Recommendations for my first light meter

RalphLambrecht

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I own about six metrs but only use and recommend the Gossen Lunastar F.You should be able to get a good 2nd hand for about $200. I does ambient,flash or a mixture in reflection or incident mode and has A&S priorities.needs a 9V block battery;also reads in EV, which is handy.
 

HiHoSilver

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I wish people would read before giving suggestions. The OP needs a flash meter so the SBC, while I think it is the greatest meter ever, is out.

You're right Patrick. I missed it.
 

TheFlyingCamera

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I have a couple of suggestions for options. A Sekonic 408 for a general-purpose meter - it has a 5-degree spot, if you insist on taking reflected readings with flash, and it can do both incident and reflected for flash and ambient light. When in sync'ed mode, it will automatically compensate for ambient light. If you do it in cordless mode, it will read flash only. Note that I said cordless, not remote triggering. Unlike the later models, it does not have the ability to accept a PocketWizard wireless trigger module.

If you're really into spot metering, the Minolta Spotmeter F (NOT M) can do spot meter readings. It is a dedicated spot meter, though, and will only do reflected 1-degree spot meter readings, regardless of flash or ambient light reading.

A third option is the Sekonic 358. The 358 can do incident or reflected readings, and it can do spot meter readings with an accessory attachment. If you are doing a lot of studio lighting, or even using off-camera flash units, the ability to accept a PocketWizard remote triggering module is extremely handy. Then you don't have to be dragging a sync cord around across the studio or through someone's parking lot or yard or wherever you happen to be shooting.

I have all three of these meters (I have a pair of 408s because they're such good workhorses I would hate to be caught with it broken without a backup). In the past I've had a Sekonic 308, and I never had the problem of metering my face when I meant to meter my subject, in part because I listened to instructions when I bought the meter, and in part because I almost always used it as an incident meter, so the display panel was facing "the right way" when taking a reading.
 

craigclu

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(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

An old posting of mine regarding the Sekonic L-718 that I have grown to prefer for my duties. That posting has a pdf attached of the Quick Guide for the meter. I also have the ground glass attachment but can't say I really trust that accessory yet but it's been very good in all other duties.
 

Sirius Glass

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michaelorr said:
Sirius, i have Extra Class from the 80's. Haven't been on the air for some time, though. Hoping to jump back on.
Click to expand...

I have the Extra Class since way back in '15.
 

michaelorr

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'15 was a very good year! even for vinting in northern california.
I hate to point out what is probably obvious, but i also like my ham radio-ing like photographing - i don't do digital. So, mostly i am a CW kind of guy with good old fashioned crystal filters. But, all-analog in radio-ing is becoming harder than staying analog in photo-ing.
 

Sirius Glass

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Same thing. I am not interested in tying a radio to the internet et al. I am only interested in rf. I use the 2 meter band when I go offroading with a San Diego group.
 

Theo Sulphate

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Light meters, cameras, radios... I believe people bond with objects at a certain important point in their life development and the technology that happened to exist at that time is very special to them. Technology outside that time isn't special. There are exceptions, of course.

So we all love film cameras here, obviously.

It's interesting reading the comments above. I became interested in electronics in the 1960's, during the time tubes (valves) dominated radio equipment and the transition to solid state was just beginning. So, for me, the radios that I have the most passion for are the so-called hybrid rigs of the early 1970's (solid state plus tube finals); this would be like the Kenwood TS-520 (which I have) or the Yaesu FT-101. Significantly, it is *not* the Swans or the Drakes - the all-tube rigs, *nor* the all-solid-state rigs from the 1980's to today. To tune on a new band, I have to do the dip and peak dance with the plate controls - today people just push a button, if that. I enjoy it.

Likewise, to me the magic of radio is hearing a faraway voice or CW signal amidst the noise and varying atmospheric conditions. A coworker ham friend 10 years younger than me, a EE, loves digital modes like PSK-whatever. I wouldn't dream of connecting a radio and a computer because to me *they don't belong together in my world*. I don't care that fancy DSP processing can pull a -200dB signal out of the noise and display the QSO text on your monitor. That's not radio in my world.

We now return to your regularly scheduled programme...
 

paul ron

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Sirius Glass said:
I have the Extra Class since way back in '15.
Click to expand...

i like those spiral cut ham radios... mmmm that smoky flavor!

i got my ticket when i was a boy scout in the mid 60s. my neighbor was an operator n got me hooked n helped me take the test. i wish i still had a bug to play with. does anyone use code anymore?
 

