Recommendation for CLA

Mainecoonmaniac · Feb 6, 2013

Dear APUGers,

I've had my Zeiss Ikonta IV CLA'd by Essex Camera Repair a couple of years ago. I've sent it back once because the shutter jammed and it was under warranty. Now it jammed again. Both times I've shot in the cold. Don't know if it's related. I'm trying to find a new repair facility. I've been emailing Bald Mountain and the person doesn't respond quickly. Also he hasn't responded to my last email. I don't sense enthusiasm here. Can someone recommend a good repair facility that will repair the shutter on my old gem?

henry finley · Feb 6, 2013

Nobody can guarantee something like that. All they can do is all they can do. It probably had issues when it was brand new and got exacerbated by pure age. I can't make my 1968 Camaro run perfect when I first start it, because that is the nature of a carbeurator. Your camera is bound to jam when it's cold, no matter what. That's just a hard truth about a 60-some-odd year old camera, and no repairman can make it new again. All they can do is repair it, fire it 200 times to make sure it's right, and send it out the door.

Sirius Glass · Feb 6, 2013

Contact Mike at Samys Camera in Los Angeles California

Los Angeles Store & Rentals

431 S. Fairfax Ave.
Los Angeles, CA 90036

Telephone: 323-938-2420
Fax: 323-937-2919 | E-Mail: lacamera@samys.com

Hours:
Mon-Fri: 9:30am-6:30pm; Sat: 10:00am-6:00pm; Sun: 11:00am-5:00pm
(Film & Rental Departments) Mon-Fri: 8:00am-6:30pm; Sat: 9:00am-6:00pm; Sun: 11:00am-5:00pm

bdial · Feb 6, 2013

I've had work done by Zack's in Providence R.I. In particular, he did a spectacular job on my Kodak Retina.

henry finley · Feb 6, 2013

Well, there's a couple references. Like the OP says--try somebody else. This issue illustrates in my mind why I do my own camera repair. A cold-natured camera can't be made to jam when the repairman tries to get it to jam, so he can see what jammed and fix it. It's always the way--when you're TRYING to get a mechanical problem to show its tail end, it won't. This is one of those hard-case repairs, for sure. So I fix them myself when the problem finally does show its rear end. GL, friend.

papagene · Feb 6, 2013

bdial said:
I've had work done by Zack's in Providence R.I. In particular, he did a spectacular job on my Kodak Retina.

+1 on Zack's

rbender · Feb 6, 2013

I have used this guy, he does good work.
http://www.certo6.com

Loren Sattler · Feb 6, 2013

About four years ago I inherited a prewar Zeiss Ikonta 6 x 9 in beautiful condition except the shutter was frozen from sitting in a drawer for probably 50 or more years. I sent it to Midwest Camera Repair in Wyandotte, MI:http://www.midwestcamera.com They did a nice job CLA the shutter mechanism for about $100. I hardly use the camera, but it works perfectly (used only in mild weather conditions.) I have used them successfully for other repairs over the years.

nsurit · Feb 6, 2013

certo6.com also gets my vote, although he is the only for this type of fixing I've used. Been happy and didn't need to find another. Bill Barber

Jeff L · Feb 6, 2013

There's also Mark Hansen, Zeiss Ikon Repair in Portland OR.
He worked on my Super Ikonta. Good communication and a good job.

http://www.zeissikonrolleirepair.com/index.html

E. von Hoegh · Feb 7, 2013

henry finley said:
Nobody can guarantee something like that. All they can do is all they can do. It probably had issues when it was brand new and got exacerbated by pure age. I can't make my 1968 Camaro run perfect when I first start it, because that is the nature of a carbeurator. Your camera is bound to jam when it's cold, no matter what. That's just a hard truth about a 60-some-odd year old camera, and no repairman can make it new again. All they can do is repair it, fire it 200 times to make sure it's right, and send it out the door.

The Ikonta has a Compur shutter. I have three 50+ year old Compurs on my Linhof outfit, three more Compounds with old Dagors mounted in them - the newest is 1925 or so, the oldest about 1908. Rolleiflex Standard, Compur, 70+ years old. Other cameras with mechanical shutters, Nikons 40-45 years old, all have been serviced with appropriate cold weather oil (supposedly good to -75f). All are utterly reliable in subzero f. temperatures.

Why do mine work reliably and the OP's do not??

