out. Mine is a bit foggy but gives a wonderful glow when used at f1.5 but by f2.8 it really sharpens up nad changes into a very different lens, kinda 2 in 1.

Marcelo Paniagua · Jul 28, 2017

E. von Hoegh said:
If your lens is scratched badly enough, it will require repolishing and recoating which can be done but is not cheap. Minor scratches, a couple, will not have much effect especially if you use an efficient lens shade. A seemingly small amount of haze will have a far greater effect, few seem to realise this.
The Summarit is most definitely not a modern lens, I've had two of them, both in excellent condition. They're a bit soft at f:1.5, they get better at small apertures, but neither of mine ever got really sharp all over as a Summicron would be at all apertures, or a Summitar from f:4~ on. The Summarit is also prone to flare at large apertures. In my opinion, it's not a lens worth spending much money on unless you are a collector. I like my Summitar much better, the difference in speed is only 2/3 of a stop. Unfortunately good (unscratched) Summitars are hard to find, too.

Totally agree with you about not worth spending much money with this lens, unless, like you said, you are a collector. Summitar, Summicron, Elmar 3.5 give much better result than this lens. Its not a bad lens, far from it, but its not a great or special lens, at least for me (got one with clean lens and barrel). I think even Jupiter 8 could do better and its pretty cheap.

Best regards

Marcelo

E. von Hoegh · Jul 28, 2017

monst said:
The Old Summarit f1.5 probably does not have a coating. I would try it out. Mine is a bit foggy but gives a wonderful glow when used at f1.5 but by f2.8 it really sharpens up nad changes into a very different lens, kinda 2 in 1.

All Summarits are coated. Or they were when they left the factory...

E. von Hoegh · Jul 28, 2017

Marcelo Paniagua said:
Totally agree with you about not worth spending much money with this lens, unless, like you said, you are a collector. Summitar, Summicron, Elmar 3.5 give much better result than this lens. Its not a bad lens, far from it, but its not a great or special lens, at least for me (got one with clean lens and barrel). I think even Jupiter 8 could do better and its pretty cheap.

Best regards

Marcelo

Actually I've been pleasantly surprised with the results I get from a J-8, a '59 in Kiev mount. It's available in 39mm Leica threads, and so can be used on an M series with adapter. I should do a comparison between the J-8 and my Summitar; I have the SOOPD barn door hood for the Summitar and a Contax telescoping hood (mounts on the external bayonet of Kiev/Contax) with 3:2 rectangular mask for the J-8. Could be an interesting comparison, considering a clean J-8 in Kiev mount can be had for about $35.

Patrick Robert James · Jul 28, 2017

http://www.focalpointlens.com

Mozg31337 · Jul 28, 2017

Wow, thanks guys for all your replies and so much information! One of the reasons for looking at the Leica lens is that I have recently got myself a Leica IIIf body, surprisingly in pristine condition. I do have a few soviet Jupiter-8 lenses that came with Zorki3 1954, Fed2 and Zorki-4k. There are so many different types/makes of J8 and they tend to very a lot from size to look/feel and picture quality. The problem with the x-ussr production is the inconsistence in quality.

I wanted to get a nice and reasonably fast 50s-60s Leica lens on a budget (can't afford to spend 400+ pounds/euros on a lens). The opportunity came to get the 50mm 1.5 Summarit, but with a few issues. He did send me a few pictures, but they are not a good quality. attaching here. Your comments are very much welcome. However, if you are saying that Summarit 1.5 is not a great lens and not very sharp at wide f stop, perhaps I should look at a different one.

Could someone please suggest a Leica lens from 50s or 60s that I should look at? Thanks

Anton Lukoszevieze · Jul 28, 2017

The Summarit is a wonderful lens, i'd say it IS special. The 'flaws' that people comment on are something to be celebrated in how you photograph things. It can be sharp and soft, sounds great to me. I use one all the time and love it.

Marcelo Paniagua · Jul 28, 2017

Anton Lukoszevieze said:
The Summarit is a wonderful lens, i'd say it IS special. The 'flaws' that people comment on are something to be celebrated in how you photograph things. It can be sharp and soft, sounds great to me. I use one all the time and love it.