Poisson Du Jour

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If you by now know your way around meters, whether flash~ or incident/spot, step up: get a Sekonic L758D: Av or Tv priority, corded or cordless flash analysis, incident, spot/multispot, 180° rotation of invercone...and you are unlikely to need any other meter.
 
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canvassy

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Thank you for the great suggestions, more than a few I wasn't aware of. I've got a great big watchlist on ebay and I'll keep scouring craigslist, and let everyone know what I finally pick up when I'm able to.
 
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canvassy

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Just wanted to update everyone with my purchase. It took me a while, I was researching the suggestions in the thread here and then watching for good deals.

I ended up picking up a Sekonic L-358 for $170 locally here. It looks like it's very lightly used and came with the box and instruction manuals, which I'll be reading tonight.

Thanks for the suggestions everyone, really appreciate it
 

RalphLambrecht

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macfred said:
Good and attractive - simple to operate: Gossen Sixtomat flash for reflected, incident and continues light http://www.gossen-photo.de/pdf/ba_sixtoflash_gb.pdf
Click to expand...
I 2nd that recommendation and like to add the Gossen Lunastar F.Get a simple meter for your first experience and not one of these'all-in-one jobs.They do a bit of everything but nothing well.A dedicated incident meter with flash capability is best
 

benjiboy

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The O.P specified he needed meter that could average out a mixture of flash and daylight the Lunasix 3 and F will measure daylight and flash but not at the same time and not indicate the proportion of each present, they are of a previous generation of meters than the current digital ones like the Gossen Digipro F and Sekonic L-358 that have this ability.
 

craigclu

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You'll like this meter. It is very intuitive with very little learning curve. If you're new to incident (I didn't go back and read the previous posts, so maybe you are), I predict you'll quickly develop a feel for it and learn to trust it and interpret the light with it.
 

paul ron

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seconic makes wonderful meters. just being curious i looked up my meter n found this....

Dead Link Removed

i expected a higher resale for it but this is a great price if you are buying.

get the manual at butkus... youll be very surprised at how sophisticated these meters are but yet so simple to use.


.
 

wiltw

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canvassy said:
There's one in our local craigslist for $60 that I've been eyeing. It looks like it has everything I'd need, except it doesn't seem to have an analyze function and that might be handy to have.
Click to expand...

Are you referring to the flash percentage contribution? About the percentage ambient:flash computation capabilities of a meter...

• Percentage computations are ambiguous, because it tells you NOT how the ambient vs. the flash falls on the face. For example, assuming ambient is twice as strong as flash...
• ambient could fall on TWO sides of the face, whereas flash falls on ONE side of the face. And in that situation, the ambient illuminated side gets 2 parts ambient + 1 part flash, so the two sides actually have 3:1 contrast, NOT the 2:1 that you assume from judging light source intensity!!!
• ambient could fall on ONE side of the face, whereas flash falls on the other side of the face (e.g. sun on one side, deep shade on the other, and the flash from the side illuminates only the shaded side of the page. And in that situation, the ambient illuminated side gets 2 parts ambient + 1 part flash, so the two sides actually have 2:1 contrast, which is what you assume from judging light source intensity!!!​
...but while the source intensity is 2:1 in both scenarios, in one situation the subject lighting is 3:1, yet the other subject lighting is 2:1. Such are the flaws of stating lighting in terms of numrical value: source intensity does not at all factor in HOW the light falls on the scene!

So I decided to make an experiment to see what Percentage Contribution does in a meaningful way, and how it helps in setup so that I achieve a certain 'look' in my photo in a portraiture situation. I used a Minolta Autometer Vf to meter things, ambient was window light (right) and flash was very heavily reduced Dynalite M500 (500 w/s) powering a heavily filtered 1020 flashhead.
(Important TEACHING POINT: this added filtering for intensity reduction was necessary in order to drop flash intensity at 7' source distance by another -5EV to achieve f/4 reading, even after choosing only minimum setting of 30 w-s of power output from the power pack. YES, there is indeed such a thing as too strong of a studio flash! Buyer be aware!)

Five shots at ISO 1600:
  1. Ambient only: 1/160 f/3.2
  2. Flash 25% +ambient 75%: 1/25 f/5
  3. Flash 50% + ambiemt 50%: 1/40 f/4.5
  4. Flash 75% + ambient 25%: 1/60 f/4
  5. Flash 100% + ambient 0%: 1/160 f/4
Now look at the actual photos, (exhibiting 25% increments of changing percentage)...