Mainecoonmaniac · Feb 7, 2013

Thanks for the recommendation!

Jeff L said:
There's also Mark Hansen, Zeiss Ikon Repair in Portland OR.
He worked on my Super Ikonta. Good communication and a good job.

http://www.zeissikonrolleirepair.com/index.html

I sent him an email.

Mainecoonmaniac · Feb 7, 2013

I don't know

E. von Hoegh said:
The Ikonta has a Compur shutter. I have three 50+ year old Compurs on my Linhof outfit, three more Compounds with old Dagors mounted in them - the newest is 1925 or so, the oldest about 1908. Rolleiflex Standard, Compur, 70+ years old. Other cameras with mechanical shutters, Nikons 40-45 years old, all have been serviced with appropriate cold weather oil (supposedly good to -75f). All are utterly reliable in subzero f. temperatures.

Why do mine work reliably and the OP's do not??

Shall I request cold weather oil for the rebuild?

henry finley · Feb 7, 2013

E. von Hoegh said:
The Ikonta has a Compur shutter. I have three 50+ year old Compurs on my Linhof outfit, three more Compounds with old Dagors mounted in them - the newest is 1925 or so, the oldest about 1908. Rolleiflex Standard, Compur, 70+ years old. Other cameras with mechanical shutters, Nikons 40-45 years old, all have been serviced with appropriate cold weather oil (supposedly good to -75f). All are utterly reliable in subzero f. temperatures.

Why do mine work reliably and the OP's do not??

Because I am thinking in terms of those "tough-dog" repairs, to coin a phrase from the old TV repair days. Those cases when you go back again and again on a service call to keep repairing the same thing, being the DAMAGE that the original problem keeps creating. The set works fine a while, and then whoosh! the same resistor is sitting there burnt to a crisp again.
Where in God's name is the problem?-- the problem that keeps causing the damage that keeps getting repaired. Now to get away from the TV repair analogy, sometimes the hardest thing in fixing something is to get the blasted thing to have the problem while you're there to repair it. So many times the dadgum problem WON'T SHOW UP, when you've got it up on the workbench. And this cold-weather bug just had that smell. But then, I'm one of those poor slobs who is cursed with the ability to repair everything. There's nothing I can't fix expertly. I would trade that ability in a New York minute for the ability to chase women.

E. von Hoegh · Feb 7, 2013

henry finley said:
Because I am thinking in terms of those "tough-dog" repairs, to coin a phrase from the old TV repair days. Those cases when you go back again and again on a service call to keep repairing the same thing, being the DAMAGE that the original problem keeps creating. The set works fine a while, and then whoosh! the same resistor is sitting there burnt to a crisp again.
Where in God's name is the problem?-- the problem that keeps causing the damage that keeps getting repaired. Now to get away from the TV repair analogy, sometimes the hardest thing in fixing something is to get the blasted thing to have the problem while you're there to repair it. So many times the dadgum problem WON'T SHOW UP, when you've got it up on the workbench. And this cold-weather bug just had that smell. But then, I'm one of those poor slobs who is cursed with the ability to repair everything. There's nothing I can't fix expertly. I would trade that ability in a New York minute for the ability to chase women.

Freezers with subzero temperatures are not only extant, but common. It's how I check my stuff, minus 18 to 22f is where my little chest freezer runs. Just put the item in a ziploc baggie. One of the first things I learned was to find the problem, not to put a bandaid on the symptom, whether it's an engine, a TV, a watch... well, you know what I mean.

E. von Hoegh · Feb 7, 2013

Mainecoonmaniac said:
Shall I request cold weather oil for the rebuild?

Yes, if they have it. At least, give them an idea what temperatures it will be subject to. Most any oils will be good in fairly low temperatures, it's when old oils/greases are left in the mechanism that coldweather problems crop up.

I'm thinking that a really thorough CLA where all the old gunk is removed will solve your problem.

henry finley · Feb 7, 2013

Thanks. I was only loosely quoting out of a HW Sams book called "Tough-Dog TV Repairs". I'm like you--find the ORIGINAL problem, IF you can get it to show itself while you've got it up on the bench. I had a Pentax ES with a cold-weather problem. Imagine a camera that's not worth $20 on EBAY could become such a strict teacher on problems that hide from the repairman. I could put that camera in the freezer all day, and it would not jam after my repair. Leave it sitting on the table, and it worked. Come back next morning after the wood stove had died out, and darned if it didn't jam again. Tough-dog repairs.