Agree. It got its own particular look if you ask me. What I refer as it not being special, I mean it as a regular, everyday use. For me it something along the lines the Summitar. Really particular Booke (which I love) but some people don't like it. IMHO is not what one would expect from a normal lens, but it doesn't necessarily mean you (or the OP) wont like it Example, I love the Elmar 3.5cm but lots of people insist its crap as a user lens (only usable as a collector item).

(there was a url link here which no longer exists) , how much are you paying for the lens? I don't think the lens condition would kept it from being usable under most conditions. Probably some flare and constrast issues but not much (again, IMHO).

Best regards

Marcelo

Marcelo Paniagua · Jul 28, 2017

Patrick Robert James said:
http://www.focalpointlens.com

Good resource. Will look into it.

Thanks for sharing.

Marcelo Paniagua

E. von Hoegh · Jul 28, 2017

Mozg31337 said:
Wow, thanks guys for all your replies and so much information! One of the reasons for looking at the Leica lens is that I have recently got myself a Leica IIIf body, surprisingly in pristine condition. I do have a few soviet Jupiter-8 lenses that came with Zorki3 1954, Fed2 and Zorki-4k. There are so many different types/makes of J8 and they tend to very a lot from size to look/feel and picture quality. The problem with the x-ussr production is the inconsistence in quality.

I wanted to get a nice and reasonably fast 50s-60s Leica lens on a budget (can't afford to spend 400+ pounds/euros on a lens). The opportunity came to get the 50mm 1.5 Summarit, but with a few issues. He did send me a few pictures, but they are not a good quality. attaching here. Your comments are very much welcome. However, if you are saying that Summarit 1.5 is not a great lens and not very sharp at wide f stop, perhaps I should look at a different one.

Could someone please suggest a Leica lens from 50s or 60s that I should look at? Thanks

Is your IIIf running properly? No pinholes in the curtains, all speeds good, no capping or fading at higher speeds, slow speeds good? If the Summarit is priced right, it may be your best option. None of the Leitz lenses are cheap, except in relative terms. You could look into 50mm Elmars, both f:3.5 and f:2.8 versions. They are collapsible and make a pocketable camera, also have no 'special effects" at max. aperture. Summitars are also collapsible, but many have marks and scratches.

Mozg31337 · Jul 31, 2017

Well, the camera, from the looks and sounds, is pretty good. I have managed to find one in pristine condition. The shutter tend to work okay judging by the sound. Leica's shutter is just so pleasant to hear ))) Very different from the Zorki 3, especially at fast speeds.

Yeah, it seems to hard to find a relatively cheep Leica lenses, but I will keep on trying. I have Jupiter-3 on its way to me, which I've ordered a few weeks ago and should be a nice lens too, but not as good as the original which it has been copied from.

BrianVS · Sep 3, 2017

The Summarit is optimzed for F2.8 used close-up, and for F1.5 at infinity. The focal length of the 6 that I examined were 51.1mm, scribed internally.

Dead Link Removed

I suspect this was the designers way of dealing with focus shift, figured the lens would be used stopped down at close range. These days- close-up/wide-open is used more often.

ANYWAY! Don't let a few cleaning marks dissuade you from using the lens, just use a hood. Tiffen #611 adapter ring to use Series VI filters and hoods... Ebay search for them, easier to find than original 41mm filters.

I modified both of my Summarits for use close-up and wide-open. I used a shim from a J-8 to move the rear group towards the image plane. This increases focal length and optimizes focus for wide-open work. The Summarit will normally front-focus when used wide-open and close-up. This means the optics need to be moved closer to the formed image. The Somewhere between 0.08mm and 0.15mm does the trick.

I used focalpoint to recoat a Hot Glass Summicron- perfect now was like wax paper when received.

BrianVS · Sep 4, 2017

Example with the modified Summarit-

At F1.5,

Wide-Open, F1.5 by fiftyonepointsix, on Flickr

At F2:

Summarit, F2

The rear section is moved 0.08mm closer to the image plane using a shim placed between the glass and optical fixture.

Repairing Leica Summarit 50mm 1.5

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