...and ask yourself:
  • A Sekonic meter reads flash contribution at 10% increments (unlike my Minolta meter's 25% 'limited' increments), does it even MATTER how finely it shows the percentage?!
  • Can I really even see a 25% incremental difference to visually recognize even a 25% change in flash contribution?
  • Does knowing a PERCENTAGE value help me at all, compared to simply visually assessing how pleasing the contribution balance is?
  • If my flash is full frontal (rather than off to the left a bit, like in my examples) what -- if anything -- does having a contribution balance do, from the standpoint of source 'intensity' (vs. the issue of color balance from mixed WB sources)?

For my own purposes, this experiment showed me that although I have a flashmeter with percentage contribution feature, I have missed nothing at all in NEVER USING that feature. My prior Minolta Autometer IVf had a brightness difference feature, my Autometer Vf has the analyze function...for me the analyze function provides no advantage over the Autometer IVf.

• A Percentage analysis, for me, is valueless. I simply vary flash intensity to alter the amount of fill to what I want to achieve as a visible appearance, I can ask for flash to Equal the sun (1:1) with 0EV FEL Be weaker than the sun by 0.5EV (using FEL -0.5EV) to achieve low subject lighting contrast Be weaker than the sun by -1.0EV, (by using FEL -1EV) to achieve moderate subject lighting contrast Be weaker than the sun by -1.5EV, (by using FEL -1.5EV) to achieve somewhat contrast subject lighting contrast

• I know that my result on film was that flash intensity at -1EV (relative to ambient) gave me more contrast than I wanted, and -0.33EV flash intensity gave me not enough contrast (shot illumination would be too 'supplemental illumination' appearance for me -- in spite of some others' opinions about 30% being 'about right') My SOP is that I strive for a -0.5EV or -0.66EV flash output difference (depending upon equipment, as some have 1/2EV control and others have 1/3EV control). And be done with it...No meter percentage needed, no chimping needed (even when possible, shooting digital), not anything more elaborate or time consuming than a simple -0.5EV flash setting!​
 
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benjiboy

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Many members have completely misunderstood the O.P.'S requirements he doesn't just want a ambient and flash light meter,but a much more sophisticated modern digital one that in one reading will indicate the proportion of both types of light present like the Sekonic L- 358 will.
 
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canvassy

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I honestly wasn't sure of the features that I would need or that would be useful, this is my first light meter. I just knew that I needed to measure both ambient light and flash/strobes. I was originally leaning towards the Minolta's like the Auto Meter V, but I decided to go with the Sekonic L-358 because it can measure multiple flashes, has aperture priority, and some analyze functions. The pocketwizard feature is a plus, too, but not a necessity. I do like that the meter is a little more modern and seems a little easier to use than the Minoltas, just based on the reading that I've been doing. It seemed like the best meter for my budget, and I'm hoping to use it for many years.
 

wiltw

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The Minoltas are relatively simple to operate. They were the 'standard' during the 1990s, but then the company decided to withdraw from the meter business about 2004 or so. So yes, the Sekonics may be a bit more 'up to date' but in the 1980s and 1990s they had a poor second place to Minolta meters.

The typical modern photographer has no idea about the Minolta meter and just about all talk these days is oriented around the Sekonic name. A used Minolta meter has become harder to find, and more dearer in price, as a result.

The brand was purchased and the Minolta Automater Vf and the Minolta Flashmeter VIf are both sold currently under the Kenko brand name. Kenko accessories can be used on Minolta Autometer IVf and Vf and Flashmeter Vf and VIf meters.
 

Diapositivo

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Konica-Minolta sold the entire light-meter barn to Kenko and the entire camera-lenses barn to Sony. (They remain in the business for colorimetres and other instruments that are not strictly photographic).

Modern Kenko lightmeter are the continuation-evolution of the Minolta ones, and Sony cameras and lenses are, I suppose, just the continuation of that glorious line of production. Sony had a camera business before acquiring Konica-Minolta's camera business, but they only produced compact cameras and sensors, as far as I know.

So Minolta lightmeters, and cameras and lenses, are still on the market, only with another name on them. From a strictly industrial perspective, Minolta never ceased existing, because it's the entire block (production, engineering) that was sold to Sony (or to Kenko). It was a transfer of a firm's branch.

Minolta lives! Long live Minolta!
 

carioca

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I second the above post, I use a Kenko lightmeter that offers incident and spot metering (ambient and strobe) and I'm quite happy with it.
It can do the average value strobe measurements the OP asked about.
http://bit.ly/1UGZwNt

Sidney
 

rpavich

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I have a Sekonic L308s and an L358 and like them both, I can't figure out why folks make such big deals out of little details (like turning the L308 around the right direction)

The L308 is a fine meter that's just as accurate as an L358.
 
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