E. von Hoegh · Feb 7, 2013

henry finley said:
Thanks. I was only loosely quoting out of a HW Sams book called "Tough-Dog TV Repairs". I'm like you--find the ORIGINAL problem, IF you can get it to show itself while you've got it up on the bench. I had a Pentax ES with a cold-weather problem. Imagine a camera that's not worth $20 on EBAY could become such a strict teacher on problems that hide from the repairman. I could put that camera in the freezer all day, and it would not jam after my repair. Leave it sitting on the table, and it worked. Come back next morning after the wood stove had died out, and darned if it didn't jam again. Tough-dog repairs.

Good ol' Howard W. I can remember tricks like putting a tomato paste can over a tube to make it heat up faster and maybe show an intermittent problem. Blasting things (not tubes!) with the freon dusters would sometimes show intermittents, too.

I had a Zenith console with a maddening problem in the convergence circuits, the bottom convergence would change intermittently between good and way off, I traced it to a coil on the convergence board...after about 5 hours.

henry finley · Feb 7, 2013

I know I'm pulling this off-topic so I'll keep it brief. Here lately I've become quite the service man on these high-end studio quality tape recorders. Tuning those suckers up is a long process. But I keep at it and at it, till it's back to factory specs. And boy do they play sweet. I'll tell you what--that Adobe Audition lets you generate all sorts of waveforms. I run the signal through an intermediate recorder when I need an attenuator. And use my 100mghz Tek 2335 and a lot of math to get my high-freq. voltages, because I can't afford a nice Fluke multimeter that'l handle 100,000 hz accurately. This cheap Radio Shack multimeter is off 6% on that frequency. Not good enough. I want PERFECT. Too bad you can't make money doing this.

Mustafa Umut Sarac · Feb 7, 2013

Send it to a repairman in Alaska or north Canada , They are the experts , If you want to send south pole people , its summer there now

Sirius Glass · Feb 7, 2013

Mainecoonmaniac said:
Shall I request cold weather oil for the rebuild?

That would be a good idea if you expect to use it in cold weather. I have had cameras CLAed for cold weather and those cameras never gave me problems in hot weather.

Mainecoonmaniac · Feb 7, 2013

Thanks for the tip. I used the camera in the cold that's only 20 degrees F. It's freezing but not much below. I love the camera, but it hates the cold. I used it in hot and humid South East Asia with no issues.

henry finley · Feb 8, 2013

E. von Hoegh said:
Good ol' Howard W. I can remember tricks like putting a tomato paste can over a tube to make it heat up faster and maybe show an intermittent problem. Blasting things (not tubes!) with the freon dusters would sometimes show intermittents, too.

I had a Zenith console with a maddening problem in the convergence circuits, the bottom convergence would change intermittently between good and way off, I traced it to a coil on the convergence board...after about 5 hours.

Mr von Hoegh, if only you weren't all the way up in New York. I'd give you my Sams collection and my Riders.I've got 2 copies of almost every Sams from 1946 to 1970, and a COMPLETE set of Riders, just sitting under the house wrapped in plastic. I need to get it out of here so I can sell the place, but utterly refuse to throw them out. And I'm not going to drag all that stuff out to photograph it for EBAY. Neither one of us can afford freight for 12 or 1500 miles like that. It would take at least 3 skids.

Argenticien · Feb 8, 2013

I don't know if you've heard back from Mark Hansen and sent the camera in, but if not (so you're still in decision mode), I'd say +1 for him as well. I had a really problematic Compur shutter (on a 75-year-old Bessa) on which he got the timed speeds to purr nicely. (He could not get B & T working, but I don't care much; setting the thing up on a tripod kind of defeats the purpose of a pocketable folder.)

Normally I would've highly recommended for you to continue with Essex; word I've read over on photo.net is that tragically their business was wiped out by Hurricane Sandy. This is a huge loss to them and their staff who are without their livelihood (to state the obvious, front-line loss) and of course a huge loss to those of us camera nuts who counted on them (to state the selfish view).

--Dave

Mainecoonmaniac · Feb 8, 2013

I've heard from Mark and he's month's behind. As with Essex, I really don't know if I want to give them a try because they've repaired the shutter twice. It could be just my shutter. I'm currently sitting on the fence.

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